League of Champions Week Eight: id369/Kandy Vs. Leo/Scoob

Originally posted by leonidas
all right, so king spawn has finally been ruled illegal for ninternalizing the crown and using its power.

with that, they have standard spawn, a powerless cable/cog combo and an omac merged with sage. spawn has no chance against our speed and the sword (which would likely ohko him), and a lone omac has no chance against our full team.

so yeah, we crush him. 🙂

If so, we would have. This does not effect the proceeding that happened in my prep.

God Like Cable, and Cog empowered. (Fusion). (plus farther empowering)
OMAC fused with Sage, (plus farther empowering).

Originally posted by id369
I drafted the character not the base. The current Cog is not worth past 15 points, for reasons previously stated, and shown. That we have accesses to his base, is an entirely different and moot point.

You go on and on how I just drafted the King of Hell, status means nothing if my character is powerless in it of himself. Yet you have the Queen of Limbo for 20 points. Why is the ruler of Limbo, who has accesses to the so called “Most Powerful”, item in the tournament worth only 20 points….despite the soul sword being a standard item? Am I the only one that spots these contradicting and hypocritical claims here?

Now you are trying to make a case, of Cog granting control of Hell to the greater Demons, thus forfeited its power. Irrelevant such claims are not shown in the comic. Who ever governs the Throne, governs Hell. It matters not if other Demons control Hell. The Throne is secured, in Cog Base. As easily as he granted them control, it can be removed. Come on Leo, get smart.

And finally, yes Cog can only accesses those luxurious powers within the throne. The Throne Holds the Crown (the crown is clearly depicted above the throne). I showed you this…are you denying the comic book fact? And these are secured in the Base. Don’t you understand? Cog needed to steal the throne and secure it because he is not the rightful heir. The powers are granted to those who destroy the current ruler. Not to those who steal the throne, that is why he needs to externally accesses those powers. That is why he has only bin seen, using vast magical powers when he wore the Crown. Otherwise, your statements fall heavy under a burden of facts, you fail to show.

We only made use of items, that are stated to be in the base. To the best of my knowledge, I went through the proper channels to make sure I didn’t violate anything. And from the looks of things, your best bet is to continue to hit us with rule violations that I believe, I have properly contested.

nice conjecture, but meaningless. he IS king. the throne AND crown belong to him as king. they are HIS EQUIPMENT. he gave the crown to spawn who internalized it and removed it from the prep place.

illegal.

therefore no king spawn and we win this in a route. 🙂

(still can't believe you think the king of hell is powerless and use the fact that he has no more appearances justifies that idea . . .)

moot point. we win.

Originally posted by leonidas
nice conjecture, but meaningless. he IS king. the throne AND crown belong to him as king. they are HIS EQUIPMENT. he gave the crown to spawn who internalized it and removed it from the prep place.

illegal.

therefore no king spawn and we win this in a route. 🙂

(still can't believe you think the king of hell is powerless and use the fact that he has no more appearances justifies that idea . . .)

moot point. we win.

😕
We have 3 characters with enough power to challenge Lords of Hell in their own realm….each.

Originally posted by id369
Alright, I need to insert one more claim. It doesn’t take much time at all, so it takes place at the start of the match or during the match. It makes not difference really. But the pay off is immense.

Now originally I had plan to use this final ace in the whole, if I made it in the play off’s. However seeing as its my last match. I am going to make Scoob/Leo match just a notch harder.

Previously during prep, C-Cable and S-OMAC gained spawn symbiotes and full blown hell powers. And they gained the knowledge to use those powers effectively thanks to King Spawn. Well there is a way for them to bifold their power, intensely reaching the Elite herald/Transcendent class.

Did anyone notice, I also kept both an empathetic/telepathic link with my team? Good, I will not abuse this link. Through empathetic and telepathic means, I will induce C-Cable and S-OMAC into the darkness to fully embrace the suit in its totality. The Suit feeds of this desire, hatred, embracement to grow in power. To the point of challenging Lords of Hell.

Here is the proof.
Cogs knowledge:
[B]It feeds off you, your evil. When it cant drain from you, the worms become catalyst. But your anger, evil, and sin come in many forms. Yet anger is the ultimate pipeline.
http://img519.imageshack.us/my.php?image=spawn050page07xt6.jpg

Cog’s Theory:
Spawn you can accept your demonic nature, nurture it, allow it to grow in strength, and power….

