Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Prove me wrong. 😛
What's their to prove? It's common sense. If you think Silver Surfer wins every time, then what's the point of this discussion?
Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Bill was already getting thrashed on panel before it even proceeded off panel.Also, as I mentioned earlier, that is NOT a force bubble that he can break out of/absorb. Those are his own energies that was simply fizzling out.
Getting thrashed? He threw two punches while amped on the Power Cosmic, and drew some blood. Your definition of getting thrashed must be different from the real one.
Those were Silver Surfer's energy attempting to contain Bill. He wasn't even grasping Stormbreaker truly.
Are you telling me, that he was beaten so bad in just a few punches he gave up and went into the fetal position? Not as a result, of Silver Surfer energy attempting to restrict him? If that was the case, than this writer doesn't know shit about Beta Ray Bill's character.
Originally posted by D_Dude1210
And that did HOW much damage to the Surfer? None. FYI, the Surfer's been thrown off his board before, doesn't really mean he's been injured by it.While when Surfer punches BRB, he bleeds all over the place.
How the hell can you tell he didn't do any damage? Because, what, his skin was not broken or something along those lines? "FYI", when Thor knocked him out a few times, it didn't seem like he took any damage, but he was clearly out of it.
Unlike the Silver Surfer who cannot truly bleed, Beta Ray Bill can. It's hard to tell the damage on Norrin but he was clearly affected enough to be thrown off his board at those speeds. His taken punches from beings, like the Hulk, and hasn't budged as I recall.
Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Um, he deflected/absorbed the energy attacks with his hammer, true. But nothing there shows that he could deflect the board as it comes or that he could even react to it. The fight lasted too short for them to be using a wide range of powers.Thing is, short fights with a decisive winner = ownage.
Clearly he can react to it. He tagged Silver Surfer while they were faster than light. The board simply went from behind. If he saw it coming, he can obviously defend himself. Like I said, he can will Force Fields and the such. Outside of a cheap shot, that method of attack is really pointless.
That would be the case, unless, the fight happened off panel.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusAnd he was unaffected by the Hulk's blows.
Unlike the Silver Surfer who cannot truly bleed, Beta Ray Bill can. It's hard to tell the damage on Norrin but he was clearly affected enough to be thrown off his board at those speeds. His taken punches from beings, like the Hulk, and hasn't budged as I recall.
When Surfer actually shows pain, or it says it, he's in pain. When he gets thrown around without any indication of it doing anything, then he's not.
As for the fight, it seems pretty obvious that Surfer KO'ed him with that combo, at least IMO.
Surfer is simply way more powerful, and that board attack helped greatly.
Originally posted by Blanket
And he was unaffected by the Hulk's blows.When Surfer actually shows pain, or it says it, he's in pain. When he gets thrown around without any indication of it doing anything, then he's not.
As for the fight, it seems pretty obvious that Surfer KO'ed him with that combo, at least IMO.
Surfer is simply way more powerful, and that board attack helped greatly.
Never said he was.
Not always. Thor, knocked him down a few times, and clearly it hurt him, as he was down (Even momentarily knocked out. His eyes were shut for a panel or two.), and he didn't say he was in pain as I recall.
What knock out? Where do we see Beta Ray Bill knocked out?
Your telling me Silver Surfer, can beat Bill, with two blows, and a board against the back of his head? Utter bullshit. Unless Beta Ray Bill suddenly got a drop in durability.
Personally, and based on their showings, I'd rate them as:
Thor > Silver Surfer =/> Beta Ray Bill > Stardust
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusJust saying he hasn't really ever been hurt by Hulk... even when he's been tossed around.
Never said he was.Not always. Thor, knocked him down a few times, and clearly it hurt him, as he was down (Even momentarily knocked out. His eyes were shut for a panel or two.), and he didn't say he was in pain as I recall.
What knock out? Where do we see Beta Ray Bill knocked out?
Your telling me Silver Surfer, can beat Bill, with two blows, and a board against the back of his head? Utter bullshit. Unless Beta Ray Bill suddenly got a drop in durability.
Personally, and based on their showings, I'd rate them as:
Thor > Silver Surfer =/> Beta Ray Bill > Stardust
Well:
Originally posted by Blanket
When Surfer actually shows pain, or it says it, he's in pain.
He seemed out/waking up in the panel after the fight.
