John McClane VS Martin Riggs

Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
How will he do that while sparked out..?

Well McClane was never KO'd whereas Maggie Q WAS.
You cite real life fight dynamics?
Well another odds on certainty for McClane re-sparking her out killing her and mostly likely Riggs who will be out powered and fighting an opponent unwilling to let him fight at his own pace. McClane'll be on him like stink on shit. No time for crane stance HERE, Daniel san.

My argument has never been that McClane would be able to use a SUV in this, merely that he will kill with what is at hand.
If there was a ball point in the room and nothing else, he'd STILL kill Riggs with it... to just deny that there will be objects in this buliding would be very cheap move. And if you accept that they are there, you must also accept that McClane will try to kill with them, if need be.

Im afraid that the stats that show McClane to be a more fearsome and prolific killer is VERY relevant here.

As is that Riggs would be just another highly trained statistic on McClane's record, judging by the proven higher pedegree of opponents that John has killed than Riggs or any of his adversaries.

And McClane does his by 98% by himself/alone...

When did Riggs ever take out 2 entire commandos of the US military's hardest men in one day...? Wassatyousay...? Never? Oh. 😛

When did Riggs gain the experience in fighting in the proposed environment that McClane has...? He didnt. Oh ok then.

Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Well now that this has degenerated into another classic RJ "fingers in ears nayah nahhh nahhhh session", theres little to stop the boredom from giving in to tiredness.

Ive presented the facts, they just get 'countered' with unrelated-to-the-point irrelevances and non sequitors and ridiculous bias.

May look in tommorrow, to see if you are any less wrong...
You may now commence mouthing off behind my back. 😉

Tune in tomorrow, bring more bullshit to the table, I could care less. I will be right here, shovel in hand.

Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Oh they are debatable? Then debate them. Oh you tried that...

You wanna talk crutches..? How about the big 6ft one with a Smith and Wesson.....like Riggs has.

Yes Im pretty sure, having seen the breakdowns.

Sore losing, your problem with the Zippo.
I guess we should penalise Riggs for use of fire and a suv or truck in LW 3 then, huh..?

Give it up, you know deep down that Riggs pwns this fight. Let go of your pride and just admit it.

You buried nothing. And you debate like a child, claiming victory when there is none. I have smashed apart everything you have put out here.
If you dont want it to go pathetic then reason like an adult.

YOU rambled on about SUVs, because you couldnt take addressing the issue that its not the SUV but how adept he is at using everything around him to kill. But you like a little frustrated chihuahua, had to fix on the SUV detail with blinkers.

Your monosyllabilic bullshits, whatevers and other thoughtless comments of dismissiveness bely the empty can that you are inn this mode of argument..

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
You rambled on for ten pages about using a damn SUV, totally dismissed the vids I presented (which are REAL evudence), thats all.

Tune in tomorrow, bring more bullshit to the table, I could care less. I will be right here, shovel in hand.

Serious thats right. You could care less. Whereas I couldn't.
You know nothing of fighting IRL, by your own admission, and that is definitely doing all your assessing here.

Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
You buried nothing. And you debate like a child, claiming victory when there is none. I have smashed apart everything you have put out here.
If you dont want it to go pathetic then reason like an adult.

YOU rambled on about SUVs, because you couldnt take addressing the issue that its not the SUV but how adept he is at using everything around him to kill. But you like a little frustrated chihuahua, had to fix on the SUV detail with blinkers.

Your monosyllabilic bullshits, whatevers and other thoughtless comments of dismissiveness bely the empty can that you are inn this mode of argument..

No SUV=DEAD MCCLAINE.

FACT.

Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Serious thats right. You could care less. Whereas I couldn't.
You know nothing of fighting IRL, by your own admission, and that is definitely doing all your assessing here.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
OK this is getting pathetic, its far beyond sad.

Give it up, you know deep down that Riggs pwns this fight. Let go of your pride and just admit it.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
You rambled on for ten pages about using a damn SUV, totally dismissed the vids I presented (which are REAL evudence), thats all.

Tune in tomorrow, bring more bullshit to the table, I could care less. I will be right here, shovel in hand.

Fat lady'll be on in a sec.

Oh fu*k that.

No ROGER = NO RIGGS FACT.

Beyond that I cannot continue to dignify your absurdist 'statements' (such as they are) and denials.

McClane wins.

FACT (IE Based on data from the films), not some Riggs fanboys' love diary.)

No Al No McClaine, right back acha baby.

Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Im afraid that the stats that show McClane to be a more fearsome and prolific killer is VERY relevant here.

And that's the fact RJ can't grasp, sure McClaine doesn't have a fancy background of being a special ops forces during the Vietnam war; he still avoids death (more times than Riggs and riskier scenarios, eg the F-35) while killing his enemies (more kills too), sometimes obliterating them; he does this by himself, no need for Murtaugh, he's basically a one-man show.

Comes down to solo action star vs buddy-cop without his buddy.

