Originally posted by Burning thought
Maybe he does have some unique powers, but until Kratos actually uses TK to destroy armies, or until its even implied or stated then he has the powers he has shown, its too far to assume TKing armies to death is even a power aligned with any concept, certainly not War. Its obvious the Gods have many powers, e.g. size control that all of them have and its obvious their alignments are not the only powes they possess, e.g. Poseidon's lightning.The current Gods in GOW are too ambiguous to assume that they dont already have said powers, or were blessed with their powers separately, assuming just because their the god of a certain concept does not mean they have every power of that concept, nor does it mean their powers consist solely of that concept.
Originally posted by The Valiant
Why didn't he just "burn" the army that was fighting the Spartans?
Originally posted by Obsidian Fury
Who is a God of War, if there is no war?
There really wasn't war when Ares fvcked up the Barbarian Army, either.
Originally posted by k1Lla441
because giving this badass spartan blades attatched to chains and letting him do all the dirty work is far cooler.
Yeah, and we saw what happened when he did come down. Why would he do the dirty work? Didn't he find new "gods"--the mortals?
Originally posted by k1Lla441
ahh, i get it. your trying to say that we dont know whether tk is a power that is rightfully assigned to the god of war or if it was just a power that ares has and is not passed down to the next god of war, and we will not be able to prove wether that power is a set power for the god of war or if it was just ares' own personal power.
I should've added someone other than Cloud there. Starkiller isn't exactly going to do much in this battle either. Although I admit I shouldn't have made Sephiroth the reserve of team 2, I don't think he'll have the time to show himself anyway.
Even though it's not brought up, I'll limit Medivh's farsight so he doesn't know Malygos will come if they keep it up long enough. It would take an unfair(er?) turn.
Having read this thread, I've come to understand that the real trouble here isn't the damage that team 2 can inflict, but rather the damage they can take. Malfurion and Cenarius is mostly only good for slowing the enemies down and acting as support. Cenarius can heal others, but that's under the condition that they have injuries and don't get killed before there's a chance to heal.
How I see team 1 forced to act if they want to win, is to protect Medivh. Archimonde has quite decent telekinesis, so can at least keep the lightweights away from the battle. Mighty as Kratos is, from my understanding, his greatest advantage is his physical strength and durability. I don't think he can deal with the full force of team 1.
I've come to realise that Cloud and Starkiller are useless thanks to their low durability. Link, strong as he may be, only weight so much and would be thrown a great distance if struck even only once by Archimonde.
Ganondorf and Kratos would be the ones creating sweat for team 1, both being dangerous enough to weight up for the loss of manpower that Cloud and Starkiller is.
So basically it comes down to who dies first. Medivh or Kratos.
I think you're under estimating Link a bit, or atleast what Link can do when he has Ganon on his side. Even if he gets tossed, Ganon can open a portal for him to return, and he's durable enough that landing won't injure him. With Ganon's ability to move the combatants on team two wherever they need to be, Link has great potential to cause damage to team one.
I also think Ganon's ability to soul-rape will make this fight more even, taking out the lesser enemies on team one before they can really impact the battle. 😐
Cloud and SK, while not incredibly durable, could atleast be used for a short time, and I think Team 2 has the better tacitician, who knows, maybe a lucky strike from SK or Cloud cripples or weakens an enemy enough for them to be done away with by Kratos or Ganon with ease.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
I think you're under estimating Link a bit
And Starkiller
But shes made up her mind without evidence or proof at all that Medihv is simply an incredible force....despite me asking for evidence several times it seems perhaps this evidence either does not exist or the debators for Team 1 are lazy. Malfurion and Cenarius will fail long before CLoud and Starkiller, especially if Cloud is allowed all his materia.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
I think you're under estimating Link a bit, or atleast what Link can do when he has Ganon on his side. Even if he gets tossed, Ganon can open a portal for him to return, and he's durable enough that landing won't injure him. With Ganon's ability to move the combatants on team two wherever they need to be, Link has great potential to cause damage to team one.I also think Ganon's ability to soul-rape will make this fight more even, taking out the lesser enemies on team one before they can really impact the battle. 😐
Cloud and SK, while not incredibly durable, could atleast be used for a short time, and I think Team 2 has the better tacitician, who knows, maybe a lucky strike from SK or Cloud cripples or weakens an enemy enough for them to be done away with by Kratos or Ganon with ease.
