What difference do you feel that makes? Prior to that the LT undid what Warlock did with a gesture of his hands. That's called pwning.
During the IG storyline LT said he would not act because Thanos wasn't going against the natural order. That sounds to me like the LT never considered the IG to be a threat or did he ever once regard the IG with worry or concern. The very fact that he demonstrated the power over the IG speaks volumes to me.
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33Did you miss the comment about destroying reality had warlock not decided to hand over the gems?
What difference do you feel that makes? Prior to that the LT undid what Warlock did with a gesture of his hands. That's called pwning.During the IG storyline LT said he would not act because Thanos wasn't going against the natural order. That sounds to me like the LT never considered the IG to be a threat or did he ever once regard the IG with worry or concern. The very fact that he demonstrated the power over the IG speaks volumes to me.
No way he can oneshot him. Had he been able there would have been no need to even discuss it.
Originally posted by celestialdemonIt's speculation.
The Soul Gem never said why it was waiting for Rune since the beginning. If you recall, once all the gems were brought together, they had no problem activating.That's how the LT felt it's power in the first place.
My friend, the LT specifically stated that he could NOT act,
because Rune was from another Reality. (Multiverse)
Originally posted by celestialdemonThe only reason it was stated why the gem wanted Rune to go back to the Ultraverse
was so Rune could take revenge on his enemies.
I'm not gonna throw in a smilie cause I respect you as a true debating peer,
but, you gotta be chuckling with me on that one.
But seriously CD, that was the Soul Gem trying to trick Rune,
because the Soul Gem was just trying to haul ass out of the prime reality as fast as possible,
this is why when Rune tried to stay IN the prime Multiverse,
(instead of going on a revenge binge in his reality as you're suggesting)
the Soul Gem began struggling for control,
because the Soul Gem knew, if it did stay, not only would it had been defeated,
but more importantly, it's main objective would've been lost.
That objective, (destiny actually) was to form Nemesis.
Proof:
Rune wants to stay in the prime Multiverse:
Soul Gem let's it be known,
NOT Rune,
but it (Gem) is the one that wants to leave & enter another reality,
in fact, it (Gem) clearly states, that Rune is only transportation:
The Soul Gem could care less about Rune and his enemies.
Originally posted by celestialdemonWhich means what?
The last time Reed dealt with the IG in the Infinity War, the ban was removed.
Reed wasn't present when Eternity let the Watch know the ban went into effect again.
Heck, Black Bolt wasn't part of Infinity War in any sense of the word,
and he knew, so how did BB know, and not Reed,
Reed, who's mind was used by the Alien Entity prior (06'😉
to re-create the entire Marvel Universe from scratch?
If there's anyone who would know, it would be Reed. 🙂
This why when Bendis had Reed ask: "Says who"
and had Namor reply: "Exactly"
It was obviously imo, a way to let us (the readers) know,
that restriction (Starlin's) no longer applies to this story's OAA. (Bendis)
Originally posted by celestialdemonThe problem is SS didn't curbstomp Rune/IG.
SS shot Rune's hand off, and it fell into the Ultraverse.
Originally posted by celestialdemonIt also needs to be noted that this wasn't the typical "person possesses the IG" incident. The Soul Gem and Rune were actually struggling for control of Rune's body. Not necessarily the best way to utilize the gems.
Originally posted by celestialdemonAs for the restriction, if TOAA was to remove it, then he would have gone through the LT to do it, since that's how the restriction was implimented and removed the first time.
TOAA can simply write a story, and that's that.
I mean,
look how easy it was for TOAA to make a story where the LT's ruling is in-affective:
Yes, bring in Rune, he's from another Multiverse,
so the restriction doesn't apply to him,
and that's that like I said.
Originally posted by celestialdemonI agree it would be very boring.
That's why it doesn't make sense to have any omniscient characters,
especially the cosmic judge.
Originally posted by quanchi112If it were that easy
then the Lt would have just done it
and not waited for Warlock to willingly hand over the gems.
Originally posted by Mr MasterWarlock had just saved the universe and thought he was deserving of the IG.
LT gave him a chance to give up his power.
It doesn't mean he couldn't have taken it away one shot style.
In the past, he's given people chances to rectify problems before he takes action.
Originally posted by quanchi112You dont destroy reality when you can easily oneshot someone.
Now,
if the LT one shots Warlock,
it's quite conceivable that the surrounding reality will be destroyed as well,
so we can look at it both ways.
It may take one shot, or more,
but in both scenarios the reality around can be sundered
from the reverberations/feedback/spillage of energy/heck, the attack itself,
I can go on.
Still my point is, just because the LT said the D-of-M reality would be destroyed,
doesn't mean he's talking about a major battle,
it could just be from LT attacking Warlock. (which is a confrontation)
Ubers at this level don't have prolonged battles,
remember Thanos/IG vs Eternity?
One shot ftw.
LT vs Slorioth?
One shot ftw.
