Dante (DMC 4) Vs Sephiroth (Advent Children)

Started by Burning thought14 pages

Ime not really sure anyone is being stupid, he was simply acting exactley the way Sephiroth would, if he killed Cloud then he would be acting out of character and would prob make people who know sephiroths character which is probably a lot of his fans disapointed more than disapointed Cloud died.

Either way, what could he have done? I mean he had plenty of time afterwards and before Cloud omnislashed to do something that his fans (or fanboys/girls) think he should have done, so what could it be?

It was CIS because he went easy on Cloud the whole fight, giving Cloud enough time to gather his friendship energy which each Japanese protagonist in fiction has, allowing him to his him with his Friendship Slash.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
1. It has relevance in the fact that to get sephiroths peak power, his biggest feats, we have to take his strongest from, which is from ac. And if he lost to cloud (in ac), then we know that the form of sephiroth lost to someone of clouds level. How did he lose anyways? Someone told me he got stabbed by a sword or something.

It's not his peak power, his peak power has been stated above characters like Chaos, Minerva, Omega who would destroy Dante. He got hit by Omnislash, some spiritual PIS move that has no properties and is basically just there for plot purposes.


2. Shooting where somebody is at doesnt necassarily make you a good gunman. Dante Would easily find out, and shoot not where zack (or anyother ff character) is but where he is going to be. Its easy to point a gun at someone, shoot, and for a ff character to dodge the shot. But its a different story when the shooter will shoot where your at, and where your going to be, so its much harder to dodge the shot. Also including the fact that the gunman thats shooting at you can move at extremely fast speeds also.
[/qutoe]
So give me evidence that Dante can shoot people fast enough to casually dodge bullets?

[quote]3.
Besides all of the speed feats gumachi just stated, here are a few more feats and some videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7UztLYJIgU&feature=related At about 0:16 he moves up to nero in a split second

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljVKGGWQHPs&feature=related He shows some sword speed in the beginning, and shows the he too can also fight very fastly in the air. At 2:28 he is instantly dodges the enemies attack. And at 3:19 he shows some of his gunman skills. He stacks bullet after bullet on top of eachother at the handle of yamato from a good distance away while dodging the saviors punch. I bet you the guys that shot zack dont have that good of an aim.

The stuff you showed me was alright, but not as good as dantes speed feats. [/B]

First video is hardly a speed feat because he's not even on screen when he moved, for all we know he started moving right when Nero fell down, which isn't fast at all

The second video just shows a the person slashing at where he thought Dante was, but made himself look like an idiot because Dante wasn't even there.

All these "feats" have Dante moving when he wasn't even on screen so its all moot.

And QS and his abilities require DT, and drains DT if he uses it, if Sephiroth teleports far in the air, Dante will really be helpless, Sephiroth will just summon the NL to crush him, or use TK on him.

Ime not really sure anyone is being stupid, he was simply acting exactley the way Sephiroth would, if he killed Cloud then he would be acting out of character and would prob make people who know sephiroths character which is probably a lot of his fans disapointed more than disapointed Cloud died.

Either way, what could he have done? I mean he had plenty of time afterwards and before Cloud omnislashed to do something that his fans (or fanboys/girls) think he should have done, so what could it be?


The plot ALWAYS finds a way for the good guy to win obviously, thats why they induce stupidity into a character, like have Sephiroth use none of his abilities andhave Sephiroth not exert himself. Realistically everyone knows CLoud is no match for Sephiroth, even the creators themselves know that, which is why they made that scenario of Sephiroth doing absolutely nothing and basically letting Cloud do it on him. These kinds of things don't happen in KMC battles because we look at them realistically.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
It was CIS because he went easy on Cloud the whole fight, giving Cloud enough time to gather his friendship energy which each Japanese protagonist in fiction has, allowing him to his him with his Friendship Slash.

But explain what could Sephiroth have done? and Character induced stupidity that stands for right? how is Sephiroth stupid for following what his character actually is? its not stupidity if thats who you are....

Originally posted by Terryc250
The plot ALWAYS finds a way for the good guy to win obviously, thats why they induce stupidity into a character, like have Sephiroth use none of his abilities andhave Sephiroth not exert himself. Realistically everyone knows CLoud is no match for Sephiroth, even the creators themselves know that, which is why they made that scenario of Sephiroth doing absolutely nothing and basically letting Cloud do it on him. These kinds of things don't happen in KMC battles because we look at them realistically.

