How do you obtain your comics?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Being pro-piracy in 2009, based on the ideas that most of you pirate for, is kind of like being anti-marijuana in 2009.

Now, there is just so much evidence to counter the needlessness of your piracy that it's almost ridiculous you'd argue for it.

Every time someone comes up with a factually good argument as to why piracy is shit, you essentially retort with something subjective and hypothetical.

-AC

Eh, which factually good argument was that? I haven't seen a single one. It seems to be "it's like stealing!" and nothing more. And claims that the authors aren't getting what they deserve. Which basically assumes that every comic that's been downloaded is a lost purchase. Which is faaaaaar from the truth.

Originally posted by tjcoady
But you have pretty godawful aesthetic views if you didn't like Milligan's late, great "X-Static"

It's a good comic, I just wasn't a big fan of it 🙂

Originally posted by Blanket
The honest, ethical, and legal way in Canada.

Downloads.

Welcome Back Zooey.

Canada's laws are dumb.

You can't upload, but you can download. I understand what the point is (To target those RESPONSIBLE for downloading being possible), and agree with it, but downloaders are still playing their part.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Eh, which factually good argument was that? I haven't seen a single one. It seems to be "it's like stealing!" and nothing more. And claims that the authors aren't getting what they deserve. Which basically assumes that every comic that's been downloaded is a lost purchase. Which is faaaaaar from the truth.

1) It being stealing is as good an argument as any, for a kick off.

2) Every single thing that I've posted has just about proven that there's literally no excuse for downloading unless it's because you can't be bothered to pay. If that's the only defense you have, that you're a lazy slob who wants shit without having to pay, then admit it at least.

That isn't a good argument though.

The "I can't afford it" one is bs. The "I'm trying before I buy" one is full of more holes than a homosexual at an Alabama N.R.A. meeting.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri

The "I can't afford it" one is bs. The "I'm trying before I buy" one is full of more holes than a homosexual at an Alabama N.R.A. meeting.

-AC

ho ho ho.

It's actually quite hard to hurt a flagship title by refraining to buy it since comic book stores still order a set amount of issues for distributing regardless of whether or not people are going to buy it. The writers and artists change so frequently that there's no reason to cut the amount of orders for those kind of titles. If you look at Uncanny X-Men this decade it's "sales" have remained stagnant through the "good" and the "bad" and all the price raising.

Same goes for movies, they're still breaking box office records even with all the so called piracy out there.

Regardless of that I just stopped buying/viewing trash, I have my few subscriptions, only watch things that I feel are worth my while and am happier for it. Am a bit peeved that my wallet doesn't hurt either industry but I just don't have time any more to care.

P.S. Marvel are also ass hats for making it so difficult for people like me who live in Europe from get their hands on their Annual issues. Thank God for Amazon.

it's legal to dl in canada? awesome.

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
It's actually quite hard to hurt a flagship title by refraining to buy it since comic book stores still order a set amount of issues for distributing regardless of whether or not people are going to buy it. The writers and artists change so frequently that there's no reason to cut the amount of orders for those kind of titles. If you look at Uncanny X-Men this decade it's "sales" have remained stagnant through the "good" and the "bad" and all the price raising.

excellent point.

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
P.S. Marvel are also ass hats for making it so difficult for people like me who live in Europe from get their hands on their Annual issues. Thank God for Amazon.

As an Englishman, I feel your pain.

Its hard to get annual issues in the Uk? Since when?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Canada's laws are dumb.

facepalm

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
1) It being stealing is as good an argument as any, for a kick off.

2) Every single thing that I've posted has just about proven that there's literally no excuse for downloading unless it's because you can't be bothered to pay. If that's the only defense you have, that you're a lazy slob who wants shit without having to pay, then admit it at least.

That isn't a good argument though.

The "I can't afford it" one is bs. The "I'm trying before I buy" one is full of more holes than a homosexual at an Alabama N.R.A. meeting.

-AC

1) No, it's not stealing. Keep it up like a broken record, but piracy is not the same as theft. Piracy is piracy and it's not the same as stealing. Piracy is punished in a different manner according to the law. Stealing is also based on the LOSS of property and a finite number of items.