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33No, i'm using what we've seen on panel as a reference.
The LT was never concerned about the IG,
he demonstrated he had power over it.
Him not taking down Warlock when he had it was a choice.
He didn't say he couldn't do it, he simply chose not to.
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33Warlock had just saved the universe and thought he was deserving of the IG.
LT gave him a chance to give up his power.
It doesn't mean he couldn't have taken it away one shot style.
In the past, he's given people chances to rectify problems before he takes action.
Originally posted by Mr MasterI would assume that the Lt could if the un could but thats just my and your opinion.
My friend, the LT can destroy Reality in a one shot,
heck if the UN can, most definitely the LT can.Now,
if the LT one shots Warlock,
it's quite conceivable that the surrounding reality will be destroyed as well,
so we can look at it both ways.It may take one shot, or more,
but in both scenarios the reality around can be sundered
from the reverberations/feedback/spillage of energy/heck, the attack itself,
I can go on.Still my point is, just because the LT said the D-of-M reality would be destroyed,
doesn't mean he's talking about a major battle,
it could just be from LT attacking Warlock. (which is a confrontation)Ubers at this level don't have prolonged battles,
remember Thanos/IG vs Eternity?One shot ftw.
LT vs Slorioth?
One shot ftw.
The Lt easily undid what warlock did with the ig. Why does he have to destroy reality to take the ig from Warlock? Thanos didnt destroy reality when he defeated Eternity. We dont know how many shots it took because it was just a huge explosion and we couldnt see what was happening.
If the Lt wanted the gems why wouldnt he just take them?
Sayin he coul doneshot the ig is pure speculation.
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33Warlock contested his power and reality would have been destroyed had they got it on. Oneshotting the ig is pure speculation. I dont know how anyone could disagree.
No, i'm using what we've seen on panel as a reference. The LT was never concerned about the IG, he demonstrated he had power over it. Him not taking down Warlock when he had it was a choice. He didn't say he couldn't do it, he simply chose not to.
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33I dont think he could have while you think he could have. I agree that the Lt is more powerful,but not enough for a oneshot. None of our opinions are changing.
You're basing your arguement on that if LT wanted to take the IG away from Warlock reality would be destroyed?That proves nothing. That just proves that in the LT's opinion the collateral damage would've been too great. It doesn't prove he couldn't have one-shotted Warlock if he wanted to.
Originally posted by Mr Master
"Speculation?"My friend, the LT specifically stated that he could NOT act,
Reality. (Multiverse)
because Rune was from [b]another
Yet they were still in 616, so it doesn't matter who was trying to use the IG. It still worked.
Originally posted by Mr Master
"So, you believe the Soul Gem was waiting for Rune since the dawn of the Universe,
so Rune could get revenge on his enemies?I'm not gonna throw in a smilie cause I respect you as a true debating peer,
but, you gotta be chuckling with me on that one.But seriously CD, that was the Soul Gem trying to trick Rune,
because the Soul Gem was just trying to haul ass out of the prime reality as fast as possible,
this is why when Rune tried to stay IN the prime Multiverse,
(instead of going on a revenge binge in his reality as you're suggesting)
the Soul Gem began struggling for control,
because the Soul Gem knew, if it did stay, not only would it had been defeated,
but more importantly, it's main objective would've been lost.That objective, (destiny actually) was to form Nemesis.
Proof:
Rune wants to stay in the prime Multiverse:
Soul Gem let's it be known,
NOT Rune,
but it (Gem) is the one that wants to leave & enter another reality,
in fact, it (Gem) clearly states, that Rune is only transportation:The Soul Gem could care less about Rune and his enemies.
You misunderstood me. I don't believe that the Soul Gem waited for Rune so he could get revenge on his enemies. I know it's reason was to create Nemesis. The Soul Gem was using that reason just to entice Rune to go back into the Ultraverse.
My argument was the Soul Gem was not trying to go into the Ultraverse so that the IG would work, as you originally suggested. As we saw, it worked fine in 616.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Which means Reed knew who put the restrictions on the IG to begin with, (Infinity War)
so why would the smartest man in Marvel not be able to put 1 & 1 together?Heck, Black Bolt wasn't part of Infinity War in any sense of the word,
and he knew, so how did BB know, and not Reed,
Reed, who's mind was used by the Alien Entity prior (06'😉
to re-create the entire Marvel Universe from scratch?If there's anyone who would know, it would be Reed. 🙂
This why when Bendis had Reed ask: "Says who"
and had Namor reply: "Exactly"It was obviously imo, a way to let us (the readers) know,
that restriction (Starlin's) no longer applies to this story's OAA. (Bendis)
Which, like you said, is your opinion until Marvel clearly states on panel that the ban has been lifted. The Watcher made no mention of the ban being lifted, and he would know more than anyone else if that were the case.
If you go by on panel evidence, we have more proof showing the IG working despite the LT's ruling rather than it not working.