Injuring was never the question. Merely keeping him away from the initial battle. The first clash will be the one that decide the outcome more than anything. Given Medivh can create the said wards, Ganon can't bring Link back to the battle through means of magical translocation. He'll have to trust his good ol' two.
I don't think normal debates allow "luck" into the equation though. Any one in team one can one-shot the two, sadly enough. A negative thing I should've thought about.
Originally posted by Burning thought
And StarkillerBut shes made up her mind without evidence or proof at all that Medihv is simply an incredible force....despite me asking for evidence several times it seems perhaps this evidence either does not exist or the debators for Team 1 are lazy. Malfurion and Cenarius will fail long before CLoud and Starkiller, especially if Cloud is allowed all his materia.
No one is asking you to believe what's been mentioned here. I'm not going to buy a book to satisfy your distrust, nor do I think Obsidian will. So again, no one is asking you to believe what we're saying. No one is forcing you to debate Medivh.
So either try believe that you aren't being lied to, or don't debate it. The proof you want, you most likely will not get. Do what you want with that.
Originally posted by Q'Anilia
No one is asking you to believe what's been mentioned here. I'm not going to buy a book to satisfy your distrust, nor do I think Obsidian will. So again, no one is asking you to believe what we're saying. No one is forcing you to debate Medivh.So either try believe that you aren't being lied to, or don't debate it. The proof you want, you most likely will not get. Do what you want with that.
Its not a debate until some real evidence is on the table, until then its more of a discussian of whispered tones where people can claim whatever they like and not be asked for proof.
But in that case, you can keep that notion and ill keep to Starkiller knocking Archimondes head in and then reacting quickly and easily to Medihv and the rest of his opponents with his superior Jedi reflexes and doing similiar things to them, squashing them into pulp, tossin them about the place etc etc
Originally posted by Burning thought
Its not a debate until some real evidence is on the table, until then its more of a discussian of whispered tones where people can claim whatever they like and not be asked for proof.But in that case, you can keep that notion and ill keep to Starkiller knocking Archimondes head in and then reacting quickly and easily to Medihv and the rest of his opponents with his superior Jedi reflexes and doing similiar things to them, squashing them into pulp, tossin them about the place etc etc
Or people can trust in others. There's no unwritten rule that proof has to be introduced when a debate is taking place. If you don't accept the fact that some might not want to waste real money and time on satisfying you and your beyond reasonable expectations for proof, that's your problem.
People don't have to debate me. I'm not forcing anyone to do it. I'm not even asking anyone to do it. If people find my ways of debating, and what things I bring up unreasonable or stupid, they have the liberty of choice. They can ignore me and just discuss it with others who might have proof.
You may keep doing that all you want. If you think I care about your opinion on how I debate and discuss, you're momentously mistaking. The same goes if you think I for some reason will not be fine with how you apparently seem to think the battle will go.
You doubt my knowledge in Galen, Star Wars and the characters in team one, and it's your right to do so. I really don't care what you think.
With that said, either stop whining about proof when you debate me and instead trust my words, or don't debate me at all.
Originally posted by Q'Anilia
Or people can trust in others. There's no unwritten rule that proof has to be introduced when a debate is taking place. If you don't accept the fact that some might not want to waste real money and time on satisfying you and your beyond reasonable expectations for proof, that's your problem.People don't have to debate me. I'm not forcing anyone to do it. I'm not even asking anyone to do it. If people find my ways of debating, and what things I bring up unreasonable or stupid, they have the liberty of choice. They can ignore me and just discuss it with others who might have proof.
You may keep doing that all you want. If you think I care about your opinion on how I debate and discuss, you're momentously mistaking. The same goes if you think I for some reason will not be fine with how you apparently seem to think the battle will go.
You doubt my knowledge in Galen, Star Wars and the characters in team one, and it's your right to do so. I really don't care what you think.
With that said, either stop whining about proof when you debate me and instead trust my words, or don't debate me at all.
Or I just ignore your whining for the same reason you and nobody else on this forum cares about eachothers opinions, that much is obvious and then simply intercept all your points for my amusement and you can ignore my interception, you need to take into account that I can break your arguments down in my way and on my terms for the sake of others, not just yourself, try not to be so selfish 😉
But anyway, Starkiller takes this by himself, he may need Ganon or Kratos, but just a couple of guys on team 2 are required to beat team 1, if anyone wants to debate this properly then go ahead.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Or I just ignore your whining for the same reason you and nobody else on this forum cares about eachothers opinions, that much is obvious and then simply intercept all your points for my amusement and you can ignore my interception, you need to take into account that I can break your arguments down in my way and on my terms for the sake of others, not just yourself, try not to be so selfish 😉But anyway, Starkiller takes this by himself, he may need Ganon or Kratos, but just a couple of guys on team 2 are required to beat team 1, if anyone wants to debate this properly then go ahead.