2) First of all, you have a hard time constructing arguments without trying to project your own impressions of what a pirate looks like and is. A slob is a crude and lazy person. How does this translate to downloading? If anything, they would be immoral or unethical, not lazy. If you're going to try and sneak in some insults at least try and keep 'em in the ballpark.

Now, on to the point. It cannot be proven, in the least. You'er claiming that authors are not paid what they have earned if someone downloads a comic? Incorrect. They have already been paid. You can't make a case for this, they are paid long, long before the comics even hit the stands. The store owners are not paid sufficiently and the company might stand some future economical loss, but even this can be argued. So claiming that writers and artists are not paid what they deserve, is a lie. Further more, you have no way of gauging how much they do deserve, considering all the things that would factor in.

It's not really the matter of wanting to pay or not. I want to pay for some comics, not all.

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
It's actually quite hard to hurt a flagship title by refraining to buy it since comic book stores still order a set amount of issues for distributing regardless of whether or not people are going to buy it. The writers and artists change so frequently that there's no reason to cut the amount of orders for those kind of titles. If you look at Uncanny X-Men this decade it's "sales" have remained stagnant through the "good" and the "bad" and all the price raising.

Same goes for movies, they're still breaking box office records even with all the so called piracy out there.

Regardless of that I just stopped buying/viewing trash, I have my few subscriptions, only watch things that I feel are worth my while and am happier for it. Am a bit peeved that my wallet doesn't hurt either industry but I just don't have time any more to care.

P.S. Marvel are also ass hats for making it so difficult for people like me who live in Europe from get their hands on their Annual issues. Thank God for Amazon.

People who are anti-piracy seem to be completely oblivious to the actual effects it has on the industry. There was no actual increase in pay for small-time comic book writers. Even big-time writers like Joss Whedon do not make a lot of money off of the comics that are sold. They are also paid by the page, so what the hell does sales have to do with their paycheck? The companies have already paid the writers, artists and pencilers, etc. Poor sales might have future consequences but it's not like they get a set percentage out of the sales.

And like you mentioned, stores have a standard amount of comics that they order.

Dude, aren't you from Britain? You have no right to complain! I used to have to drive 3 hours to reach one of the 4 stores in this entire country who sells comics 😄

Originally posted by Kris Blaze

People who are anti-piracy seem to be completely oblivious to the actual effects it has on the industry. There was no actual increase in pay for small-time comic book writers. Even big-time writers like Joss Whedon do not make a lot of money off of the comics that are sold. They are also paid by the page, so what the hell does sales have to do with their paycheck? The companies have already paid the writers, artists and pencilers, etc. Poor sales might have future consequences but it's not like they get a set percentage out of the sales.

Yes quite. You're just making excuses and you're morally bankrupt. You're dumb, Canadas dumb, Norways dumb in fact everybodys dumb except me. Your argument has more holes in it than a....than a.....something with alot of holes in it.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
1) No, it's not stealing. Keep it up like a broken record, but piracy is not the same as theft. Piracy is piracy and it's not the same as stealing. Piracy is punished in a different manner according to the law. Stealing is also based on the LOSS of property and a finite number of items.

Yeah, theft of intellectual property is stealing. Piracy is stealing. It works THAT was. It not being tangible doesn't make as much a difference as you'd like to think. The only broken record here is you.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
2) First of all, you have a hard time constructing arguments without trying to project your own impressions of what a pirate looks like and is. A slob is a crude and lazy person. How does this translate to downloading? If anything, they would be immoral or unethical, not lazy. If you're going to try and sneak in some insults at least try and keep 'em in the ballpark.

I'm not projecting my own images of anything. Most excuses for piracy are laziness, fact. A lack of desire to pay for shit you want to own or actually go out to buy it. Laziness.

I'm not sneaking anything in, at all.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Now, on to the point. It cannot be proven, in the least. You'er claiming that authors are not paid what they have earned if someone downloads a comic? Incorrect. They have already been paid. You can't make a case for this, they are paid long, long before the comics even hit the stands. The store owners are not paid sufficiently and the company might stand some future economical loss, but even this can be argued. So claiming that writers and artists are not paid what they deserve, is a lie. Further more, you have no way of gauging how much they do deserve, considering all the things that would factor in.

