Pirates vs Ninjas (seriously)

Originally posted by dadudemon
Which exactly what I've been arguing about with Ms. Marvel for a page. 😐

Already been covered. 😐

You goof. They had specializations. Some were assassins, Some were recon, Some were special thieves, etc.

Where's your evidence that they were first and formast info. gatherers?

You mean dishonored Samurai who refused to commit Sepuku, right?

Except, that it doesn't.

Proper scenario is the one I setup. Find it. 😐

Na, you've still got the boyhood 'ninja pwn all' fantasy in your blood, admit it.

Missed it.

History states they were mostly spies and intel gatherers, for a price of course.

Not always the case, in times of long peace, [lower] Samurai were let go, as there was no need to feed, board and pay them when there wasn't an enemy to fight or that much protection was needed. So those Samurai being skilled men, turned to other work until they could find themselves another Lord to work under.

Yeah, it does. There's a reason why guns are the staple of a modern military and swords aren't. (They're better)

Not going to look up, besides, who says YOU make the scenario.

Originally posted by Robtard
Na, you've still got the boyhood 'ninja pwn all' fantasy in your blood, admit it.

Missed it.

[QUOTE=12083135]Originally posted by Robtard
[B]History states they were mostly spies and intel gatherers, for a price of course.

Source?

Originally posted by Robtard
Not always the case, in times of long peace, [lower] Samurai were let go, as there was no need to feed, board and pay them when there wasn't an enemy to fight or that much protection was needed. So those Samurai being skilled men, turned to other work until they could find themselves another Lord to work under.

You need to cite some sources for that.

Originally posted by Robtard
Yeah, it does. There's a reason why guns are the staple of a modern military and swords aren't. (They're better)

I'll take the weapons employed by ninjas over a flint lock pistol, any day. 😐

Originally posted by Robtard
Not going to look up, besides, who says YOU make the scenario.

You should. I make the scenario because I made it more real world than this 2 mile island B.S.

But, if you wanna win, you can.

Reality is, real ninjas would wipe the floor with real pirates. They are better in everyway possible, when it comes to killing.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Reality is, real ninjas would wipe the floor with real pirates. They are better in everyway possible, when it comes to killing.

apparently not, considering theyre only affective when theyre hiding in the shadows. theyd got slaughtered in open warfare so its not really fair to say "every" way possible.

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
apparently not, considering theyre only affective when theyre hiding in the shadows. theyd got slaughtered in open warfare so its not really fair to say "every" way possible.

"effective"

And Naruto is better than One Piece...

Originally posted by Bardock42
"effective"

And Naruto is better than One Piece...

That is coreeeect.

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
apparently not, considering theyre only affective when theyre hiding in the shadows. theyd got slaughtered in open warfare so its not really fair to say "every" way possible.

Surprise attack, in broad daylight, when overwhelmed by a much larger enemy force.

So I'll give you that when overwhelmed, on a suprise attack, they are not superior killers. 😐

Originally posted by dadudemon
That is coreeeect.

Surprise attack, in broad daylight, when overwhelmed by a much larger enemy force.

So I'll give you that when overwhelmed, on a suprise attack, they are not superior killers. 😐

"correeeect".

Originally posted by dadudemon
Source?

You need to cite some sources for that.

I'll take the weapons employed by ninjas over a flint lock pistol, any day. 😐

You should. I make the scenario because I made it more real world than this 2 mile island B.S.

But, if you wanna win, you can.

Reality is, real ninjas would wipe the floor with real pirates. They are better in everyway possible, when it comes to killing.

Not going to bother looking up what I read, watched about years ago. Don't care that much to prove my point.

That would be silly, as pirates just didn't use flintlock pistols. They had flintlock pistols, rifles; the blunderbus (grandfather of the shotgun), rapiers, cutlass, cleaver, various throwing and fighting knifes, clubs, boarding axe, explosives like the grenado (archaic grenade) and other makeshifts of the type.

I was going on a neutral standpoint. Like a face off.

