Darkseid (pre Final Crisis) vs Black Adam

Originally posted by carver9
No point missed, it was superman that was fighting diana, it was a angered superman but it was also a superman that wasnt holding back, a superman that was giving his all during THAT fight.

I dont know why its so bad to accept it because its not a low showing for him since wonder woman is just as powerful. The only thing that might made it a low showing was the fact that supes had a minor dip and was still unable to drop her and wonder woman was holding back BUT you have to look at it like this, wonder woman have some AMAZING damage soak durability and she's also have superman physical stats added with being one of the best fighters in dc.

It was a good comic if you ask me.

he wasn't giving his all, because he wasn't fighting smart. claiming someone like superman, who is KNOWN as an intelligent fighter, was somehow at his peak against wonder woman when he was filled with rage is silly. he's not the hulk.

wonder woman isn't just as powerful. she's close, but his feats are a fair bit above hers in plenty of fields.

nobody said it was a bad comic. it's just being interpreted poorly.

Originally posted by carver9
When does Wonder woman get to do the feats that Superman has under his belt? She never at the starting line up to do anything.

No one in dc would ever possess the feats that superman has, the guy is in like 10 comics a month.

right now? he's in TWO. maybe THREE.

Originally posted by -Pr-
he wasn't giving his all, because he wasn't fighting smart. claiming someone like superman, who is KNOWN as an intelligent fighter, was somehow at his peak against wonder woman when he was filled with rage is silly. he's not the hulk.

wonder woman isn't just as powerful. she's close, but his feats are a fair bit above hers in plenty of fields.

nobody said it was a bad comic. it's just being interpreted poorly.

When I say giving his all I mean using every power at his possession without any limit, which he did.

Superman is a great fighter, he was taught by the best but he's still nowhere close to being where wonder woman is.

It has been said to many times that superman and wonder woman are equals physically, why would you even argue against it?

We all know that wonder woman wont have the feats that supes has but if we take into acct that wonder woman had a better showing against amazo than supes did then thats one feat to her credit.

If we take into acct that both wonder woman and supes faired good against titus, thats another good example.

If we take into acct that wonder woman faired well against Konvikt and also stalemated Captain Marvel, thats also a showing that puts her at his level.

If you dont think of them as equals then you're just in denial (not trying to be rude rauol, dont take it the wrong way).

Originally posted by carver9

No one in dc would ever possess the feats that superman has, the guy is in like 10 comics a month.

So, you feel on KMC if I put Imperiex against superman or even sun dipped superman how do you vote?

Originally posted by carver9
When I say giving his all I mean using every power at his possession without any limit, which he did.

Superman is a great fighter, he was taught by the best but he's still nowhere close to being where wonder woman is.

It has been said to many times that superman and wonder woman are equals physically, why would you even argue against it?

We all know that wonder woman wont have the feats that supes has but if we take into acct that wonder woman had a better showing against amazo than supes did then thats one feat to her credit.

If we take into acct that both wonder woman and supes faired good against titus, thats another good example.

If we take into acct that wonder woman faired well against Konvikt and also stalemated Captain Marvel, thats also a showing that puts her at his level.

If you dont think of them as equals then you're just in denial (not trying to be rude rauol, dont take it the wrong way).

no, he didn't.

he doesn't have to be as good as she is, he has other stats to make up the difference.

they are relative equals physically (when he's holding back). but there's more to both characters than physical ability. you know that.

amazo? how about when she was smashing her fists off mongul and doing more damage to herself than she was to mongul? the same mongul superman matched in a fight. or when he backhanded her during their fight in for tomorrow? or how she's never matched doomsday or darkseid the way superman has?

they fared well against titus. so? how does that make them even?

i'm not saying they're not equals in some sense, but he does have a definite advantage in strength and his durability is a notch above as well. he doesn't bleed NEARLY as much as she does.

saying that they're equals doesn't mean every stat is the same. he's stronger. he's more durable. its in speed and skill that she's able to compete (when added to her strength and durability, which arent bad, but they're just not as high as his).

First, my ban button must be broken because Carver is still here.

Second, being equal physically is in no way being equal overall, Carver.

Third...facepalm

Just teasing about the ban button. 😛

Why not use that ban button to forever ban the Beyonder from these threads.

Throw in Lucifer, Michael, Mxy while you're at it.