Certain comics companies DO pay on royalties, we're not just talking about the big two here. It's like manufactured pop groups get paid salary, not royalties. Most artists are paid by royalties, so it effects those. Not everyone is a Britney Spears or a Mike Deodato, earning set salaries for big comics.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
It's not really the matter of wanting to pay or not. I want to pay for some comics, not all.

So it is about that, then...how odd.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
People who are anti-piracy seem to be completely oblivious to the actual effects it has on the industry. There was no actual increase in pay for small-time comic book writers. Even big-time writers like Joss Whedon do not make a lot of money off of the comics that are sold. They are also paid by the page, so what the hell does sales have to do with their paycheck? The companies have already paid the writers, artists and pencilers, etc. Poor sales might have future consequences but it's not like they get a set percentage out of the sales.

And like you mentioned, stores have a standard amount of comics that they order.

Dude, aren't you from Britain? You have no right to complain! I used to have to drive 3 hours to reach one of the 4 stores in this entire country who sells comics 😄

I have every right to complain. I bus an hour and a half, two depending on traffic, to comic stores because I love comics and I love owning comics.

I am anti-piracy because I think it's disgraceful and it perpetuates the idea that anonymous theft is cool, to keep doing it, and reduces the cultural impact of any art. Everyone wants to know what things are before they try them, there's no risk taking and no chance anymore. It's like channel surfing. Nobody sits and listens to whole albums anymore because of downloading single songs, iPod shuffles and shit.

It's damaging on greater cultural levels than monetary.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Yeah, theft of intellectual property is stealing. Piracy is stealing. It works THAT was. It not being tangible doesn't make as much a difference as you'd like to think. The only broken record here is you.

It's copyright infringement, which is not theft. You might not think that one differs from the other, but the law does. The dictionary does and so on.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I'm not projecting my own images of anything. Most excuses for piracy are laziness, fact. A lack of desire to pay for shit you want to own or actually go out to buy it. Laziness.

It's a fact? Back it up with something. Please direct me towards a study which proves that most excuses for piracy are laziness. I also wonder how you can OWN something if you downloaded. Pirating a comic does not make one the rightful owner. I know this, you know this, so where is this desire to own them? I do not want to own comics without buying them. It's not possible. Or are you claiming that having 5 MB on your computer is the same as owning a comic?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I have every right to complain. I bus an hour and a half, two depending on traffic, to comic stores because I love comics and I love owning comics.

I am not talking to you. The post was clearly directed at ExodusCloak.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I am anti-piracy because I think it's disgraceful and it perpetuates the idea that anonymous theft is cool, to keep doing it, and reduces the cultural impact of any art. Everyone wants to know what things are before they try them, there's no risk taking and no chance anymore. It's like channel surfing. Nobody sits and listens to whole albums anymore because of downloading single songs, iPod shuffles and shit.

lmao, what is this? You're complaining about how piracy diminishes the RISK in purchasing comics? I'm sorry but there should not be any risk at all. This isn't gambling. Buying a comic should not be the same as rolling a dice. Song downloading? Save that for the bitter anti-pirate's blog. It doesn't have anything to do with this. Nor does the song/album analogy function here. You think downloading results in people not getting the entire series or plots? What in the world...

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Its hard to get annual issues in the Uk? Since when?

Outside of a specific comic shop, I have to hope that the British reprints will include the latest annual. 🙁

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Dude, aren't you from Britain? You have no right to complain! I used to have to drive 3 hours to reach one of the 4 stores in this entire country who sells comics 😄

The Vega system?

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri

I have every right to complain. I bus an hour and a half, two depending on traffic, to comic stores because I love comics and I love owning comics.

Sucks to be u! No wonder u bitter. I feel good knowing u have to go through all that just to get ur fix. Me on the other hand, have 2 stores in town plus like 5 more in a 10 mile radius and I still choose to download.

Originally posted by willRules
Outside of a specific comic shop, I have to hope that the British reprints will include the latest annual. 🙁

Cant you get them online? Apart from amazon of course.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Downloading a comic is unethical,

My point, she is made.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
but not the same as stealing a physical copy.