I personally can't think of a single occurrence where you've broken an argument down. All you've done in the past is claimed inadequate proof or misinterpretation and then defended it with more often than not illegitimate logic. Anyone can do that.
If anyone is selfish around here, sadly I have to say it's you. Well, egocentric would be more propitiate choice of words. Ever considered including some modesty in your mix of arrogance?
Starkiller doesn't have the power, nor stamina to bring team 1 down on his own. He'd be exhausted after only Archimonde, if he ever could bring him down. He can take out Deathwing and Malfurion one-on-one, but that's it. He'll need significant assistance to push it any further than that.
What you need to remember with your Starkiller point is that there's a significant difference between preforming a Force pull and a Force crush. You seem to think that pulling an object equal crushing it. In truth it's far, far from it.
Originally posted by Obsidian Fury
I personally can't think of a single occurrence where you've broken an argument down. All you've done in the past is claimed inadequate proof or misinterpretation and then defended it with more often than not illegitimate logic. Anyone can do that.If anyone is selfish around here, sadly I have to say it's you. Well, egocentric would be more propitiate choice of words. Ever considered including some modesty in your mix of arrogance?
Starkiller doesn't have the power, nor stamina to bring team 1 down on his own. He'd be exhausted after only Archimonde, if he ever could bring him down. He can take out Deathwing and Malfurion one-on-one, but that's it. He'll need significant assistance to push it any further than that.
What you need to remember with your Starkiller point is that there's a significant difference between preforming a Force pull and a Force crush. You seem to think that pulling an object equal crushing it. In truth it's far, far from it.
Thats what anyone can say, simply to try and downplay anything someone else has done, you tried to do that in the other thread the remember? the one where you looked quite far back to find my most recent of what it was you were trying to prove and it was a shambles? you couldnt actually find it.....
everyone is selfish, theres no debate in that, everyone here would sit and debate a character they want to win and not be interested about the other side unless its the other sides defeat. Why would I require modesty? there is nothing much to be modest about...certianly not in the Games vs forum.
Exausted? you give too much credit, far far too much credit, and no, your making the mistake of comparing pushing or crushing a star destroyer with pushing or crushing Archimonde, if Starkiller did anything with the force that he used on that stardestroyer on Archimonde, hell half, a quarter of that force, he would splatter his head into bits.
And what do you mean stamina? lol......your making it sound like hes going to be jumping around constantly, hes using the force which if under great pressure could strain him, but not in this matchup, Archimonde or otherwise have not the ability to predict him or react to him in the way Jedi precog, or Jedi reflexes could allow him to react to his opponents however with speed and ease.
and I like how you think he can Take malfurion and Deathwing but why not Cenarius?
Originally posted by Burning thought
Exausted? you give too much credit, far far too much credit, and no, your making the mistake of comparing pushing or crushing a star destroyer with pushing or crushing Archimonde, if Starkiller did anything with the force that he used on that stardestroyer on Archimonde, hell half, a quarter of that force, he would splatter his head into bits.And what do you mean stamina? lol......your making it sound like hes going to be jumping around constantly, hes using the force which if under great pressure could strain him, but not in this matchup, Archimonde or otherwise have not the ability to predict him or react to him in the way Jedi precog, or Jedi reflexes could allow him to react to his opponents however with speed and ease.
and I like how you think he can Take malfurion and Deathwing but why not Cenarius?
You give Starkiller too much credit. He put great strain on himself to nudge the Star Destroyer. The difference between a Star Destroyer and Archimonde is that the Star Destroyer doesn't resist.
The best Starkiller can hope for with his Force pull is to knock Archimonde of balance. There's not a single indication that he would splatter his head when he use the move. Not only because of Archimonde's incredible durability, but also because of his unnatural resistance to physical attacks. Starkiller struggle to damage walkers, so he will definitely struggle to tickle Archimonde.
If Starkiller had stopped the Star Destroyer, he would've been worth something in this battle. He couldn't even slow it down with all his strength.
