Originally posted by Naija boy
The fundamental force of restriction? Honestly in literal terms that hardly means anything at all. It certainly doesnt prove that it would affect exitar. Not even close. No limit fallacies.
How do you figure? You do know what fundamental means right? As far as Exitar goes, what's the source of your confidence?
Originally posted by psycho gundam
according to a concept exclusive to dc comics.batman wouldn't carry that "title" over to marvel if he was transported there.
I was pointing out that significant goes both ways. Also in many ways Batman is more 'significant', even in his placement in the fictional mythos.
Originally posted by Survivor19
You know about concepts of hierarchy of infinities, right?So, what about Exitar can exist in higher-level-infinity of realities, then OS can throw at him?
And 'fundamental' doesn't means shit.
Gravity, time or frigging electricity all are fundamental, and still are Celestials' bitches.
Gravity is fundamental to natural space-time, restriction is an idea or form that exists beyond the natural physical realities.
We're talking fundamental in the philosophical sense i.e. the intangible ideas and forms that exist before the physical interactions.
The fundamental force of restriction is not any natural fundamental force like gravity.
and so is wolverine.... big deal.... oh but wait, the celestials were the ones who tampered with humanity that allowed mutation in the first place. without them there wouldn't be any eternals, deviants, skrulls, or mutants.
wanga maximoff is a mutant, by extension the celestials are the prime-movers of everything she's ever done.
Originally posted by psycho gundam
and so is wolverine.... big deal.... oh but wait, the celestials were the ones who tampered with humanity that allowed mutation in the first place. without them there wouldn't be any eternals, deviants, skrulls, or mutants.wanga maximoff is a mutant, by extension the celestials are the prime-movers of everything she's ever done.
🙂 I know that. But I hope you're not going to argue that Batman's role as a keystone isn't more significant. Or the role he plays above and beyond fiction.
Kind of a pointless thing to mention by Thanosi. Even Miracle is certainly more 'significant' in the role he plays and his abiltiy to escape anything as the avatar to the god of freedom. Just a weak argument either way.
Originally posted by psycho gundam
of coarse batman is more significant OUTSIDE of fiction, that's not really up for debate. but within the history of marvel, the celestials are as you put it, "keystone" characters.
To the mutants maybe, have any evidence that they are more than that? As a keystone Batman (as one of the big 3) may be small but has significane at a universal scale. Anyway I made my point significant was a poor word to use.
thats a low feat of the entire dc universe if you ask me.
guys like waverider and rip hunter can go to any point in the universe's history and put all kinds monkey wrenches places, but batman is more significant?
where would bruce wayne be without zoro?
rip hunter could easily tamper with the film so wayne never sees the movie.
Originally posted by Allankles
How do you figure? You do know what fundamental means right? As far as Exitar goes, what's the source of your confidence?
It being the "fundamental force of restriction" means shit. A statement like that is not a substitue for feats and actual displays. How does being the "embodiment of the idea" of restriction or whatever fancy description u would like to use indicate that it would affect Exitar? Thats so fallacious i dont know where to start. First of all its a no limits fallacy to assume that because its the "fundamental force of restriction"it can affect anyone is just silly. Secondly the entire premise is baseless. The precise implications of an attack being "fundamental" have been written nowhere on panel(at least in a marvel comic). Therefore the claim that its a "fundamental" attack isnt justification in and of itself for the attack to even affect ANYONE at all let alone evryone.
Aside the fact that ur argument is inherently nonsensical, Celestials have been portrayed far above universal level reality warpers and hence its highly unlikey that such an attack would work anyways.
Originally posted by Naija boy
Aside the fact that ur argument is inherently nonsensical, Celestials have been portrayed far above universal level reality warpers and hence its highly unlikey that such an attack would work anyways.
Why wouldn't it work? You've yet to provide solid evidence why it wouldn't work on Exitar. What traits does Exitar bring to the table to prevent himself from being imprisoned?