Originally posted by Mr Master
TOAA doesn't need to follow any protocol to do anything.TOAA can simply write a story, and that's that.
I mean,
look how easy it was for TOAA to make a story where the LT's ruling is in-affective:Yes, bring in Rune, he's from another Multiverse,
so the restriction doesn't apply to him,
and that's that like I said.
True, but for the sake of a debate on this forum, we go by evidence. On panel evidence doesn't show the LT ever removing the ban and also shows the IG working even when the LT mentioned the ban.
Until it is mentioned on panel, we can only speculate that it has been.
Originally posted by celestialdemonYet they were still in 616,
so it doesn't matter who was trying to use the IG. It still worked.
Did the LT not say that the wielder was from another Reality?
Did the LT not say he could not act because of this?
Originally posted by celestialdemonYou misunderstood me. I don't believe that the Soul Gem waited for Rune so he could get revenge on his enemies. I know it's reason was to create Nemesis. The Soul Gem was using that reason just to entice Rune to go back into the Ultraverse.
My argument was the Soul Gem was not trying to go into the Ultraverse
so that the IG would work,as you originally suggested. As we saw, it worked fine in 616.
I have never said that, I have never even alluded to that idea.
Be thorough true debater.
Originally posted by celestialdemonWhich, like you said,
is your opinion until Marvel clearly states on panel that the ban has been lifted.
The Watcher made no mention of the ban being lifted,
and he would know more than anyone else if that were the case.
If anyone would know, it would be Reed.
Beyond that, the ban was obviously lifted off panel, or retconned,
otherwise, how the heck did the Illuminati go against what TOAA ordered in Infinity War?
Originally posted by celestialdemonIf you go by on panel evidence,
we have more proof showing the IG working
despite the LT's ruling rather than it not working.[/B]
There's been two arcs for each:
Infinity War and the Infinity Crusade (restriction on the IG)
Rune arc, and Illuminati (restriction inconsequential)
Although there was a reason in the Rune case,
Illuminati has no real answer other than the choices I gave.
Originally posted by celestialdemonTrue, but for the sake of a debate on this forum, we go by evidence.
Originally posted by celestialdemonOn panel evidence doesn't show the LT ever removing the ban
and also shows the IG working even when the LT mentioned the ban.[/B]
I'm 100% confident,
that the ONLY reason Rune was able to re-unite the Gems,
was because he was from another Multiverse.
In fact, as I posted the proof already,
LT couldn't even attack Rune because of this,
he says it himself:
"The nature of the disturbance (Rune) is beyond this reality,
I must ask him for help"
Originally posted by celestialdemonUntil it is mentioned on panel, we can only speculate that it has been. [/B]
Illuminati primarily, because the Rune affair gave a reason.
Originally posted by Mr Master
So, you're going to ignore what the LT said? 🙁Did the LT not say that the wielder was from another Reality?
Did the LT not say he could not act because of this?
He said Rune was from another reality, but they were still in the 616. If his ruling over the IG was so absolute, then it wouldn't depend on the user.
Originally posted by Mr Master
You said in the earlier pages you know my debating style,
well, there's one thing I don't like and you should know this,
having my statements twisted.I have never said that, I have never even alluded to that idea.
Be thorough true debater.
It sure sounded like it when you earlier said this:
Originally posted by Mr Master
Yes.Rune is from another Multiverse,
apparently, the LT's judgement only catered to residents of the Prime Multiverse,
this is why the Soul Gem was dying to get out of the Prime Multiverse,
and return to Rune's.
If I misunderstood, I apologize. Just know that I was not trying to twist your words.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Again,
Reed's mind was used to create the entire Marvel Universe including the Watchers.If anyone would know, it would be Reed.
Beyond that, the ban was obviously lifted off panel, or retconned,
otherwise, how the heck did the Illuminati go against what TOAA ordered in Infinity War?
It could have been because with the IG on, Reed started to get the same God complex that every other IG user has had.
Originally posted by Mr Master
negative.There's been two arcs for each:
Infinity War and the Infinity Crusade (restriction on the IG)
Rune arc, and Illuminati (restriction inconsequential)
Although there was a reason in the Rune case,
Illuminati has no real answer other than the choices I gave.
In both the Infinity War and Crusade, the ban was only mentioned, never tested. Even in War, only 5 gems were brought together, not all 6. We don't know what would have happened then.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Nice, but you're still mentioning LT referencing the ban,
but you're ignoring LT giving a reason why it was possible.I'm 100% confident,
that the ONLY reason Rune was able to re-unite the Gems,
was because he was from another Multiverse.In fact, as I posted the proof already,
LT couldn't even attack Rune because of this,
he says it himself:"The nature of the disturbance (Rune) is beyond this reality,
I must ask him for help"
The LT couldn't interfere with Rune, because he has no authority over him. That's fine. However, Rune was trying to use IG, which is a 616 artifact. If the LT's power over the IG is absolute, then it shouldn't work with anyone, because the ban is on the IG itself, not the users.