No, they're not really. Pirates were murderers, thieves and soldiers and they often clashed with the military powers of the day and won.

I saw this show where they got a real ninjistu master, and he actually successfully pulled off an instant death blow technique from those stories (on a dummy, of course).

But then again, in this scenario the pirates have a ship with cannons, plus stuff such as pistols, muskets, blunderbusses, etc.

Originally posted by Robtard
Not going to bother looking up what I read.watched about years ago.

Well, in that case:

The ninjas successfully fought off Portuguese pirates, without a problem. They had no losses. They waited for the pirates to dock, then they sabotaged their ships when they were sleeping, and they killed all of the leaders. They even poisened the food that the pirates crews ate, almost completely wiping them out.

Note: They waited for them to dock. This is real world, so that's how they would do it. None of this sea battle shite.

Originally posted by Robtard
That would be silly, as pirates just didn't use flintlock pistols. They had flintlock pistols, rifles; the blunderbus (grandfather of the shotgun), rapiers, cutlass, cleaver, various throwing and fighting knifes, clubs, boarding axe, explosives like the grenado (archaic grenade) and other makeshifts of the type.

Irrelevant if they're dead and therefore unable to use them, now isn't it?

Originally posted by Robtard
I was going on a neutral standpoint. Like a face off.

No, they're not really. Pirates were murderers, thieves and soldiers and they often clashed with the military powers of the day and won.

Right. The same militaries that fired a volley..waited to be shot at...fired a volley, waited to be shot at, etc. Sign me up for pirating! ARRRRGH!

Sign me up for the Navy's that also did the following:

"I say, there good sir. You wouldn't happen to be pirates, would you?"

"Nope. We be employees of a rich merchant. ARRRRRR!"

"Alright then. I'll have a go at this fine brandy. Good day to you."

*explosions, boarding, and pillaging ensues*

You know what's funny? That's fairly close to real world. Pirates would parade a flag of another nation to hide their piraty goodness. That was just one of the many tactics they used at sea. This lead to British ships questioning many of the occupants of other ships.

I highly doubt that pirates actually sought out battles with professional British ships.

^Childish.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
I highly doubt that pirates actually sought out battles with professional British ships.

If they outnumbered them, yes, much loot, weapons and ransom victims aboard a military ship.

But they had to fight them or die at times, when fleeing wasn't an option.

I guess that if a pirate captain with 10 ships finds a lone ship with 10 soldiers on it, then yeah sure. But unlike the movies criminals generally try to run AWAY from the authorities. The mafia didn't openly reveal themselves in public and assault military bases.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
I highly doubt that pirates actually sought out battles with professional British ships.

What Robtard said:

Originally posted by Robtard
If they outnumbered them, yes, much loot, weapons and ransom victims aboard a military ship.

But they had to fight them or die at times, when fleeing wasn't an option.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
I guess that if a pirate captain with 10 ships finds a lone ship with 10 soldiers on it, then yeah sure. But unlike the movies criminals generally try to run AWAY from the authorities. The mafia didn't openly reveal themselves in public and assault military bases.

Right. The "authorities" knew EXACTLY who the pirates were because of the huge numbers of people that escapted to divulge all information on the pirates that just slaughtered them and took the loot, right? See wut I did there?

Originally posted by dadudemon
Surprise attack, in broad daylight, when overwhelmed by a much larger enemy force.

So I'll give you that when overwhelmed, on a surprise attack, they are not superior killers. 😐

in a one on one fight in broad daylight a pirate would win as well.

in fact. the only way a ninja can win is if the pirate(s) are not aware of the ninja's presence and the visibility of the area is low.

so that being said pirates can actually win in more scenarios as there is only one very specific situation a ninja can succeed in. thats why a i find it kind of funny that you seem to put pirates winning via surprise attack in a negative light. pirates can win by surprising ninja and can win in open warfare whereas a ninja can only win if he takes the pirate by surprise and visibility is low enough for the ninja to duck back into the shadows before a counter-attack can be made.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
I guess that if a pirate captain with 10 ships finds a lone ship with 10 soldiers on it, then yeah sure. But unlike the movies criminals generally try to run AWAY from the authorities. The mafia didn't openly reveal themselves in public and assault military bases.

dont let fiction like pirates of the Caribbean fool you. most pirates were not constantly drunk embittered middle aged and old people with missing limbs. pirates were deadly fighters who were sly and very intelligent. they were more then a match for the "authorities" when the numbers were equal.