Until such a time as you are strong and powerful enough to confront the Malebolgia and defeat him.
http://img222.imageshack.us/my.php?image=spawn7719nb7.jpg

Nice theory, is their any proof of what I claim? In fact there is.
Wildcats/Spawn cross over (which is in continuity).
This mini series takes place before, Wild CATS #15 and shortly after Spawn #30. It does occur in continuity.
http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=23wn9.jpg

Well the significance of this crossover, Spawn comes across a pendent that triggers his embracement of anger, hatred and evil. He embraces the Dark Side ala Darth Vadar so to speak. And goes of to challenge Malebolgia, and destroys him.
http://img259.imageshack.us/my.php?image=17bv8.jpg

But wait it gets better. What hope do others have, that this will work on C-Cable or S-OMAC? What proof do I have that, anger, rage, and sinfully induce will skyrocket her power instantly? Because it was the case with Morna the moment she bonded with the Symbiote.
http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?image=slimerspawn183007kb0.jpg
http://img519.imageshack.us/my.php?image=slimerspawn183008009ne0.jpg
http://img98.imageshack.us/my.php?image=slimerspawn183010iq5.jpg

After her words, the vary foundation of limbo began to quake, and on Earth, every man, woman, and child felt the inexplicable chill in their heart.
http://img209.imageshack.us/my.php?image=slimerspawn183011mz7.jpg

Mammon one of the Lords of Hell is binded and the Witch Speaks of what it means to fully unleash a Hell Spawn in such a manner.
[B]
Well you just pinned into a corner the only being that can destroy you. But whats worse…GodDAMN YOU!, is that this same Spawn has the ability to destroy all of us, everything in existence![/B]
http://img508.imageshack.us/my.php?image=spawn184014slimerwh4.jpg
Recap
[list]
[*]Spawn has God Like Magical Powers.
[*]C-Cable - Has his full Psi potential unleashed, and his Hell Spawn powers sky rocket to challenge a Lord of Hell.
[*]S-OMAC - has its Full abilities online, thanks to Brother Eye being internally booted. And Hell Spawn powers sky rocket to challenge a Lord of Hell.
[/list]

You see, now you are not fighting mere Herald Class characters. Leo/Scoob, you are now taking on characters that Challenge Malebolgia or Mammon in their realm. Do you even have a prayer of a chance? [/B]

there is so much of that i don't understand i can hardly begin to attack it.

the first thing you did was make king spawn. that is now impossible.

you said using his powers, you upgrade cog. that is now impossible.

The easy way, King Spawn can grant him a symbiote, and remove his limiters accessing limitless energy reserves.

Or Cog can just beat the system. You see Symbiotes are actually located in the Black Tower, and using his power will only send him back to hell only to be recharged. Well he is in hell, his powers are automatically restored,

no spawn, limits remain. and if his powers are auto-restored in hell, why is he only 15 again? and proof that these new powers would be useable/tranferrable OUTSIDE hell comes from . . .?? seems like they would be limited again, as they were previously when he FEARED using them because he FEARED going back to hell. there you go mixing eras of the character again. you want all the benefits, but none of the drawbacks. and if he is as powerless as you say, why does a symbiote just . . . repower him anyway?

you said you king spawn to heal cable. that is now impossible.

As King of Hell, Spawn power is absolute in his realm. We have seen, two feats of his. Matter manipulation, and healing magic. Well with the power to do what every he wants, I am sure it raises its healing magic + matter manipulation abilities considerably. Spawn will now purge Cable of the T.O. virus, and turn his techno organic parts into flesh.

you upgraded your omac via king spawn. that is now impossible and all you have is sage/omac. powerful, but nowhere close to being able to challenge our team.

so you have a hellspawn cog--somehow i don't really understand--classic cable (useless in the extreme against our uber robot) and that hellspawn would be decimated in one shot by someone with tourney-max speed and the soulsword. spawn would also be ohko'd by the sword. our speed>>>your speed. that leaves just your omac against all of us.

you lose.

My, my. In the Tournament Topic, the only thing that was ruled out was internalizing the crown‘s power. So Spawn can not come in with the Powers as King of Hell. Big woop, everything else is valid since it happened while we had accesses to the Crown during prep.

These upgrades, have bin shown to be permanent outside of hell.

That Means God Like Cable.
Cog empowered,
Sage empowered

There is no reboot, as if everything we did during prep was washed away. Come on Leo?

And we are still making use of the fact that, our powers can sky rocket if they embrace the Darkness.

i guess it also means spawn empowered and nothing in your plan has changed at all.

so you are simply planning on having cog (or spawn, it doesn't matter who) use his crown to do all of that in prep, is that what you are saying? then you leave the crown behind and go on your merry way?

so you are saying that the crown DOES belong to cog.

he DOES then have the power to make everyone into gods AND make it permanent.

