Originally posted by pym-ftwIts the fact that hes breaking them apart with his bare hands(and feet).
I could replicate that cover,Did those robots have any feats other than being called clunkers
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/JSAStrangeAdventures0115.jpg
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/JSAStrangeAdventures0116.jpg
Heres hes deadlocked in arm wrestling with alan pratt, who has superhuman strength.
Grants one of those fully human characters whos physical abilities defy logic. Durability, Strength....both seemingly enhanced.
Originally posted by namorsubby
Lets clear up some of these lies.
Bruce figured out it was Wildcat DURING the fight. Yes, bruce is the smarter, more skilled of the two.....world's greatest detective, duh.It was a stalemate, not a loss. Bruce hit him with everything he had in the end and Ted was knocked down(he knocked bruce down first and drew first blood) but completely fine. No KO, he didn't really even seemed fazed. He said "aww man, it really is you" all nonchalantly. Tough SOB.
This second one is just a complete lie. They were fighting because joker was going to kill a puppy that contained antibodies that would save some infected people. They were both going all out. Read the dialogue. Bruce was knocked down first. They both went down in the end because theyre spiked gloves were infected with fever germs.
"You almost tore my head off with that one" -Batman(in response to Ted decking him)
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BraveBold118-14.jpg
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BraveBold118-15.jpg
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BraveBold118-16.jpgTed has two stalemates(one in his favor, one in bruces), a technical win, and a loss against Batman. Pretty impressive. Definitely not someone who would simply "get their ass kicked by matt". Id take Ted slim majority.
Don't try to BS me about Wildcat. I made his respect thread.
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=495763
Lies??
So you said Batman was hard pressed to deal with Ted in the cage fight. I respond by saying he wasn't because bat's was holding back. Batman for most of the first few pages was trying to talk to Ted who was simply ignoring what he said. As soon as Batman decided to actually try he put's Ted down in only a blow or two and breaks the mask. How exactly was Bruce hard pressed, because he was trying to not hurt an ally while that Ally was TRYING to take him down and was still unable to. In what dictionary would such a thing qualify as a stalemate. Doesn't change the fact that Ted even said during those scenes that IF you were batman I wouldn't be able to match you so easily ( words to that effect)
Stalemate doesn't mean - " you can match me when your trying hard and I'm trying to reason"
it means - A position counting as a draw, in which a player is not in check but cannot move except into check -deadlock - impasse -
As for the second one even with my dim memories of a story I read as a young teenager ( almost 30 years ago) it appears all I forgot was the way Joker blackmailed tehm. It was a virus not bombs. During the fight ( which I just pulled my copy of) Joker even says "stop faking it, mix it up, I want to see action".
The only truly good showings Ted has that involve Batman are
1. In All Star Comics where he fights commissioner Bruce Gordon and it states on panel that they both know it's a fight Bruce cannot win. Of course e-2 batman was nowhere near as skillful as his E-1 counterpart.
2. In another team up between the two ( and IIRC this was teh E-12 wildcat pre COIE - he had appearances in e-1 tails without a planet hop) Bruce was down in Mexico and comes across a brain washed Ted Grant who went down to help find a former boxing buddy who was missing. Ted had no memory of his life what sovere and Bruce commented when he saw him fight how good he was just in instinct.
I notice you threw no rebuttal to my comments on the other feats your trying to shove at people.
Ted Tagging Jay was such a great feat ( not) Jay was possessed by the King of souls and fighting it. he was trying to wrest control and BEGGED Ted to knock him out while he had some limited Control
Ted Taking down the Injsutice society in JSA headquaters was purely plot driven.
A) it wasa group of C lister that Johny Sorrow had put together as a distraction so he could get what he was after.
B) Ted beat them purely by his better knowledge of JSA headquarters. He got them to split up, hit one with his motor bike, knocked another down a shaft ( again with Bike) lead another into a fortified area of JSA and let the lasers etc do the Job. There was context to another one or two that I can't recall. Finally he goads a guy who can ply and shoot blasts to come down and fight him like a man and he does. A flying energy blaster decides to mix it up close quarter with a costumed hero who's know to be a good fighter. Yeah that was soooooo f456n smart.