But to me Cloud won a fairly fair victory consdiering everyone is acting the way they should be, Sephiroth never goes straight for a quick kill especially not against Cloud.....thing is youve not answered my question, what "could" Sephiroth do in the split seconds Cloud had to do omnislash? Sephiroth doesnt move faster than Omnislash....and what could he possibly do? spend 10 mins trying to summon meteor....

Dante can since things from afar. Also Lady[he didn't know she was behind him]shot a bullet and he dodge it. And Arkham creeped up on Dante and he blocked his attack.

Don't forget Dante can teleport also.

ye and dont forget Dante can jump really high and block all attacks!

Dante can't teleport.

Originally posted by Burning thought
But to me Cloud won a fairly fair victory consdiering everyone is acting the way they should be, Sephiroth never goes straight for a quick kill especially not against Cloud.....thing is youve not answered my question, what "could" Sephiroth do in the split seconds Cloud had to do omnislash? Sephiroth doesnt move faster than Omnislash....and what could he possibly do? spend 10 mins trying to summon meteor.... [/B]

What do you mean? Sephiroth massacred the entire Shinra corp in minutes, killed Aeris in a second, he could've just killed Cloud right on the spot but instead kept him alive just to taunt him some more, that right there is obvious PIS/CIS, if Spehiroth was aiming to kill he would've stabbed him right through the forehead. Rofl why would he try to summon a meteor? He could've just used the NL directly on Cloud instead of spreading it through the planet, he could've used his TK, his powers, theres so many things he could've done in that fight but the creators limited him to do basically nothing at all, and even still then he could've killed Cloud.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Sephiroth doesnt move faster than Omnislash....and what could he possibly do? spend 10 mins trying to summon meteor....

Easy, kill Cloud before he gets it off, duh.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
Dante can't teleport.

Dark Slayer.

Like I said from what i've heard/seen my money is still on Seph.

[Dante is a demigod]

Originally posted by Gumachi

[Dante is a demigod]

Sephiroth is a super ultimate monsterous demigod

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
Sephiroth is a super ultimate monsterous demigod

=| wow. If i'm not mistaken but Seph doesn't even have a humans body does he?

Originally posted by Terryc250
What do you mean? Sephiroth massacred the entire Shinra corp in minutes, killed Aeris in a second, he could've just killed Cloud right on the spot but instead kept him alive just to taunt him some more, that right there is obvious PIS/CIS, if Spehiroth was aiming to kill he would've stabbed him right through the forehead. Rofl why would he try to summon a meteor? He could've just used the NL directly on Cloud instead of spreading it through the planet, he could've used his TK, his powers, theres so many things he could've done in that fight but the creators limited him to do basically nothing at all, and even still then he could've killed Cloud.

But he wouldnt massacre Cloud because he takes great pleasure in bothering Cloud, he does it in almost every instane against Cloud, talks to him. Also what gives you reason to think he is faster than Cloud and could have put a sword right through his head? Cloud and Sephiroth battled blade to blade, theres no question Cloud was equelly fast, thats nothing to do with not using powers is it.

Meteor is my mockery for "slow @ss FF spells" and NL? who knows its fast enough to take Cloud out before he would just do an Omnislash, Cloud could have been under just as much PIS for not doing Omnislash at the very beginning.....

Originally posted by Burning thought
But he wouldnt massacre Cloud because he takes great pleasure in bothering Cloud, he does it in almost every instane against Cloud, talks to him. Also what gives you reason to think he is faster than Cloud and could have put a sword right through his head? Cloud and Sephiroth battled blade to blade, theres no question Cloud was equelly fast, thats nothing to do with not using powers is it.

Which has no relevance in this thread because Cloud isn't in it. Sephirothw as toying with Cloud, and STILL could have put a sword through his head if he wanted, when he had Cloud against the wall, he could've stabbed him anywhere he wanted, in the head, in the neck, but stabbed him in the... shoulder? Just so he can keep him alive and taunt him some more. PIS is the fact that add that stuff in to make Sephiroth lose for the plot, if all that was gone and Sephiroth actually fought with an intent to kill, Cloud would be dead.


Meteor is my mockery for "slow @ss FF spells" and NL? who knows its fast enough to take Cloud out before he would just do an Omnislash, Cloud could have been under just as much PIS for not doing Omnislash at the very beginning..... [/B]

Meteor takes awhile because it takes along time for the meteor to reach the planet, its a special circumstance. No other spell requires something to reach the planet from outer space. Sephiroths TK works on a thought, which is faster then Clouds Omnislash

Originally posted by Gumachi
=| wow. If i'm not mistaken but Seph doesn't even have a humans body does he?