Why not? He KO'ed Hulk with just his board before. He hurt Bannerless Hulk pretty good with the same attack (board to back of head). He KO'ed super Skaar with just punches. Etc.
It's not as bad as you're making it out to be.
K.
Originally posted by Blanket
Just saying he hasn't really ever been hurt by Hulk... even when he's been tossed around.
Fair enough. But, he has been hurt by those who have the power/strength to knock him around like Thor.
Originally posted by Blanket
Well:He seemed out/waking up in the panel after the fight.
Why not? He KO'ed Hulk with just his board before. He hurt Bannerless Hulk pretty good with the same attack (board to back of head). He KO'ed super Skaar with just punches. Etc.
It's not as bad as you're making it out to be.K.
He didn't seem out of it. We couldn't even see his face, because Norrin was using the energy to hold him. When he stopped Beta Ray Bill starting talking etc. I don't know why he didn't use Stormbreaker to counter, as he has been shown doing it numerous times against energy attacks, but I'll call it plot.
That's great. Beta Ray Bill is more durable than the Hulk.
Because Skaar has the feats to make that showing impressive right?
I don't view Thor as being an entire league above Beta Ray Bill personally. Hence why, I find it rather silly, for anyone to claim that Norrin can put him out of a fight with two blows, and a board to the back of the head.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusI know. However, he seems more powerful/durable (Surfer), and again, didn't seem fazed in the least by Beta's attack, as well as he was already plotting out its course before he hit the ship.
Fair enough. But, he has been hurt by those who have the power/strength to knock him around like Thor.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusHe was in a fetal position...
He didn't seem out of it. We couldn't even see his face, because Norrin was using the energy to hold him. When he stopped Beta Ray Bill starting talking etc. I don't know why he didn't use Stormbreaker to counter, as he has been shown doing it numerous times against energy attacks, but I'll call it plot.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusOh?
That's great. Beta Ray Bill is more durable than the Hulk.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusKind of. It's just something to look at.
Because Skaar has the feats to make that showing impressive right?
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympusk
I don't view Thor as being an entire league above Beta Ray Bill personally. Hence why, I find it rather silly, for anyone to claim that Norrin can put him out of a fight with two blows, and a board to the back of the head.
Originally posted by Blanket
I know. However, he seems more powerful/durable (Surfer), and again, didn't seem fazed in the least by Beta's attack, as well as he was already plotting out its course before he hit the ship.
It's your opinion if Silver Surfer seems more powerful/durable. He definitely was effected. He was sent flying. Just because it wasn't stated his in pain doesn't mean it's the case. Thor knocked him down with a blow and even momentarily knocked him out, and he didn't comment on it. Plotting the course has what to do with anything?
Originally posted by Blanket
He was in a fetal position...
He was talking because in the last panel he was already rising. IE waking up.
That seemed to be Silver Surfer energy containing him. It was encompassing him. The moment that energy stopped, he was already talking. I don't see where this waking up crap is coming from. He should have been able to easily counter it with Stormbreaker. He fought more like a brick.
Originally posted by Blanket
We also don't know if that was actually an energy attack, or just energy coming off Surfer, seeing as how there was a hell of a lot of random energy... I mean, for some reason Surfer had the SS aura after he got knocked off his board by Scuttlebutt.
Seemed to be an energy attack. It was engulfing Beta Ray Bill.
Originally posted by Blanket
Oh?
Anyway, he also tried two more attacks on Beta that we saw, which was two full haymakers more than he did to Hulk?
Yup. Two punches two his face and a board to the neck, would put down Beta Ray Bill? That's utter crap. Something had to happen off panel.
Originally posted by Blanket
Kind of. It's just something to look at.
He hasn't done anything to make it relevant though.
Originally posted by Blanket
k
Cool.
BTW no, I'm not going to go wall of text to wall of text with you... after this. 🙂
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusK, it's my opinion that Surfer seems more powerful. 🙂
It's your opinion if Silver Surfer seems more powerful/durable. He definitely was effected. He was sent flying. Just because it wasn't stated his in pain doesn't mean it's the case. Thor knocked him down with a blow and even momentarily knocked him out, and he didn't comment on it. Plotting the course has what to do with anything?