AND you drafted him for 15pts. 😐

once again--if he has the power to do that, and he is the king, and the crown is HIS AS KING, how can i or anyone else possibly NOT call BS on that pick??

the friggin king of hell, uses HIS crown to make everyone into gods, and you just draft him for the price of batman and i'm supposed to accept that?

my god, i'm literally begging someone--ANYONE-- to PLEASE explain how as THE KING WHO SITS THE THRONE OF HELL, THE CROWN DOES NOT BELONG TO HIM??? and how it is NOT then considered HIS STANDARD EQUIPMENT!!??

anyone. please.

Originally posted by leonidas
i guess it also means spawn empowered and nothing in your plan has changed at all.

so you are simply planning on having cog (or spawn, it doesn't matter who) use his crown to do all of that in prep, is that what you are saying? then you leave the crown behind and go on your merry way?

so you are saying that the crown DOES belong to cog.
.

Isnt that what I have bin saying since post numero uno?

Originally posted by leonidas

he DOES then have the power to make everyone into gods AND make it permanent.

AND you drafted him for 15pts. 😐

once again--if he has the power to do that, and he is the king, and the crown is HIS AS KING, how can i or anyone else possibly NOT call BS on that pick??

the friggin king of hell, uses HIS crown to make everyone into gods, and you just draft him for the price of batman and i'm supposed to accept that?

my god, i'm literally begging someone--ANYONE-- to PLEASE explain how as THE KING WHO SITS THE THRONE OF HELL, THE CROWN DOES NOT BELONG TO HIM??? and how it is NOT then considered HIS STANDARD EQUIPMENT!!??

anyone. please.

okay, so then this is finished.

as per the rule, you get the current version. the current version possesses the crown. as king, it is standard equipment for him. he also displayed plenty of inferential power even WITHOUT actually wearing the crown--more than enough to get him booted from this thing.

you have the current king of hell on your roster.

a pm from delph:

Cog is either the current version with the Crown/Throne as standard equipment and therefore off the team due to a salary cap violation, or he's the depowered version sans the Crown.

you didn't specify an era-specific cog, ergo you have the current one and are (via delph's ruling) therefore over the cap based both on the crown as standard equipment for a king, AND on his displayed power even without the crown.

no access to cog. no access to the crown. no king of anything. all your prep plans are gone to . . . hell, and all your left with--as i said earlier--is your omac vs all of us. techno assimilates his tech after we demolish him and we move on toward the playoffs.

good night.

I smell a lot pm's took place. Usually these are one sided arguments. Curious though, on his displayed power even without the crown. Can someone elaborate this for me?

i have elaborated--2 or 3 times already. and actually, i refrained from pm'ing delph about this all week, til yesterday.

i fully realize what i big b!tch i look like for raising such a stink, but what you did was so clearly wrong imo (and the opinion of several others) that i felt it needed to be addressed. i've repeatedly outlined WHY it was wrong and illegal.

anyway, judges--my apologies for the debacle. cog is ruled INELIGIBLE. that means he is not ON the team. they have the defeat prep place (whatever that is . . .) so they have the classic cable, regular spawn and an omac/sage combo.

with our speed and teleportation, we take out normal spawn with the soulsword. if anyone doesn't believe the soulsword feat of amanda works with magik (it's the exact same sword . . .) i can show scnas if needed of her one-shotting the demons s'ym, n'astir and even the lord of limbo at the time, (and the CURRENT lord of limbo . . .) belasco. the soulsword pwns spawn in the opening moments of the match.

ironman x has all of im's tp shielding. classic cable has no chance against this combo that can DL whatever powers from weapon x it needs. we can simply hit him with a sonic barrage to stagger him and get him to drop his shields, then take him out in a variety of ways. our own normal shields and psi-shields prevent him from being able to harm us in any way.

the omac is still powerful. the peacemaker amalgam onlty needs to distract it and last for a couple of moments before the techno amalgam can arrive and the ironman x amalgam as well. then together, all 3 of us simply overpower their last member.

without the king of hell on his team, this is a slaughterhouse.

Originally posted by leonidas
cog is ruled INELIGIBLE. that means he is not ON the team.

Originally posted by illadelph12
id/Kandy and Leo/Scoob, just so you both know, this matter isn't completely settled. If there is evidence that the Crown isn't standard equipment for Cog than id's prep would stand.

then i suppose it is in the judges hands.

