najia was ur last post in response to my post about ss speed with board as opposed to without it? either way i totally agree with basicaly ur whole post. if it was i didnt mean to imply that the surfer without the board is by any means slow or that some of his feats on board cant be translated to combat speed just that its faulty logic to state that just because he can do feat a or feat b on the board that he could accomplish same feats without. could he dodge faster than light objects without board yhea, multiple objects thousands of times that like in the scenario i gave in my last post without board like some others said he could no way with it definitely.
Originally posted by Philosophía
You're suggesting that his on board speed (being able to travel lightyears in moments) is the same as his h2h combat ?Cool. Show me scans of Surfer fighting, h2h, at milions of times lightspeed.
Originally posted by Raptor22
najia was ur last post in response to my post about ss speed with board as opposed to without it? either way i totally agree with basicaly ur whole post. if it was i didnt mean to imply that the surfer without the board is by any means slow or that some of his feats on board cant be translated to combat speed just that its faulty logic to state that just because he can do feat a or feat b on the board that he could accomplish same feats without. could he dodge faster than light objects without board yhea, multiple objects thousands of times that like in the scenario i gave in my last post without board like some others said he could no way with it definitely.
No it wasnt. I understand what ur saying and its quite in line with my argument.
Originally posted by Juntai
According the comic, iirc, he wasn't using it.
Originally posted by Naija boy
😛 I actually think surfer loses this match.While i dont really agree with the arguments that completely equate SS travel/speed with his combat/reflex speed in battle, those who are comparing SS to the likes of thor and green lantern are idiots. (though i dont think u were one of them). SS may not have a bevy of h2h blitz feats, but unlike GLs and Thor, he does have very impressive speedblitz feats in which he uses his blasts. Something which neither Gls nor thor are capable of doing. Moreover in the event that they are capable of performing such in battle, then it would be evidence of combat speed/
The above feats are similar to blitzes performed by superman and flash with the only difference being that he used BLASTS and not physical attacks. Note that these feats were performed [B]in battle
and hence are extremely relevant in terms of SS combat speed. However, the presence of his board(which i assume wont be avaiilable in this match) reduces but doesnt totally remove their relevance in his match. Ill explain why. While SS board is what is responsible for the superfast movement seen in those scans, it is SS in battle reactions and reflexes that enabled him to initiate and dodge multiple attacks while operating at superspeed. Further while initiating and directing blasts doesnt require as much limb movement as punching, it DOES require some limb movement and hence that is an indication that SS CAN move his limbs at superspeed. Now while i certainly wouldnt give him the victory in a pure h2h match against a character like flash whose method of attack is physically blitzing people with punches (as opposed to blitzing with blasts like SS) it is absolutely inane to somehow ignore such examples of clear all round combat speed and begin to claim that SS has only travel speed which is useless in combat. Yes his board DOES provide him with his ultra fast movement speed (which he would need to have a chance at winning this h2h match) but he DOES have the ability to move his limbs at superspeed as well as react at superspeed.Further proof of my point about superfast limb movement in addition to the superfast movement while on his board can be seen in other feats such as his bullrush of nova in which he hits grabs and throws nova (limb movement) so fast that nova (a speedster himeself) is totally unaware of what happened and asks iof he was hit by an energy blast.
It can also be seen in his stoppage of ganyemede (a FTL character) speedblitz with a backhand slap. (note this blitz was only possible after the initial cheapshot ganyemede landed on surfer.)Therefore to reiterate it once again, surfer DOES lose this match (especially do to his reduced superfast movement caused by the lack of his board) he does have the ability to move his limbs at speeds necessary to initiate and direct attacks at superspeed while moving on his board (which he has shown in battle) and hence the belief that he has simply "travel speed" which is useless in combat is completely nonsesical. [/B]
Surfer has a good chance if he bullrushes him off the bat. A Nova or IG-like blitz ends this in one shot, no need for a repeated H2H engagement. However, I don't see Surfer resorting to that 10/10 times, or even for a majority...which is why he loses too, IMO.