He definitely got sent flying, but that means nothing in regards to durability. You can't assume he's in pain when nothing was said/Surfer was talking casually/shown of it... just like you can't assume there's more to the battle just because you don't like the results. 😬
Umm... you ignored what I said again. Read this again:
Originally posted by Blanket
When Surfer actually shows pain, or it says it, he's in pain.
Plotting the course has to do with it because he was figuring out where to put his board WHILE he was flying back from Beta's two hits. Me thinks you need a clear mind to do so... but what do I know?
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
That seemed to be Silver Surfer energy containing him. It was encompassing him. The moment that energy stopped, he was already talking. I don't see where this waking up crap is coming from. He should have been able to easily counter it with Stormbreaker. He fought more like a brick.
Because he was in the fetal position with his head down. I can see how that'd be crap...
How would he be able to counter it when his hands aren't even around Stormbreaker, and he's in the fetal position?
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusDoes that mean that Surfer was using an energy attack after he was stunned by Scuttlebutt?
Seemed to be an energy attack. It was engulfing Beta Ray Bill.
Seems can be a lot of things.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusApparently. I mean, it's not like getting hit in the back of your head throws off your equilibrium and can cause you to get KO'ed, and make you get KO'ed easier or anything... especially when you're not suspecting it... ermm
Yup. Two punches two his face and a board to the neck, would put down Beta Ray Bill? That's utter crap. Something had to happen off panel.
It's in the same field as cheapshots. You will go down from one (or in Beta's case, that and follow ups).
If you think him going down to that is crap, then I don't even want to know what you think Beta's average durability is...
That's your opinion that something had to happen off panel. 🙂
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusHe's had some impressive showings, and has a few durability feats to make it interesting.
He hasn't done anything to make it relevant though.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusK
Cool.
Originally posted by Blanket
BTW no, I'm not going to go wall of text to wall of text with you... after this. 🙂
K.
Originally posted by Blanket
K, it's my opinion that Surfer seems more powerful. 🙂
Cool. I think an argument can be made for either really. Personally I see Silver Surfer winning, the slight majority, but that’s just me.
Originally posted by Blanket
He definitely got sent flying, but that means nothing in regards to durability. You can't assume he's in pain when nothing was said/Surfer was talking casually/shown of it... just like you can't assume there's more to the battle just because you don't like the results. 😬
Really? I think the fact that Beta Ray Bill struck him, and he is comparable to Thor in strength should warrant the fact, that his blows would affect Silver Surfer. Just because he doesn’t monologue about the blows affecting him, doesn’t mean they don’t. The Silver Surfer, doesn’t indicate every time his in pain.
I’m assuming that there is more to the battle, because it went on off panel and we saw the Silver Surfer containing Beta Ray Bill. That’s not where we left them.
You’re telling me, you think two blows and a board to the back of his head would be enough to take out Beta Ray Bill? Bullshit. But seeing as that you’re the same idiot who thinks every time Thor has been shown stalemating the Hulk (Which is every single encounter.) plot induced stupidity, what more can I expect?
Originally posted by Blanket
Umm... you ignored what I said again. Read this again:
What would you constitute, as showing pain? A grimace, bleeding? I mean, Thor knocks him down, and he lies there for a few panels, talking and he doesn’t comment on pain.
Originally posted by Blanket
Obviously if he's KO'ed, then that means he did something. 😬
Beta however, didn't.
By the same being who Beta Ray Bill is comparable to in strength.
I’d say knocking him down and so on would be mean he did something.
Originally posted by Blanket
Plotting the course has to do with it because he was figuring out where to put his board WHILE he was flying back from Beta's two hits. Me thinks you need a clear mind to do so... but what do I know?
Like I said, it doesn’t mean shit. Silver Surfer has been attacked by a blood lusted Thor before, and was being chocked etc. and he was able to co-ordinate the board taking Beta Ray Bill’s body to safety.
Originally posted by Blanket
He was rising the panel before... of course the next logical thing would be for him to be talking.
Where do you see him rising? Silver Surfer was using the energy to encompass him. Tells him to not rise and so on. Energy stops, as Beta Ray Bill stops talking.
Originally posted by Blanket
Because he was in the fetal position with his head down. I can see how that'd be crap...
And that indicates he was out of it? It’s pretty clear the Silver Surfer was attempting to use the energy to keep him down. He even tells him to not rise while his applying it, which would indicate that Beta Ray Bill could counter it, and is not out of it.
You can’t even see his face, to indicate whether or not his out.