Could that be because you can't discredit them as easily with out of context garbage.
So you wrote the respect thread. Woop dee. A respect thread with out of context scans that actually leaves out a lot of Ted's truly skillful ones. I didn't see the scans of the fights he had with the rooms full of fighters who had teh skills of the worlds best professional fighters downloaded into them.
The scans of him battling rooms full of armed Goons ( the mission with Catwoman) where these guys were on a mission to prove themselves as professional operatives after massive training.
No what we see instead is him cleaning out a bar full of nobodies ( ignoring the later scans of the same issue where four of those nobodies clean his clock in the alley outside the bar after a blindsiding. and other feats that ignore the lower part of the whole show.
You wrote one respect thread. I wrote 80 to 90% of five wiki's that exist for Wildcat. Plus the same number of wiki's for most of the other JSA team members.
You also used the Grundy feat. form JSA Classifies. No mention of the fact that it was a low end grundy ( teh version showed around then would have struggled to be at Luke cage level, grundy's power levels fluctuate immensely. Hell even Hourman who is around the 5 to 10 ton strength level smacked him around). All he did was get him mad with a few blows so Grundy charged him and then diverted his charge with a basic throw that used Grundy's own momentum to put him into a wall.
Ted Knows/ has mastered 5 martial arts. Krav Maga, Muay Thai, Hapkaido, Capoeira, and boxing. Matt is a master of Ninjitsu which amalgamates 20. matt has many more feats of defeating skilled opponents above the level of those that Ted has even faced. Iron Fist, Captain America (cough PIS), Kingpin, Bullseye, Electra and more. Ted hasn't even fought anyone on this level (except batman and we've just covered them). Matt has aslo put down Namor with a nerve strike, defended against the Avengers and delayed them, and more. Ted is purely out matched in this battle pure and simple.
Originally posted by beatboks
Lies??So you said Batman was hard pressed to deal with Ted in the cage fight. I respond by saying he wasn't because bat's was holding back. Batman for most of the first few pages was trying to talk to Ted who was simply ignoring what he said. As soon as Batman decided to actually try he put's Ted down in only a blow or two and breaks the mask. How exactly was Bruce hard pressed, because he was trying to not hurt an ally while that Ally was TRYING to take him down and was still unable to. In what dictionary would such a thing qualify as a stalemate. Doesn't change the fact that Ted even said during those scenes that IF you were batman I wouldn't be able to match you so easily ( words to that effect)
Stalemate doesn't mean - " you can match me when your trying hard and I'm trying to reason"
it means - A position counting as a draw, in which a player is not in check but cannot move except into check -deadlock - impasse -
As for the second one even with my dim memories of a story I read as a young teenager ( almost 30 years ago) it appears all I forgot was the way Joker blackmailed tehm. It was a virus not bombs. During the fight ( which I just pulled my copy of) Joker even says "stop faking it, mix it up, I want to see action".
The only truly good showings Ted has that involve Batman are
1. In All Star Comics where he fights commissioner Bruce Gordon and it states on panel that they both know it's a fight Bruce cannot win. Of course e-2 batman was nowhere near as skillful as his E-1 counterpart.2. In another team up between the two ( and IIRC this was teh E-12 wildcat pre COIE - he had appearances in e-1 tails without a planet hop) Bruce was down in Mexico and comes across a brain washed Ted Grant who went down to help find a former boxing buddy who was missing. Ted had no memory of his life what sovere and Bruce commented when he saw him fight how good he was just in instinct.
I notice you threw no rebuttal to my comments on the other feats your trying to shove at people.
Ted Tagging Jay was such a great feat ( not) Jay was possessed by the King of souls and fighting it. he was trying to wrest control and BEGGED Ted to knock him out while he had some limited Control
Ted Taking down the Injsutice society in JSA headquaters was purely plot driven.