He uses an alien entitys body called "Jenova" which used to go planet to planet causing havoc and destruction

Originally posted by Terryc250
Which has no relevance in this thread because Cloud isn't in it. Sephirothw as toying with Cloud, and STILL could have put a sword through his head if he wanted, when he had Cloud against the wall, he could've stabbed him anywhere he wanted, in the head, in the neck, but stabbed him in the... shoulder? Just so he can keep him alive and taunt him some more. PIS is the fact that add that stuff in to make Sephiroth lose for the plot, if all that was gone and Sephiroth actually fought with an intent to kill, Cloud would be dead.

Meteor takes awhile because it takes along time for the meteor to reach the planet, its a special circumstance. No other spell requires something to reach the planet from outer space. Sephiroths TK works on a thought, which is faster then Clouds Omnislash

Sephiroth would be dead from the start and wouldnt have got that shoulder stab if Cloud omnislashed at the beginning.....PIS for CLoud!

how is it? apprently you said (and so did the developers) omnislash happens in an instant...you cant get faster than an instnat..

By that logic, Cloud should beable to defeat anyone with his PIS-slash. A thought is an instant as well, Cloud probably needs like a high emotion to use Omnislash anyway. Sephiroth also could have teleported to a distance then kill Cloud with so many other ways.

Originally posted by Terryc250
It's not his peak power, his peak power has been stated above characters like Chaos, Minerva, Omega who would destroy Dante. He got hit by Omnislash, some spiritual PIS move that has no properties and is basically just there for plot purposes.

First video is hardly a speed feat because he's not even on screen when he moved, for all we know he started moving right when Nero fell down, which isn't fast at all

The second video just shows a the person slashing at where he thought Dante was, but made himself look like an idiot because Dante wasn't even there.

All these "feats" have Dante moving when he wasn't even on screen so its all moot.

And QS and his abilities require DT, and drains DT if he uses it, if Sephiroth teleports far in the air, Dante will really be helpless, Sephiroth will just summon the NL to crush him, or use TK on him.

All ive heard from everyone who has ever liked seph is that he is strongest in AC.

First vid gave dante a limited amount of time, wasnt that impressive but it was something.

The second vid you know dante was there because the angel machine lookin thing was looking at him and talking to him. Hes not going to be talking to wall is he? and Right when he stops talking to dante, he immediately lunges at him and he wasnt there. What about the rest of that vid? you still think that dante is just some average gunslinger? And those were just 2 speed feats dante has, what about everything gumachi has stated? Im assuming youll take those as good speed feats, because you havent said anything about them yet.

Dante can fly in devil trigger. Dante can teleport. so seph teleporting far in the air isnt that big of a feat.

So far ac seph is a lot stronger than he showed, but still havent seen THAT many speed feats from him.

Stength: Dante

Speed: Tie ( definitely tilting to dante if no more speed feats are shown)

Reflexes: Dante

Durability: Dante

Powers: Seph

Endurance: Dante

Weaponry: Dante

Originally posted by k1Lla441
[B]All ive heard from everyone who has ever liked seph is that he is strongest in AC.

He's the most powerful character in FF7, fact. And there are characters who would rape Dante in FF7.


The second vid you know dante was there because the angel machine lookin thing was looking at him and talking to him. Hes not going to be talking to wall is he? and Right when he stops talking to dante, he immediately lunges at him and he wasnt there. What about the rest of that vid? you still think that dante is just some average gunslinger? And those were just 2 speed feats dante has, what about everything gumachi has stated? Im assuming youll take those as good speed feats, because you havent said anything about them yet.

No, he turned around, wheres the evidence that Dante didn't just move right then and there? The screen wasn't on Dante so we don't know when he moved, for all we know, when the angel machine turned around, Dante moved out of the way, and Angel thought he was still standing there. There is no other speed feat in that vid, just Dante jumping stabbing his sword, then shooting his sword, not much of a speed feat.


Dante can fly in devil trigger. Dante can teleport. so seph teleporting far in the air isnt that big of a feat.

Dante can't use Devil Trigger anytime he wants.


So far ac seph is a lot stronger than he showed, but still havent seen THAT many speed feats from him.

Because he was only on screen for like 10 minutes, his weak remnant who is just a fraction of Sephiroths power has comparable speed to Dante himself.


Stength: Dante

Don't know the limits of Sephiroth strength, but in his weakest form just his sword clashing impact was outputting enough power to crator iron and concrete. His weak remnant who is just a fraction of Sephiroths power was tossing atleast 1 ton of weight like nothing.


Speed: Tie ( definitely tilting to dante if no more speed feats are shown)

Sephiroth has shown faster movement speed, even his weak remnant has comparable speed to Dante.