While we are on the specific instance. Weren’t the Silver Surfer’s hands still glowing even after the energy stopped encompassing Beta Ray Bill? Did they not stop glowing, when Beta Ray Bill was grasping Stormbreaker? Wouldn’t that indicate that the Silver Surfer, attempted to contain him, yet Beta Ray Bill was able to counter it?
Originally posted by Blanket
How would he be able to counter it when his hands aren't even around Stormbreaker, and he's in the fetal position?
His hand was touching Stormbreaker. All he would have to do is clench his fist. And seeing as how the energy was encompassing him, all it would take was for him to will Stormbreaker to create a Force Field. Again, Beta Ray Bill was thinking like a brick for some reason at that moment.
Originally posted by Blanket
Does that mean that Surfer was using an energy attack after he was stunned by Scuttlebutt?
What does that have to do with my statement at all?
Originally posted by Blanket
Seems can be a lot of things.
Isn’t the entire argument centered around it?
Originally posted by Blanket Apparently. I mean, it's not like getting hit in the back of your head throws off your equilibrium and can cause you to get KO'ed, and make you get KO'ed easier or anything... especially when you're not suspecting it... ermm
So throwing of your equilibrium would reduce your ability would reduce your ability to take hits that drastically? You think that can justify your opinion that Silver Surfer, someone who Beta Ray Bill rivals in power, can put him down in just two follow up blows? When didn't even seem like he was trying when he hit them those two times? Bull.
I must be superhuman as I’ve been hit in the back of the head, and had follow up hits, and still managed to beat the crap out of a dude bigger and most likely stronger than me.
Originally posted by Blanket
It's in the same field as cheapshots. You will go down from one (or in Beta's case, that and follow ups).
K.
Originally posted by Blanket
If you think him going down to that is crap, then I don't even want to know what you think Beta's average durability is...
You mean going down to two blows and a board attack, when his nearly as powerful as Thor? Yes it’s crap.
Originally posted by Blanket
That's your opinion that something had to happen off panel. 🙂
The fact that we saw them again in a different situation than were we left them, would indicate that.
Originally posted by Blanket
He's had some impressive showings, and has a few durability feats to make it interesting.
K
Impressive compared to who? The Skaar fight has no importance when we’re dealing with characters with these type of showings.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
K.Cool. I think an argument can be made for either really. Personally I see Silver Surfer winning, the slight majority, but that’s just me.
Really? I think the fact that Beta Ray Bill struck him, and he is comparable to Thor in strength should warrant the fact, that his blows would affect Silver Surfer. Just because he doesn’t monologue about the blows affecting him, doesn’t mean they don’t. The Silver Surfer, doesn’t indicate every time his in pain.
I’m assuming that there is more to the battle, because it went on off panel and we saw the Silver Surfer containing Beta Ray Bill. That’s not where we left them.
You’re telling me, you think two blows and a board to the back of his head would be enough to take out Beta Ray Bill? Bullshit. But seeing as that you’re the same idiot who thinks every time Thor has been shown stalemating the Hulk (Which is every single encounter.) plot induced stupidity, what more can I expect?
What would you constitute, as showing pain? A grimace, bleeding? I mean, Thor knocks him down, and he lies there for a few panels, talking and he doesn’t comment on pain.
By the same being who Beta Ray Bill is comparable to in strength.
I’d say knocking him down and so on would be mean he did something.Like I said, it doesn’t mean shit. Silver Surfer has been attacked by a blood lusted Thor before, and was being chocked etc. and he was able to co-ordinate the board taking Beta Ray Bill’s body to safety.
Where do you see him rising? Silver Surfer was using the energy to encompass him. Tells him to not rise and so on. Energy stops, as Beta Ray Bill stops talking.
And that indicates he was out of it? It’s pretty clear the Silver Surfer was attempting to use the energy to keep him down. He even tells him to not rise while his applying it, which would indicate that Beta Ray Bill could counter it, and is not out of it.
You can’t even see his face, to indicate whether or not his out.
While we are on the specific instance. Weren’t the Silver Surfer’s hands still glowing even after the energy stopped encompassing Beta Ray Bill? Did they not stop glowing, when Beta Ray Bill was grasping Stormbreaker? Wouldn’t that indicate that the Silver Surfer, attempted to contain him, yet Beta Ray Bill was able to counter it?His hand was touching Stormbreaker. All he would have to do is clench his fist. And seeing as how the energy was encompassing him, all it would take was for him to will Stormbreaker to create a Force Field. Again, Beta Ray Bill was thinking like a brick for some reason at that moment.