A) it wasa group of C lister that Johny Sorrow had put together as a distraction so he could get what he was after.
B) Ted beat them purely by his better knowledge of JSA headquarters. He got them to split up, hit one with his motor bike, knocked another down a shaft ( again with Bike) lead another into a fortified area of JSA and let the lasers etc do the Job. There was context to another one or two that I can't recall. Finally he goads a guy who can ply and shoot blasts to come down and fight him like a man and he does. A flying energy blaster decides to mix it up close quarter with a costumed hero who's know to be a good fighter. Yeah that was soooooo f456n smart.Could that be because you can't discredit them as easily with out of context garbage.
So you wrote the respect thread. Woop dee. A respect thread with out of context scans that actually leaves out a lot of Ted's truly skillful ones. I didn't see the scans of the fights he had with the rooms full of fighters who had teh skills of the worlds best professional fighters downloaded into them.
The scans of him battling rooms full of armed Goons ( the mission with Catwoman) where these guys were on a mission to prove themselves as professional operatives after massive training.
No what we see instead is him cleaning out a bar full of nobodies ( ignoring the later scans of the same issue where four of those nobodies clean his clock in the alley outside the bar after a blindsiding. and other feats that ignore the lower part of the whole show.
You wrote one respect thread. I wrote 80 to 90% of five wiki's that exist for Wildcat. Plus the same number of wiki's for most of the other JSA team members.
You also used the Grundy feat. form JSA Classifies. No mention of the fact that it was a low end grundy ( teh version showed around then would have struggled to be at Luke cage level, grundy's power levels fluctuate immensely. Hell even Hourman who is around the 5 to 10 ton strength level smacked him around). All he did was get him mad with a few blows so Grundy charged him and then diverted his charge with a basic throw that used Grundy's own momentum to put him into a wall.
Ted Knows/ has mastered 5 martial arts. Krav Maga, Muay Thai, Hapkaido, Capoeira, and boxing. Matt is a master of Ninjitsu which amalgamates 20. matt has many more feats of defeating skilled opponents above the level of those that Ted has even faced. Iron Fist, Captain America (cough PIS), Kingpin, Bullseye, Electra and more. Ted hasn't even fought anyone on this level (except batman and we've just covered them). Matt has aslo put down Namor with a nerve strike, defended against the Avengers and delayed them, and more. Ted is purely out matched in this battle pure and simple.
Bruce didnt win that fight dummy. It was inconclusive. Neither was incapacitated. Commonly referred to as stalemates in comic circles, duh. Bruce only knew he was ted for a portion of that fight. And he said if you were batman I wouldnt be working you over.
You simply lied about the 2nd fight. Ted had the edge. And joker was talking to them both not just bruce.
I do have those scans idiot. Read the thread.
That grundy was just fightin alan scott the issue before. Stop pretrending to know what you are talking about n get educated.
Anyone who has a good record against bruce is not outmatched by darefevil. Plain n simple. You are deluded and a fake know it all.
I'm the dummy, but your the one telling me exactly what I said in another way and then telling me I'm wrong. I have not said anywhere that Bruce won anything. I have just refuted your fraudulent claim that Bruce had a hard time with him. Bruce wasn't actually fighting, he was trying to reason with him. if you seriously think that not being able to even beat someone when your going hard and they are holding back constitutes a stalemate than I think we can see exactly who has the deficient IQ in this. It's just a shame that Ted doesn't it's why he's lost to Catwoman three times and when was the last time she beat the Bat ????
as for the second one tour own quoted statement is proof that Bats wasn't taking it as seriously as Ted, because he was surprised and Ted saying so and Ted justified himself to him. the grundy of that era got trounced by Courtney Whitmore and Hourman hardly the normal high end brute we're used to. Alan always jobs to grundy or there would be no point in their battles. I don't need scans I have the issues, just about everything with the JSA since the Sanand all but 9 GA issues.