It's in Delph's hands. I'm waiting on a definitive ruling. Just to get this out, this is my argument for why it's legal (if this should be in the discussion thread, someone tell me and i'll move it.)

Cog didn't have any powers before he got the crown, and even when he went to hell, he didn't get his powers back. Then he got the crown, still with no powers. The crown let him preform good feats, and from then on he is never shown with it. He has two appearances afterwards, and neither have him with the crown. So, given how the majority of his appearances before and after don't show him with any power, and he only ever used the Crown once, it isn't standard equipment. He still HAS the crown, but he doesn't wear it or use it, just keeps it. So, it's a base item in my view.

This is the exact same precedent as the miracle machine ruling. There is not an atom of difference between the two, rules wise.

Originally posted by King Kandy
It's in Delph's hands. I'm waiting on a definitive ruling. Just to get this out, this is my argument for why it's legal (if this should be in the discussion thread, someone tell me and i'll move it.)

Cog didn't have any powers before he got the crown, and even when he went to hell, he didn't get his powers back. Then he got the crown, still with no powers. The crown let him preform good feats, and from then on he is never shown with it. He has two appearances afterwards, and neither have him with the crown. So, given how the majority of his appearances before and after don't show him with any power, and he only ever used the Crown once, it isn't standard equipment. He still HAS the crown, but he doesn't wear it or use it, just keeps it. So, it's a base item in my view.

This is the exact same precedent as the miracle machine ruling. There is not an atom of difference between the two, rules wise.

But in this case we actually need a ruling from delph. Or at least, that would really help.

Originally posted by King Kandy
But in this case we actually need a ruling from delph. Or at least, that would really help.

I don't have enough info either way to make an informed judgment.

I'm gonna need some time to think how I want to proceed.

Take all the time you need. I'd just like to see this settled before votes.

i finally just saw this and thought i'd throw it out there. it's just one more display of cog's INFERRED power:

this is the scan id showed in the previous page:

http://img520.imageshack.us/my.php?image=spawn141image05dl0.jpg

it's the last panel that seems to indicate cog is not as powerless as they would like us to assume. we see him in the window with the text stating that he is acting in the role of a judgement, willing and able to subject his SUBJECTS, the denizens of hell--to his rulings and judgement. again, that implies power, with or without the crown.

then again--how does he rule hell and command armies to do his bidding without any power? and why remove a crown that made him a god when he's always want to rule? i've raised several other issues that i'd like any judge to reply to if a ruling is made one way of another. i just was finally able to se that scan (the new imageshack format has given me lots of trouble .. .) so i thought i'd bing it up and give them a chance to rebut.

I shall leave these comments for the record.

FACT: I sent Delph a PM, where the duties of being King are clearly established. And the necessity of usurping the crown, to accesses its power.

FACT: I have shown, how Cog isn’t wearing the crown, or even takes up the responsibility of a King. He simply locked himself away (out of fear). And let others control Hell. The reason for all of this? As a former Hellspawn does not want be bound be Hell. Even with the Crown, demons are still gunning for his head. What better way to rid himself of these problems, then to secure the Crown, and just entitle rival demons with some authority.
http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/7923/spawn140page22km5.jpg
http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/3484/spawn141image05cc6.jpg

FACT: I have shown, how Cog is powerless before and after his death.

Originally posted by id369
Heh…I enter the tournament for these moments.

I want to see the evidence that Cog will regain his Hell Powers after his suicide. Oh wait I already know the answer.

Cog has no Hell Spawn powers, he removed them long ago.

In Hell he has no Spawn Powers.
He cant even, summon the strength to liberate Spawn in Hell.

Nor does he have the power, contest Violator in Hell.

http://img265.imageshack.us/my.php?image=spawn11906rg0.jpg

FACT: I have shown , how Lords of Hell can be powerless outside their ream.
This is a former member of the Fallen, and current ruler of 2 realms. First Age Spawn, literally b*tch slapped Mammon. (hey look no crown ¬__¬).
http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/4927/spawn8918vl3.jpg
http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/7255/spawn8919ui9.jpg
http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/4511/spawn8920mr3.jpg
http://img523.imageshack.us/img523/958/spawn8921xz3.jpg
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/1286/spawn8922ln8.jpg

Its one thing to extrapolate on logistics. Its another to make a claim based on paper panel actions, and its not like my claim are unreasonable if I am using direct quotes from the plot to back up the evidence. Not extrapolated logistics.

I drafted a character not its base. I believe my character is fine for 15 points. I am not going to pay more, to some one his is powerless. Based on everything I have shown, I believe the crown/throne is a base item that resides in Cog’s Base “The Black Tower”.