Let's get this straight, OS is a prison that uses the fabric of reality to imprison a target, it has feats that indicate it's not hindered by the laws of the physical world e.g. trapping Miracle when he was travelling through/in a blackhole. Again, lets keep the arguments focused.
And please don't post a reply if you're basing things on Exitar supposed 'level', for guy who's a stickler for feats you're being quite liberal with Exitar here. And please don't act like universal reality warping is beyond Exitar's opponents here.
Every which way you look the New Gods have him beat in feats.
Originally posted by kevdude
Worked on Imperiex Prime which is clearly above Exitar 😉
Naija's point was the one I was going to bring up. "Fundamental force of restriction" means absolutely zilch, since...there is no such thing. What would that even equate to IRL, anyway? The Strong Nuclear Force?
Morrison is really going overboard on the hyperbolic verbal vomit.
Originally posted by Naija boy
First of all its a no limits fallacy to assume that because its the "fundamental force of restriction"it can affect anyone is just silly. Secondly the entire premise is baseless. Therefore the claim that its a "fundamental" attack isnt justification in and of itself for the attack to even affect ANYONE at all let alone evryone.
How can it be fallacious when we're talking about Exitar? No one has said it will entrap anyone. there's nothing to suggest it won't trap Exitar since its whole purpose is to trap life forms. There's nothing to suggest OS would fail to entrap Exitar and the only argument I've seen is some ambiguous statement.
We're not talking about relative reality warping (though Exitar doesn't have any feats in that regard either), we're talking about an ever adapting prison that utlizes the 'stuff' of reality to bound its quarry.
There's no reality warping (I didn't even use that term) OS is a reality in of itself - I said it bombards the target with a succesion of varied realities designed to destroy the targets ego.
Originally posted by Enyalus
Morrison is really going overboard on the hyperbolic verbal vomit.
I'm surprised at you. These are simply philosphical ideas of reality. In this case "restriction" is the idea that forms before any physical manifestation. Basicallly everything in the physical world related to imprisoning, binding things etc is dictated by the idea of "restriction" that came before them.
Originally posted by Allankles
I'm surprised at you. These are simply philosphical ideas of reality. In this case "restriction" is the idea that forms before any physical manifestation. Basicallly everything in the physical world related to imprisoning, binding things etc is dictated by the idea of "restriction" that came before them.
Ditto for Dr. Strange. Ditto for several other characters. Exitar wouldn't be able to break free of this restriction because...?
Originally posted by Allankles
[B]Why wouldn't it work? You've yet to provide solid evidence why it wouldn't work on Exitar. What traits does Exitar bring to the table to prevent himself from being imprisoned?
First of all its not my job to prove a negative. Its your job to prove why it would work. You have soundly failed to do so. Further even considering that, i went out of my way and explained that even universal level reality warpers have been portrayed as nothing to exitar. In addition Exitar operates on multiple levels of reality simultaneously. Therefore reality warping attacks (which the OS is in the vein of) arent likely to work on him.
Let's get this straight, OS is a prison that uses the fabric of reality to imprison a target, it has feats that indicate it's not hindered by the laws of the physical world e.g. trapping Miracle when he was travelling through/in a blackhole. Again, lets keep the arguments focused.
What? How does trapping Mr Miracle while he was in blackhole somehow lend credence to ur claim that he can affect exitar? What r u even talking about?
And please don't post a reply if you're basing things on Exitar supposed 'level', for guy who's a stickler for feats you're being quite liberal with Exitar here. And please don't act like universal reality warping is beyond Exitar's opponents here
This isnt Exitars supposed level. This is the confirmed level of celestials on panel. Exitar himself is more powerful than an entire host of celestials. And further please get my argument straight, im not even arguing in favor of exitar in this thread. I was simply pointing out a case of ( to take a page from ur book) "fundamentally" flawed and fallacious reasoning.