Originally posted by namorsubby
Bruce didnt win that fight dummy. It was inconclusive. Neither was incapacitated. Commonly referred to as stalemates in comic circles, duh. Bruce only knew he was ted for a portion of that fight. And he said if you were batman I wouldnt be working you over.You simply lied about the 2nd fight. Ted had the edge. And joker was talking to them both not just bruce.
I do have those scans idiot. Read the thread.
That grundy was just fightin alan scott the issue before. Stop pretrending to know what you are talking about n get educated.
Anyone who has a good record against bruce is not outmatched by darefevil. Plain n simple. You are deluded and a fake know it all.
And no need for a personal attack, you keep using fodder and shaddy fights with a lot of context left out as feats
I think you need to educate yourself on forum edict...
Hes simply being misleading and completely fabricating other details in his posts.
Bruce only knew it was wildcat for a portion of the fight. Theres a difference between evasion and holding back. He certainly wasnt holding back with that last punch and Ted took that just fine. What you guys fail to comprehend is that this sort of fight actually is in bruces favor. He has more extensive ma training dealing with circumstances like being blinded. Also, this is not Grants only fight with him. Hes had good showings and an overall good record vs him. Certainly not someone who DD will just work over. Not by any stretch of the imagination.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Dang Ted lost to Catwoman three times? Scans anyone?
More BS from him no doubt.
What exactly am I being misleading about.
The fight starts out ( and mind you I'm going solely from memory here) with Ted making a connected with a punch and a kick as did Bruce. Then we have a page or two of Bruce dodging everything Ted Through at him.
Then we have Bruce getting ted In an arm hold saying something like I'm certain now your last moves confirmed it your wildcat.
As the continue to fight ( Bruce dodging most) Ted says something along the lines that if you were batman I wouldn't be taking you this easy.
Then Bruce telegraphs his next blow by saying this next one takes off your mask, Ted still can't dodge it and it does.
Then we have Ted apologizing,that it was you while they make their way closer to the edge of the cage still pretending to fight whilst also trying to remove bat's mask.
Finally one of Bruce grabs the ring master and they are out taking on everyone else together.
What exactly about my statement is incorrect ( and please no out of context scans scans like I saw ages ago on your respect thread - the full page please not single panels that make it look like he did so much better than he did)
The only other two times that WC has actually fought Batman were the Joker incident in which they KO'd each other at the same time and Bat's only used boxing not his MA. In fct Bat's was still talking from the mat so he wasn't put down as hard as WC. And the statements of both Joker and batman confirm as I've already said that he was not fighting at his best. he said to WC about it almost taking his head off ( your own admission) and WC ( again IIRC) then states can't risk holding back or something like that. Bruce was obviously surprised by that.
The only other one was All Star comics and it was E-2 commissioner Wayne
Please point out a single point in this that I'm fabricating and supply the FULL prof there of.
I've been reading ac collecting JSA comics for almost 40 years so I think I know exactly what I'm talking about.
I could just as easily show WC getting take down by run of the ill thugs in All Star 70 and Huntress had to come to his and SSK's rescue.
The time he was put in a coma by IIRC Thorn of all people
and may other take downs by much lower level characters than Matt would ever suffer to bear.
Page 13, 14, and 15 of that said issue for the TRUE context.
Originally posted by beatboks
What exactly am I being misleading about.
The fight starts out ( and mind you I'm going solely from memory here) with Ted making a connected with a punch and a kick as did Bruce. Then we have a page or two of Bruce dodging everything Ted Through at him.
Then we have Bruce getting ted In an arm hold saying something like I'm certain now your last moves confirmed it your wildcat.
As the continue to fight ( Bruce dodging most) Ted says something along the lines that if you were batman I wouldn't be taking you this easy.
Then Bruce telegraphs his next blow by saying this next one takes off your mask, Ted still can't dodge it and it does.
