Thanos with The IG vs. the Classic Molecule Man

Originally posted by Enyalus
Oh. Well, then I may agree.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Though I don't know of a feat offhand from Marvel or DC that tops creating a universe which makes the Marvel Universe look like a drop of water in an ocean.

anyhow, happy halloween everyone! skellington

Happy Halloween, Goldielocks.

(Your avatar)

Originally posted by Enyalus
Happy Halloween, Goldielocks.

(Your avatar)

Enyalus, it's quite simple. If, for example, a character being billions of times more powerfull than the entire Marvel Universe would have been created, then he would be > that version of Beyonder, thus Beyonder not being supreme. Whether or not a character stronger than Beyonder has appeared in Marvel & DC is irrelevant.
The same goes for the Beyonder Universe being like an ocean in relation with the Marvel Multiverse being a drop of water. Another character could have been created that was powerfull enough to create a Universe to which the main Marvel Multiverse was like a molecule in relation with the Universe, or something of that sort.

Point is, if you can be surpassed, you are not supreme, no matter how hard you dominate the opposition. And Beyonder isn't the be all end all of comic characters in terms of power.

Now, moving on the thread at hand ..

Has Molecule Man ever displayed soul-control, or anything of the sort ?

Originally posted by Philosophía
Enyalus, it's quite simple. If, for example, a character being billions of times more powerfull than the entire Marvel Universe would have been created, then he would be > that version of Beyonder, thus Beyonder not being supreme. Whether or not a character stronger than Beyonder has appeared in Marvel & DC is irrelevant.
The same goes for the Beyonder Universe being like an ocean in relation with the Marvel Multiverse being a drop of water. Another character could have been created that was powerfull enough to create a Universe to which the main Marvel Multiverse was like a molecule in relation with the Universe, or something of that sort.

Point is, if you can be surpassed, you are not supreme, no matter how hard you dominate the opposition. And Beyonder isn't the be all end all of comic characters in terms of power.

Now, moving on the thread at hand ..

Has Molecule Man ever displayed soul-control, or anything of the sort ?

Originally posted by Philosophía
Enyalus, it's quite simple. If, for example, a character being billions of times more powerfull than the entire Marvel Universe would have been created, then he would be > that version of Beyonder, thus Beyonder not being supreme. Whether or not a character stronger than Beyonder has appeared in Marvel & DC is irrelevant.
The same goes for the Beyonder Universe being like an ocean in relation with the Marvel Multiverse being a drop of water. Another character could have been created that was powerfull enough to create a Universe to which the main Marvel Multiverse was like a molecule in relation with the Universe, or something of that sort.

Point is, if you can be surpassed, you are not supreme, no matter how hard you dominate the opposition.

...Well, yeah. Naturally. But you're arguing pure hypotheticals there. I mean, if a character were able to create an omniverse a hundred times larger than the DCU and destroy everything inside the DCU and in DCU's Heaven, that character would be > The Presence and thus The Presence wouldn't be the Supreme Being either.

But, it hasn't happened and won't, so there's no point in bringing it up.

Also, Mr. Master and I were saying not that Beyonder was the Supreme Being, but that he was a Supreme Being. Of the Beyondverse. Which is true.

*shrug*

Pure hypoteticalls ? No, I'm arguing on panel proof. When numbers (millions) and limited comparisons (drop of water/ocean) are being used, then the character is not supreme because he can be surpassed (billions & molecule/universe comparison).

The difference is, that I've found a limit to Beyonder's power, while you have not found a limit to the Presence's power (such as Spectre saying that he is 3 times stronger than he, for example), so what you are doing is based purely on speculation, without anything to base yourself on.

But, I'm not about to turn this into a 'the Presence vs Beyonder' or 'is the Presence supreme' type of discussion, so I'm putting an end to this part of the discussion.

Originally posted by Philosophía
Now, moving on the thread at hand ..

Has Molecule Man ever displayed soul-control, or anything of the sort ?

Originally posted by fangirl101
The Creator of the IG is no abstract. It is the creator of humanity. They could never be more powerful than thier creator.

By that logic a trminator could never defeat a human
Ultron is weaker than henry pym
A green lantern could never become stronger than a guardian
Etc

Originally posted by rotiart
By that logic a trminator could never defeat a human
Ultron is weaker than henry pym
A green lantern could never become stronger than a guardian
Etc

Supreme beings. Odin is supreme in his realm and yet were still beaten by the dark gods. On his own turf.
Dormanmu is the supreme being of his realm and mephisto of his. You cannot gauge their power.
Quasars bands have an infinite power source and yet the power levels are not always enough to defeat his enemies.
Eternity/infinity are the supreme beings of 616 but realms shatter when abraxas appeared. Also being that they as the reLms how would a cosmic egg knowck one uncousious. Or an infinity gauntlet ever be powerful enough to usurp your position if you ARE the very reality the gauntlet is inside of. Technically then since the item is within you wouldn't you always be stronger?

Just pointing out how there could be a beyonder.outside the supposed supreme being of marvel

Originally posted by fangirl101
Thanos is not the creator of the gems. And the celestials are products of eternity. who is a product of nemesis. Thus Humanity will never be more powerful than the IG. Which means neither would Owen reece. The fallicy is exposed and thus revealed as stroking of characters that do not even exist.

Originally posted by Mindset
That doesn't even make sense.

Originally posted by Mindset
That doesn't even make sense.

You think that's weird think about abraxas. If any galactis in any universe dies a multiversal being poofs up that can destry pretty much the whole multiverse.

awesome.

Originally posted by rotiart
You think that's weird think about abraxas. If any galactis in any universe dies a multiversal being poofs up that can destry pretty much the whole multiverse.

awesome.

PR Beyonder>PR MM>LT>IG.

Seems simple enough.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
PR Beyonder>PR MM>LT>IG.

Seems simple enough.

Based on.....?

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Based on.....?

Originally posted by fangirl101
Feats. TOAA not existing in 85. How big marvel was then and how big it is now. etc. Doesn't matter. There are those who would wank the classic beyonder no matter if jim shooter himself said he wasn't god.

I'm pretty sure TOAA was first mentioned in Dr Strange Vol 2 issue 13.

Which was around 1975/76 was it not?

Originally posted by klintypooh
I'm pretty sure TOAA was first mentioned in Dr Strange Vol 2 issue 13.

Which was around 1975/76 was it not?