Sorry to say, but Medivh and Deathwing has both shown abnormal reaction and reflexes. Medivh actually has precog and Deathwing has been able to forsee actions before they have happened, and reacted to them. So not only will two characters counter Starkillers advantage, but a third doesn't need to.
- Malfurion would be at the disadvantage of not knowing where Starkiller was before Starkiller will have him tracked down and ready to attack, so Malfurion can not really put up a fight unless he has Archimonde, Medivh or Cenarius to guide him and tell him what to do. If he scouted Starkiller first, which isn't likely, then he has a chance.
- Deathwing has the advantage of speed over Starkiller, and with some luck he could approach him and damage him before Starkiller notice him. If Starkiller is smart and use the cover of the forest and terrain to hide from Deathwing, then he can strike when it's least expected and bring the dragon down. On open ground, I don't see Starkiller having a chance. Deathwing can speedblitz and cover the field in lava, but in this fight, there is barely any open ground.
- Cenarius is huge, durable, can sense Starkiller loooong before he can sense him and create a thunderstorm that will give Starkiller a good run for his money. Wind powerful enough to rip trees up with their roots. Awaken the forest and have Starkiller battle hundreds of trees. Create roots that restrains him and have bolts of lightning strike him. Starkiller will not even see Cenarius before it's game over.
Originally posted by Obsidian Fury´
- Malfurion would be at the disadvantage of not knowing where Starkiller was before Starkiller will have him tracked down and ready to attack, so Malfurion can not really put up a fight unless he has Archimonde, Medivh or Cenarius to guide him and tell him what to do. If he scouted Starkiller first, which isn't likely, then he has a chance.
I don't quite follow you here... I mean Malfurion have to my knowlegde also shown that he is capable of communicating with the land, perhaps not to as great as extent as Cenarius but still enough to know where Starkiller is moving around, and Malfurion is just as capable of Lightning Storm and tree ants summoning as Cenarius.
Originally posted by Obsidian Fury
You give Starkiller too much credit. He put great strain on himself to nudge the Star Destroyer. The difference between a Star Destroyer and Archimonde is that the Star Destroyer doesn't resist.
The best Starkiller can hope for with his Force pull is to knock Archimonde of balance. There's not a single indication that he would splatter his head when he use the move. Not only because of Archimonde's incredible durability, but also because of his unnatural resistance to physical attacks. Starkiller struggle to damage walkers, so he will definitely struggle to tickle Archimonde.
If Starkiller had stopped the Star Destroyer, he would've been worth something in this battle. He couldn't even slow it down with all his strength.Sorry to say, but Medivh and Deathwing has both shown abnormal reaction and reflexes. Medivh actually has precog and Deathwing has been able to forsee actions before they have happened, and reacted to them. So not only will two characters counter Starkillers advantage, but a third doesn't need to.
- Malfurion would be at the disadvantage of not knowing where Starkiller was before Starkiller will have him tracked down and ready to attack, so Malfurion can not really put up a fight unless he has Archimonde, Medivh or Cenarius to guide him and tell him what to do. If he scouted Starkiller first, which isn't likely, then he has a chance.
- Deathwing has the advantage of speed over Starkiller, and with some luck he could approach him and damage him before Starkiller notice him. If Starkiller is smart and use the cover of the forest and terrain to hide from Deathwing, then he can strike when it's least expected and bring the dragon down. On open ground, I don't see Starkiller having a chance. Deathwing can speedblitz and cover the field in lava, but in this fight, there is barely any open ground.
- Cenarius is huge, durable, can sense Starkiller loooong before he can sense him and create a thunderstorm that will give Starkiller a good run for his money. Wind powerful enough to rip trees up with their roots. Awaken the forest and have Starkiller battle hundreds of trees. Create roots that restrains him and have bolts of lightning strike him. Starkiller will not even see Cenarius before it's game over.
Archimonde will not resist, because as soon as Starkiller pushes Archimondes head will be down in his throat. No wonder he couldnt slow it down, he had already manipulated its movement into the ore cannon so his strength is spent by then. Archimonde is not as heavy as a stardestroyer.
A lot of fictional characters have abnormal reactions, unfortunaltey not all of them could keep up with a Jedi/sith.
All 3 have the same weakness, with some minor concentration Starkiller can create more force on their bodies than they can survive and quicker than they can react to nor can they do much against it at all. The can be said for Archimonde and Medihv.