Originally posted by Robtard
And that's the fact RJ can't grasp, sure McClaine doesn't have a fancy background of being a special ops forces during the Vietnam war; he still avoids death (more times than Riggs and riskier scenarios, eg the F-35) while killing his enemies (more kills too), sometimes obliterating them; he does this by himself, no need for Murtaugh, he's basically a one-man show.

Comes down to solo action star vs buddy-cop without his buddy.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Thats right, lean on that crutch. Thats really all you have at this point, the "buddy" thing, and its complete horseshit.

How is the buddy aspect a crutch, when Lethal Weapon is a 'buddy movie'; it's the format of the films, they help each other etc.

You know what is a crutch though, your 'he's a stealth assassin from the Vietnam war, he can fight anywhere and do anything' quips, when in the films there was nothing he did which portrayed this supposed invincibility because of that background.

It's a crutch because despite it being bullshit, you keep using it against Riggs. Just like the SUV fiasco.

And yeah, do your research, special forces soldiers can pretty much fight anywhere. "Special Forces", not "Normal Forces."

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
It's a crutch because despite it being bullshit, you keep using it against Riggs. Just like the SUV fiasco.

And yeah, do your research, special forces soldiers can pretty much fight anywhere. "Special Forces", not "Normal Forces."

You mean that Lethal Weapon isn't focused on a cop-buddy scenario? Is Riggs supposed to be a one-man action star, like McClaine, Rambo, Segal and most Jean-Claude Van Damme outings?

Hahahaha, you're a hypocrite of the HIGHEST order. While I do generally agree with you on the Special Forces sentiment, it is irrelevant to this thread. Here, let me cock-slap you with your hypocrisy.

Remember the Swagger Vs. Agent 47 thread? During your massive ball-sucking session on Swagger being invincible, I brought up the fact that in Hitman it stated, "the assassins are trained to be experts in every form of combat", this was to counter your nonsense about Swagger finding some forest in the middle of a city and sniping from the cover of shrubbery, yet you cried and ranted, '47 is never shown fighting in a wooded area, it doesn't count'.

Originally posted by Robtard
You mean that Lethal Weapon isn't focused on a cop-buddy scenario? Is Riggs supposed to be a one-man action star, like McClaine, Rambo, Segal and most Jean-Claude Van Damme outings?

Hahahaha, you're a hypocrite of the HIGHEST order. While I do generally agree with you on the Special Forces sentiment, it is irrelevant to this thread. Here, let me cock-slap you with your hypocrisy.

Remember the Swagger Vs. Agent 47 thread? During your massive ball-sucking session on Swagger being invincible, I brought up the fact that in Hitman it stated, "the assassins are trained to be experts in every form of combat", this was to counter your nonsense about Swagger finding some forest in the middle of a city and sniping from the cover of shrubbery, yet you cried and ranted, '47 is never shown fighting in a wooded area, it doesn't count'.

No, all I said there was that Swagger lived, ate and shat in the woods. Swagger in the woods is home field advantage, while McClaine in a high rise is NOT.

Absolutely correct, Robtard.

And that reminds me of thread where according to RJ, Bruce Lee (Small man, light man with an unproven fight record who when he does he feats its all in MOVIES where its choreographed often by himself.) beats.....

....Muhammad Ali (Big man, extremely quick man with a massive and proven to everyone in the world as a great champion against opponents, may of whom would have killed Lee themselves.)

RJ was equally as adament then, despite having no idea of how H2H fights actually work in real life and all the evidence in the world being shoved his way, that Lee would win every time.

Yet everyone else was wrong THEN too. 🙄

And RJ seems to not mind arguing that a hat is a fish to 'prove' it.

McClane wins.
And his experience in highrises counts beacuse we know he has what it takes stamina wise to be carrying a heavy machinne guns around running up and down stairs ALL NIGHT whereas we havent seen that from Riggs, (who despite all this training of his was beaten in the ring by a rookie cop with some very basic boxing in LW4)

McClane's shots'd kill him.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
No Al No McClaine, right back acha baby.

Interesting.

Then you wont mind listing any other times other than that time where he shot Karl (Karl was threating to spray a crowd that Johnstone was standing in with McClane- Johnstone as a cop had to shoot, McClaine or not.) that Al Johnstone come in, killed someone saving McClane...?

Oh. There are none.
Not like the numerous times Roger came-a-runnin' into action for his partner yelling "RIIIIIIIIIGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGSSSS...!"

And whilst youre at it, you may wanna back up your bullshit assertion that Die Hard is proven to be just a movie in the Lethal Weapon universe:

Show me any Die Hard Posters, promotionals, clips or references to the movie Die hard that appeared in the Lethal Weapon movies.

Oh...there arent any...? Oh. So its more bullshit then.

Whereas Lethal weapon 2 is clearly shown to be just a movie in McClane's universe in Die Hard 2.

Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Absolutely correct, Robtard.

And that reminds me of thread where according to RJ, Bruce Lee (Small man, light man with an unproven fight record who when he does he feats its all in MOVIES where its choreographed often by himself.) beats.....