Then we have Ted apologizing,that it was you while they make their way closer to the edge of the cage still pretending to fight whilst also trying to remove bat's mask.
Finally one of Bruce grabs the ring master and they are out taking on everyone else together.What exactly about my statement is incorrect ( and please no out of context scans scans like I saw ages ago on your respect thread - the full page please not single panels that make it look like he did so much better than he did)
The only other two times that WC has actually fought Batman were the Joker incident in which they KO'd each other at the same time and Bat's only used boxing not his MA. In fct Bat's was still talking from the mat so he wasn't put down as hard as WC. And the statements of both Joker and batman confirm as I've already said that he was not fighting at his best. he said to WC about it almost taking his head off ( your own admission) and WC ( again IIRC) then states can't risk holding back or something like that. Bruce was obviously surprised by that.
The only other one was All Star comics and it was E-2 commissioner Wayne
Please point out a single point in this that I'm fabricating and supply the FULL prof there of.
I've been reading ac collecting JSA comics for almost 40 years so I think I know exactly what I'm talking about.
I could just as easily show WC getting take down by run of the ill thugs in All Star 70 and Huntress had to come to his and SSK's rescue.
The time he was put in a coma by IIRC Thorn of all people
and may other take downs by much lower level characters than Matt would ever suffer to bear.
Originally posted by namorsubby
from the Batman/Wildcat mini3.[b]WC fights Batman
with metal spikes gloves in a cage match. suprisely, this isn't their first fight involving metal spiked gloves. they both are stalemates. notice how WC takes a nasty hook from batman and basically shrugs it off.still standing and beginning to speak regularly afterwards:
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BatmanWildcat2pg22.jpg
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BatmanWildcat3pg01.jpg
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BatmanWildcat3pg02.jpg
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BatmanWildcat3pg03.jpg
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BatmanWildcat3pg04.jpg
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BatmanWildcat3pg06.jpg
http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/wilcat92/BatmanWildcat3pg07.jpg
[/B]
Heres the fight. Grant draws first blood with a punch. Bruces spears him into the cage and throws him down(obviously not holding back). Next page shows grant up again and kicking him in the chest. Then bruce dodges a punch while trying to get his mask off. Bruce dodges another punch and this is when he first realizes that its ted. He puts grant in a headlock, but he elbows him in the stomach, then kicks him in the face, knocking him to the ground. Bruce dodges one last punch and hits him with everything hes got, knocking him down and breaking his mask. Ted is next shown standing and speaking casually with bruce unfazed. Pretty good showing for Wildcat.
Bruce AND Ted were just fighting. Neither was strictly boxing. Bruce speared him, took him down, and used a headlock in that fight. Ted kicked him twice and used an elbow.
Theyve fought four times. And bruce was not talking on the mat in that fight where they both KOed each other. He was KOed. I just showed you the scans. The dialogue clearly states they were going all out at a point. Ted obviously had the edge because it was boxing and probably could of finished him but instead apologized for flooring him and let him stagger back up.
Citing low showings does nothing for your arguement. Everyone has them. Teds much too great of a pure h2h fighter for this fight to go anywhere near like what youre trying to make it seem like. All ted has to work with is hth. Hes achieved some pretty good feats with it as well.
Wildcat 6-7/10.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
I lol'd at that, too.
Antagonistic, much?.lol
Originally posted by namorsubby
Best fighters in ufc are primarily strikers.
Originally posted by pym-ftw
No Ufc fighter is only trained in one style, most strikers are either muay thai or some variation of kick boxing...
so, I don't have too much to contribute here, though, my uninformed opinion is that DD takes the majority (imho better fighter and he has dealt with Castle's damage soak in the past, and I'd put Pun against anyone in that category). Just wanted to point out, in modern UFC or MMA, everyone is a boxer. Modern kickboxing is boxing. Boxing developed that type of striking style so well that it would be like a fighter not knowing the basics of wrestling/grappling for them to not know boxing.
anyways, DD 8/10