What does that have to do with my statement at all?
Isn’t the entire argument centered around it?
So throwing of your equilibrium would reduce your ability would reduce your ability to take hits that drastically? You think that can justify your opinion that Silver Surfer, someone who Beta Ray Bill rivals in power, can put him down in just two follow up blows? When didn't even seem like he was trying when he hit them those two times? Bull.
I must be superhuman as I’ve been hit in the back of the head, and had follow up hits, and still managed to beat the crap out of a dude bigger and most likely stronger than me.
K.
You mean going down to two blows and a board attack, when his nearly as powerful as Thor? Yes it’s crap.
The fact that we saw them again in a different situation than were we left them, would indicate that.
Impressive compared to who? The Skaar fight has no importance when we’re dealing with characters with these type of showings.
Originally posted by darthgoober
You seem to be basing a lot of your reasoning for why the Surfer/Bill fight would have to be poorly written(without a lot of off panel action) on Blood and Thunder, but the Surfer/BRB fight could just as easily be seen as proof that Thor's performance against Surfer in Blood and Thunder is poorly written(or that Thor was amped 😉 ).
Not basing it on just Silver Surfer and Thor's interactions but on the fact that Beta Ray Bill is supposed to be a near physical equal of Thor (Shit, Galactus, Odin, and Celestials have failed to put Thor down with their attacks even when pissed/merciless.). Based on that, their should be more off panel action or it's silly.
And I believe the fact that we saw them after from a different situation than we left them would mean that there was more off panel.
You could argue that except that it happened more than once, in different issues, with different writers if I recall and it doesn't go against a character's power set based from what I've seen.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Not basing it on just Silver Surfer and Thor's interactions but on the fact that Beta Ray Bill is supposed to be a near physical equal of Thor (Shit, Galactus, Odin, and Celestials have failed to put Thor down with their attacks even when pissed/merciless.). Based on that, their should be more off panel action or it's silly.And I believe the fact that we saw them after from a different situation than we left them would mean that there was more off panel.
You could argue that except that it happened more than once, in different issues, with different writers if I recall and it doesn't go against a character's power set based from what I've seen.
If they didn't tell us there was more fighting, we can't assume there was. That's not to say that they didn't shift positions or anything like that, but we can't just assume that anything of note happened.
Surfer's been portrayed as being more powerful than Bill on more than one occasion now. He was also portrayed as such during the assault on Tyrant from what I remember, and that was before Annihilation.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympuslol, not only is that irrelevant in a different conversation, but I was also joking, the whole time, and you felt the need to argue it, the whole time.. 😂
But seeing as that you’re the same idiot who thinks every time Thor has been shown stalemating the Hulk (Which is every single encounter.) plot induced stupidity, what more can I expect?
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusUmm, ya?
So throwing of your equilibrium would reduce your ability would reduce your ability to take hits that drastically? You think that can justify your opinion that Silver Surfer, someone who Beta Ray Bill rivals in power, can put him down in just two follow up blows? When didn't even seem like he was trying when he hit them those two times? Bull.I must be superhuman as I’ve been hit in the back of the head, and had follow up hits, and still managed to beat the crap out of a dude bigger and most likely stronger than me.
Actually, I'm trying to explain how it could happen to someone who so vehemently disagrees, in the most reasonable way possible, but even then you think Beta should be standing strong...
Oh? Not to cockstroke, but I've been hit in the chin and it didn't KO/rock me. Does that mean that the chin isn't an easier target to KO someone with? No... no it doesn't.
Just like your 'Nobody knows but me' feat.
If you get hurt, stunned, or rocked from getting hit in the back of the head, then you will be an easier target to get KO'ed from. There is less protection, there is an area where there is no skull protecting you.
For a simple test, just smack the back of your head. However hard you want. Then smack the front. Unless you're lying, then the back will feel like a lot more pressure was being used.
etc, something.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Shouldn't the same apply in regards to Blood and Thunder though? If Surfer's taken more from tougher, doesn't that indicate that Thor shouldn't put him down like that? Not that I'm trying to sidetrack the discussion, but you were referencing Thor beating Surfer before in your argument with Bran about Surfer/Bill it seems like a relevant point.If they didn't tell us there was more fighting, we can't assume there was. That's not to say that they didn't shift positions or anything like that, but we can't just assume that anything of note happened.