....Muhammad Ali (Big man, extremely quick man with a massive and proven to everyone in the world as a great champion against opponents, may of whom would have killed Lee themselves.)

RJ was equally as adament then, despite having no idea of how H2H fights actually work in real life and all the evidence in the world being shoved his way, that Lee would win every time.

Yet everyone else was wrong THEN too. 🙄

Most H2H fights go to the ground, this is common knowledge. They would not be fighting in a ring, there would be no referee to seperate them, it'd be an all out brawl. Ray Mercer showed how well a boxer does in an all out brawl.

YouTube video

If it goes to the ground, if it turns into a grapplefest, Lee's martial arts training would overcome Ali's boxing training. Your pride is taking hold of you, you think because you have boxing experience that your word is law. It isn't.

And I have been in a few scrapes, while witnessing far more. I have a fair idea of how H2H works in real life, in a street fight scenario, that is.

And RJ seems to not mind arguing that a hat is a fish to 'prove' it.

McClane wins.
And his experience in highrises counts beacuse we know he has what it takes stamina wise to be carrying a heavy machinne guns around running up and down stairs ALL NIGHT whereas we havent seen that from Riggs, (who despite all this training of his was beaten in the ring by a rookie cop with some very basic boxing in LW4)

McClane's shots'd kill him.

Where as Riggs, in LW1: Ran through the desert to snipe the baddies, was caught and tortured, escaped, tore through an entire room of bad guys (Entering the room unarmed FTW), chased down a speeding car, CAUGHT said car, blew the car to shit, was HIT by a car, pwned Joshua H2H (McClaine would have been PWNED by Joshua), and still had the strength to blow Joshua away.

McClaine would have never even caught Joshua.

The cop in LW4 was a rookie? I don't remember it stating that. And they were boxing, they weren't in a fight to the death, just so you know.

Let's be real about this. If it is a situation like DH3, then yes, McClaine performs better. He was pretty much making shit up as he went, being reactive instead of proactive. If it is a situation similar to the LW movies (There are criminals over there, go bust their ass), then Riggs performs better. I am not saying McClaine can't perform the simple duties of an everyday cop, nor am I saying that Riggs would be totally lost if he were thrust into any of the Die Hard movies. I am simply saying that each man has their strengths/weaknesses, that each are suited for different scenarios. Now if that isn't being fair and objective, I don't know what isn't.

If I were a hostage in a high rise, naturally I'd prefer McClaine rescuing me. And if I had to rely on someone to take down a criminal organization, I'd rely on Riggs.

BTW: Has anyone forgotten that the first thing a Cop does is identify himself as a cop? This fight would never happen. If anything, they would join forces and pwn the world.

Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Interesting.

Then you wont mind listing any other times other than that time where he shot Karl (Karl was threating to spray a crowd that Johnstone was standing in with McClane- Johnstone as a cop had to shoot, McClaine or not.) that Al Johnstone come in, killed someone saving McClane...?

Oh. There are none.
Not like the numerous times Roger came-a-runnin' into action for his partner yelling "RIIIIIIIIIGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGSSSS...!"

And whilst youre at it, you may wanna back up your bullshit assertion that Die Hard is proven to be just a movie in the Lethal Weapon universe:

Show me any Die Hard Posters, promotionals, clips or references to the movie Die hard that appeared in the Lethal Weapon movies.

Oh...there arent any...? Oh. So its more bullshit then.

Whereas Lethal weapon 2 is clearly shown to be just a movie in McClane's universe in Die Hard 2.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Yes, but you are using Murtaugh as a crutch, saying he ALWAYS helps Riggs, when this is not true.

It is relevant because Riggs's training and whether or not he could adapt to a high rise were brought up. And no thanks, I choke on small bones.

No, all I said there was that Swagger lived, ate and shat in the woods. Swagger in the woods is home field advantage, while McClaine in a high rise is NOT.

You're so full of shit, you know exactly what you said in the other thread and the tactics you tried to employ.

btw, 47's "expert in all forms of combat" would counter anything Swagger had, if we used the reasoning you're trying with Riggs here. Nice self "ownage".

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi

If it goes to the ground, if it turns into a grapplefest, Lee's martial arts training would overcome Ali's boxing training. Your pride is taking hold of you, you think because you have boxing experience that your word is law. It isn't.

Holy butt****ing hell, this crap again? Bruce Lee has no fight record, it's all ****ing hearsay. Ali is regarded as one of the greatest boxers of all time, arguably the best. He has a time tested record to back this up. Lee has Enter the Dragon, which is a great film, but it's a film. Do you think Van Damme is also a world-class fighter?

If it went to the ground, Lee being all of 130 lbs would we struggling with a 200+ pound Ali of considerable strength. It doesn't take a genius to realize that's also another disadvantage for Lee.

edit: another thing, Lee would have a hard time trying to take a man twice his size to the ground while avoiding a right hook that has shown to be able to knock out heavy weight fighters.