Originally posted by Bardock42
"effective"

And Naruto is better than One Piece...

Only the dub knewbxor!

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
in a one on one fight in broad daylight a pirate would win as well.

That's like saying a tank would destroy a submarine, if they were both on land.

Retarded.

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
in fact. the only way a ninja can win is if the pirate(s) are not aware of the ninja's presence and the visibility of the area is low.

No, they could win in many other ways, too. That's just one of a thousand different ways a ninja could kill you. 😐 😆

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
so that being said pirates can actually win in more scenarios

Nah.

The Ninjas win in any scenario except overwhelming numbers and at sea...considering they would never be at sea, doing battle with a pirate ship.

Thinking about it, it 's a stupid match-up beacuse the Ninja's would operate on land in their primary attack methods, and pirates would be at sea.

Shitty match-up.

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
dont let fiction like pirates of the Caribbean fool you. most pirates were not constantly drunk embittered middle aged and old people with missing limbs. pirates were deadly fighters who were sly and very intelligent. they were more then a match for the "authorities" when the numbers were equal.

Nah. They were much worse and much less resourceful. awesome

Originally posted by dadudemon
That's like saying a tank would destroy a submarine, if they were both on land.

Retarded.

and with your "scenario" itd be like saying a submarine can destroy a tank underwater. 😬 also retarded.

No, they could win in many other ways, too. That's just one of a thousand different ways a ninja could kill you. 😐 😆

such as?

Nah.

The Ninjas win in any scenario except overwhelming numbers and at sea...considering they would never be at sea, doing battle with a pirate ship.

why do you keep mentioning " at sea"? ive never mentioned the sea even once nor have i mentioned pirate ships.

Thinking about it, it 's a stupid match-up beacuse the Ninja's would operate on land in their primary attack methods, and pirates would be at sea.

Shitty match-up. [/B]

you basically have a fighter that relies completely on espionage and surprise vs. a fighter that is a vicious open-warfare soldier.

so really no matter what scenario this is put in it will be unfair because pirates bumbling through the night unaware of whats going on is unfair as well as having them asleep in some cabin. at the same time a ninja would get slaughtered by a pirate in an open area.

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
and with your "scenario" itd be like saying a submarine can destroy a tank underwater. 😬 also retarded.

Guess you didn't read my entire post. 😬

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
such as?

Think of something. Then that's what I mean. 😐

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
why do you keep mentioning " at sea"? ive never mentioned the sea even once nor have i mentioned pirate ships.

Because pirates pillage and killl at seeeeaaaaa ARRRRRR!

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
uh... yeah. thats why were all putting them in neutral settings. pirates are very adept at fighting on land as well as the sea so in my opinion it would be fair for both sides if they were fighting on, say, a beach or in a forest or something.

Nah.

Be fair for them to fight at sea and then fair for them to fight at night on land, when all the pirates are asleep. 🙂

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
you basically have a fighter that relies completely on espionage and surprise vs. a fighter that is a vicious open-warfare soldier.

Pirates also used espionage and other intelligent tactics. Deceit was quite common. ARRRRRRR!

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
so really no matter what scenario this is put in it will be unfair because pirates bumbling through the night unaware of whats going on is unfair as well as having them asleep in some cabin. at the same time a ninja would get slaughtered by a pirate in an open area.

Everything you said above is correct...except for that last part. It would be, "slaughtered by a pirate in a boat, out at sea."

I'd think that a gun would be used by the Iga ninjas. They'd at least have some at their HQ. They were just overwhelmed by a surprise attack by a much larger force. Nothing special about that.