Durability: Dante

Sephiroths durability is unknown

Powers: Seph


Endurance: Dante

Sephiroth doesn't get tired, because he's Jenova

Originally posted by Terryc250
By that logic, Cloud should beable to defeat anyone with his PIS-slash. A thought is an instant as well, Cloud probably needs like a high emotion to use Omnislash anyway. Sephiroth also could have teleported to a distance then kill Cloud with so many other ways.

He needs a high emotion? probably? their strong grounds for your argument...... and no, anyone who he can get in range with Omnislash and kill with it could possibly be defeated, its just that not everyone is as vulnerable as Sephiroth.

Teleported to a distance? ive still not seen him teleport, not outside KH...the only video ive seen is of him teleporting IN to an area, how long it took him to cast a spell for the teleport is unkown.

either way, as ive said and as youve said, Omnislash is instant and Kadaj changes to Sephiroth right beneath Cloud so he wouldnt have a chance to do anything..Omnislash is a viable move, and its just as much Cloud under PIS for not doing it earlier that it is Sephiroth for not killing cloud.

Originally posted by Terryc250
1. He's the most powerful character in FF7, fact. And there are characters who would rape Dante in FF7.

2. Dante can't use Devil Trigger anytime he wants.

3Because he was only on screen for like 10 minutes

4. Don't know the limits of Sephiroth strength

5. Sephiroths durability is unknown

1. poor argument from any point of view, first its A>B>C logic which doesnt work on these forums and furthermore him being more powerful doesnt mean they still dont have various stats far above him, like durability/speed

2. He can if he has enough power

3. no excuse, yet another poor argument, if hes not got the feat, saying "it hasnt been shown" is not enough to make a diffrence, Dante automatically gets the point.

4. same as 3

5. so thats an argument how? he simply doesnt have the feats, same as 3...

Originally posted by Burning thought
He needs a high emotion? probably? their strong grounds for your argument...... and no, anyone who he can get in range with Omnislash and kill with it could possibly be defeated, its just that not everyone is as vulnerable as Sephiroth.

What makes Sephiroth more vulnerable then any other character? He let his entire guard down against Cloud, and basically treated like he was fighting a bug.


Teleported to a distance? ive still not seen him teleport, not outside KH...the only video ive seen is of him teleporting IN to an area, how long it took him to cast a spell for the teleport is unkown.

He teleports in every single game Nomura puts him in, whether it be KH, KH2, Dissidia, FF7, teleporting isn't a materia spell, it's his ability.

either way, as ive said and as youve said, Omnislash is instant and Kadaj changes to Sephiroth right beneath Cloud so he wouldnt have a chance to do anything..Omnislash is a viable move, and its just as much Cloud under PIS for not doing it earlier that it is Sephiroth for not killing cloud.

I doubt Cloud can pull off Omnislashes whenever he wants, in the game he needed to be injured enough before he can use it as a limit break.

1. poor argument from any point of view, first its A>B>C logic which doesnt work on these forums and furthermore him being more powerful doesnt mean they still dont have various stats far above him, like durability/speed

A>B>C works well over 90% of the time, the only way it doesn't work is if one character is a special case, like Kryptonite man can beat Superman but cannot beat Batman while Superman can beat Batman but can't beat Kryptonite man.

Chaos Vincent is much more faster and powerful then Dante, yet if Chaos cannot defeat Sephiroth, how would Dante?


2. He can if he has enough power

Nothing suggests he can use Devil Trigger anytime he wants, he needs to gain enough power first.


3. no excuse, yet another poor argument, if hes not got the feat, saying "it hasnt been shown" is not enough to make a diffrence, Dante automatically gets the point.

Not an excuse, Sephiroth without even exerting himself has shown to be more faster then Dante already, even Loz is comparable to Dante who is just a fraction of Sephiroths power.


4. same as 3

No because evidence suggests that Sephiroth strength is very strong, but we don't know the limits of it, if just by the air output impact of his sword clashing, can crator concrete and iron ground below it, then he must have many many tons worth of strength, think of 2 cars smashing into eachother, the output could probably put out a candle, now think about if it was powerful enough that the air output to crator iron and concrete ground. Sephiroth cuts through concrete with enough power to set it ablaze.


5. so thats an argument how? he simply doesnt have the feats, same as 3... [/B]

Its not an argument, it means we don't have enough information to determine one of the characters durability, its stated that Sephiroth can regenerate, once the Kadaj took in the Sephiroth cells, Sephiroth regenerated his regular body instantly.