Surfer's been portrayed as being more powerful than Bill on more than one occasion now. He was also portrayed as such during the assault on Tyrant from what I remember, and that was before Annihilation.
Except Thor's raw power and strength has been shown to put down Skyfathers, hurt Galactus and even send him running for his life, damage Celestials with his blows etc. so I don't see how it's far fetched to assume he cannot put down Norrin when blood lusted especially since sufficient strength/power has been able to put him down in the past. On the other hand, Thor has been able to withstand assaults form a pissed of Odin, merciless Celestials, a pissed of Galactus and keep on coming. If someone whose almost his equal physically is put down in two blows and a board to the back of the head, by a Silver Surfer whose clearly holding back and doesn't even seem to be freaking trying, then yes, something's wrong there. It's all good.
Do I have to post examples of when it was never told that there was more fighting but there clearly was more fighting? Just because they never stated it, doesn't mean there isn't. We left them in one situation, and returned to fight another completely different situation, which would indicate that something happened.
I give Surfer 6/10 against Bill, of course an argument can be made by Bill.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Except Thor's raw power and strength has been shown to put down Skyfathers, hurt Galactus and even send him running for his life, damage Celestials with his blows etc. so I don't see how it's far fetched to assume he cannot put down Norrin when blood lusted especially since sufficient strength/power has been able to put him down in the past. On the other hand, Thor has been able to withstand assaults form a pissed of Odin, merciless Celestials, a pissed of Galactus and keep on coming. If someone whose almost his equal physically is put down in two blows and a board to the back of the head, by a Silver Surfer whose clearly holding back and doesn't even seem to be freaking trying, then yes, something's wrong there. It's all good.Do I have to post examples of when it was never told that there was more fighting but there clearly was more fighting? Just because they never stated it, doesn't mean there isn't. We left them in one situation, and returned to fight another completely different situation, which would indicate that something happened.
I give Surfer 6/10 against Bill, of course an argument can be made by Bill.
Originally posted by Blanket
lol, not only is that irrelevant in a different conversation, but I was also joking, the whole time, and you felt the need to argue it, the whole time.. 😂
Cool. Your not a complete idiot. Props for you.
Originally posted by Blanket
Umm, ya?Actually, I'm trying to explain how it could happen to someone who so vehemently disagrees, in the most reasonable way possible, but even then you think Beta should be standing strong...
Oh? Not to cockstroke, but I've been hit in the chin and it didn't KO/rock me. Does that mean that the chin isn't an easier target to KO someone with? No... no it doesn't.
Just like your 'Nobody knows but me' feat.If you get hurt, stunned, or rocked from getting hit in the back of the head, then you will be an easier target to get KO'ed from. There is less protection, there is an area where there is no skull protecting you.
For a simple test, just smack the back of your head. However hard you want. Then smack the front. Unless you're lying, then the back will feel like a lot more pressure was being used.
etc, something.
Cool.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Except Thor's raw power and strength has been shown to put down Skyfathers, hurt Galactus and even send him running for his life, damage Celestials with his blows etc. so I don't see how it's far fetched to assume he cannot put down Norrin when blood lusted especially since sufficient strength/power has been able to put him down in the past. On the other hand, Thor has been able to withstand assaults form a pissed of Odin, merciless Celestials, a pissed of Galactus and keep on coming. If someone whose almost his equal physically is put down in two blows and a board to the back of the head, by a Silver Surfer whose clearly holding back and doesn't even seem to be freaking trying, then yes, something's wrong there. It's all good.Do I have to post examples of when it was never told that there was more fighting but there clearly was more fighting? Just because they never stated it, doesn't mean there isn't. We left them in one situation, and returned to fight another completely different situation, which would indicate that something happened.
I give Surfer 6/10 against Bill, of course an argument can be made by Bill.
But you're working off an assumption, and no one assumption is better than another. People could just as easily assume that any off panel action was nothing other than Surfer dominating Bill with ease, and there'd be no more evidence to support your theory than there is to support theirs.
I think 7-8/10 for Surfer seems more likely since I'd give him 6/10 over Thor.