Originally posted by EnyalusSurfer has a good chance if he bullrushes him off the bat. A Nova or IG-like blitz ends this in one shot, no need for a repeated H2H engagement. However, I don't see Surfer resorting to that 10/10 times, or even for a majority...which is why he loses too, IMO.
Hmm is SS board available in this match? If so then it would be a much closer fight than what i envisioned but SS would still lose IMO. A bullrush as u described would indeed end it though.
Originally posted by leonidas
that's such a tired old forum cliche that really makes no sense. answer this:can ss perceive and react to motion several 1000s of x the speed of light? can he move his body several 1000s of x the speed of light?
so, if he can react to things that fast, and if he can move that fast, explain to me why he couldn't fight at those speeds h2h? because there is no direct scan showing it? where are thanos's speed feats? why isn't he blitzed by ss and anyone else with speed? the argument is oldand lame, but cling to it if you need to. i'll stand by common sense.
unless i don't feel like it . . . 😖hifty:
Looking at it that way I guess that means Black Panther, Alicia Masters, Red Hulk, and Mister Fantastic (and other FF members)must all have the same FTL perception considering that they have all traveled on the board just fine and saw everything.
Guys like Batman, Captain America, and even Batgirl has feats that make Surfer looks like a fool on foot.
Originally posted by AvlonIf they were traveling through atmosphere, they weren't going FTL. Regardless, one could also ask why weren't they blown off the board in the first place from air resistance; or if it was FTL in space, how were they breathing? Most likely, these are details writers simply don't bother with just like how characters can talk to each other in soundless vacuum, or how the silvery Surfer rarely reflects his environment (eg, he should look all starry in space).
Looking at it that way I guess that means Black Panther, Alicia Masters, Red Hulk, and Mister Fantastic (and other FF members)must all have the same FTL perception considering that they have all traveled on the board just fine and saw everything.
Guys like Batman, Captain America, and even Batgirl has feats that make Surfer looks like a fool on foot.Hey, Norrin doesn't even have presence of mind to hover whenever he's knocked offboard.
Seriously, though, this would have to do with expectations of characters I mentioned in a prior post. Even where Surfer is doing that 1-hand cartwheel to avoid Cyborg's eyebeams seemed more like something the guys you mentioned would do (and why I found the maneuver odd, especially in space).
Originally posted by Mindship
If they were traveling through atmosphere, they weren't going FTL. Regardless, one could also ask why weren't they blown off the board in the first place from air resistance; or if it was FTL in space, how were they breathing? Most likely, these are details writers simply don't bother with just like how characters can talk to each other in soundless vacuum, or how the silvery Surfer rarely reflects his environment (eg, he should look all starry in space).
I agree to a certain extent on this which is why I didn't get into all the extra details...however, the original point stands... they were able to see and process their traveling (and not always in atmosphere)just fine.
Even if in atmosphere, when on a board, whatever passenger is with surfer (or if they 'jacked' the board) has no problem navigating it.
There is no solid proof of Surfer having any true superspeed. 30+ years of comics have shown that he is enhanced, but never anything remotely close to an actual speedster.
Steel and Superboy don't have FTL reflexes and they have rode on and navigated a FTL asteroid on their own with no problem. Superboy HAS however shown true physical superspeed on his own...
Originally posted by Mindship
Hey, Norrin doesn't even have presence of mind to hover whenever he's knocked offboard.
Which makes even more fights against his favor since CIS is a part of forum rules. Surfer doesn't think his way through battles like Flash tends to do.
Originally posted by Mindship
Seriously, though, this would have to do with expectations of characters I mentioned in a prior post. Even where Surfer is doing that 1-hand cartwheel to avoid Cyborg's eyebeams seemed more like something the guys you mentioned would do (and why I found the maneuver odd, especially in space).
That's the same crossover where Kyle drained Thanos of his energy and Surfer couldn't absorb GL energy directly.