Never said it was. It's a form of theft, though.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Communism is also far less flawed than say Capitalism. It doesn't necessarily remove that many freedoms, considering the amount of opportunities it would open for a load of people. It's also great how like America, a capitalistic system has far more restrictions on their inhabitants than Norway with their socialistic system. The whole anti-piracy idiocy seems to be centred around a system which DOES NOT work. Every system has it flaws, trying to insult me based on a claim I did not make is yeah.....less than great.

Disagreement is not insulting. I also didn't defend capitalism as a perfect system, so you can effectively forget your straw man attack on it.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
How much did the comic book writers make in the 80s? Before people started downloading? They were millionaires? The decline in pay for comic book artists and writers is like a myth. Even before downloading was an option they made shit wages and could barely get by. This hasn't changed today and there's little reason to blame piracy. If these guys were paid by the government, it would be a major step up for basically any author.

False distinction. The comic industry is doing far better today than it has in past decades. It's a bigger market. But that doesn't mean that downloading doesn't make them lose a fair amount of money. It does. If it didn't, they wouldn't care about it.

You're still trying to say it's ok to steal from a person because the government isn't like you want it to be. Example: I think we should all have government-subsidized cars. You have two cars and I have none. So I'm going to steal yours, in moral protest. Same thing. You can disagree with a system of government. But to use that to swindle people out of money is cowardly and disingenuous to those who you rip off. It's not their fault they aren't paid by the gov't. But it's certainly your fault that they aren't getting the money they deserve in the system we do have implemented.

Also, social freedoms are not economic freedoms. In a system where money is distributed and divided entirely by the government, there is no economic freedom, which translates to personal freedoms. Legalizing drugs, allowing piracy, or whatever else makes it seem "free," far from makes up for that. But, again, this is free market economics 101, which you seem happily oblivious to. I'd rather not have a discussion where your knowledge is almost entirely one-sided.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Cant you get them online? Apart from amazon of course.

Yeah of course, sometimes.

Originally posted by willRules
Yeah of course, sometimes.

So whats the problem? 😕 Maybe 'sometimes' is the important word here.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
It's copyright infringement, which is not theft. You might not think that one differs from the other, but the law does. The dictionary does and so on.

Different branch, same tree.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
It's a fact? Back it up with something. Please direct me towards a study which proves that most excuses for piracy are laziness. I also wonder how you can OWN something if you downloaded. Pirating a comic does not make one the rightful owner. I know this, you know this, so where is this desire to own them? I do not want to own comics without buying them. It's not possible. Or are you claiming that having 5 MB on your computer is the same as owning a comic?

You know as well as I do that people do not care about owning the specific comic, or else they'd buy it. Stop being dumb. I'm referring to owning, as in being in possession of (Loosely used term), the contents.

Of all the debates I've had, literally everyone has said, to one degree or another, that they can't be bothered to buy them. Are there exceptions? Of course. I said most. From experience. Do YOU have counter proof?

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
lmao, what is this? You're complaining about how piracy diminishes the RISK in purchasing comics? I'm sorry but there should not be any risk at all. This isn't gambling. Buying a comic should not be the same as rolling a dice. Song downloading? Save that for the bitter anti-pirate's blog. It doesn't have anything to do with this. Nor does the song/album analogy function here. You think downloading results in people not getting the entire series or plots? What in the world...

Obviously the point of actually respecting the idea of when you are meant to have something and not stealing it is beyond you.

It's simple, really.

-AC

Actually my point was that piracy doesn't really have an effect on flagship titles due to the way comics are ordered and distributed via Diamond. The ones who lose out are the local comic book stores sitting with the excess stock which might or might not get sold. And for some reason these stores haven't felt the need to cut their orders in UXM's case. I'm not british I'm from the ROI 😛

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Canada's laws are dumb.

You can't upload, but you can download. I understand what the point is (To target those RESPONSIBLE for downloading being possible), and agree with it, but downloaders are still playing their part.

By legally DL'ing files? lulz

Nom nom nom, comics, and music.