Originally posted by -Pr-
no, he didn't.

he doesn't have to be as good as she is, he has other stats to make up the difference.

they are relative equals physically (when he's holding back). but there's more to both characters than physical ability. you know that.

amazo? how about when she was smashing her fists off mongul and doing more damage to herself than she was to mongul? the same mongul superman matched in a fight. or when he backhanded her during their fight in for tomorrow? or how she's never matched doomsday or darkseid the way superman has?

they fared well against titus. so? how does that make them even?

i'm not saying they're not equals in some sense, but he does have a definite advantage in strength and his durability is a notch above as well. he doesn't bleed NEARLY as much as she does.

saying that they're equals doesn't mean every stat is the same. he's stronger. he's more durable. its in speed and skill that she's able to compete (when added to her strength and durability, which arent bad, but they're just not as high as his).

No he didnt what (and can you please change your name back to raoul?)?

Wonder woman was so weak back then that it was ridiculous. Of course Mongul would whip her a** back then, she was nothing compared to what she is today.

Darkseid 😕 : Supes shouldnt even be beating him but I'm going to leave that argument alone.

Wonder woman has had some amazing showings against doomsday. Hell, maxima showing against doomsday make every one of superman showings look like crap. Does that mean that Maxima is > Supes?

They're equal in strength, I dont know where you get them not being from.

Durability, I give supes the edge against sharpnel but blunt force trama, she has him beat.

Speed; wonder woman has him beat with reflexes by a gap, I give Superman the edge in flight speed.

Versatility; supes has her beat by a huge gap.

Fighting skills, Wonder woman has this by a huge gap.

Both have something over the other and both have some things that are similar. They're equals even when both arent holding back, again, I dont even know why you're debating against that.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Why not use that ban button to forever ban the Beyonder from these threads.

Throw in Lucifer, Michael, Mxy while you're at it.

Wouldn't be fair though.

Originally posted by Badabing
First, my ban button must be broken because Carver is still here.

Second, being equal physically is in no way being equal overall, Carver.

Third...facepalm

Just teasing about the ban button. 😛

Bada, why're you doing me like this? I'm not doing anything wrong. 🙁

Originally posted by carver9
No he didnt what (and can you please change your name back to raoul?)?

Wonder woman was so weak back then that it was ridiculous. Of course Mongul would whip her a** back then, she was nothing compared to what she is today.

Darkseid 😕 : Supes shouldnt even be beating him but I'm going to leave that argument alone.

Wonder woman has had some amazing showings against doomsday. Hell, maxima showing against doomsday make every one of superman showings look like crap. Does that mean that Maxima is > Supes?

They're equal in strength, I dont know where you get them not being from.

Durability, I give supes the edge against sharpnel but blunt force trama, she has him beat.

Speed; wonder woman has him beat with reflexes by a gap, I give Superman the edge in flight speed.

Versatility; supes has her beat by a huge gap.

Fighting skills, Wonder woman has this by a huge gap.

Both have something over the other and both have some things that are similar. They're equals even when both arent holding back, again, I dont even know why you're debating against that.

he didn't use all his abilities.

it still shows that there's a gulf between them. are you saying she's been upgraded while he hasn't?

so you bring up DOS? it was a poor doomsday, and a poor superman. also, maxima didn't kill doomsday, superman did, so superman automatically did better against doomsday than maxima did.

because he has higher strength feats.

his durability in general is higher, as shown by feats.

what kind of gap? or is this mcduffie again? the guy who ignores superman being able to casually CATCH punches by diana.

because you're wrong, tbh.

him not holding back > her not holding back.

years of feats establish that.

Originally posted by carver9
Bada, why're you doing me like this? I'm not doing anything wrong. 🙁

😛

Can we just all agree that Black Adam would beat anyone he faces?

Originally posted by -Pr-
he didn't use all his abilities.

it still shows that there's a gulf between them. are you saying she's been upgraded while he hasn't?

so you bring up DOS? it was a poor doomsday, and a poor superman. also, maxima didn't kill doomsday, superman did, so superman automatically did better against doomsday than maxima did.

because he has higher strength feats.

his durability in general is higher, as shown by feats.

what kind of gap? or is this mcduffie again? the guy who ignores superman being able to casually CATCH punches by diana.

because you're wrong, tbh.

him not holding back > her not holding back.

years of feats establish that.

I give up, both of our minds is made up and I dont want this to be a never ending battle. I am going to say this though; all of the times that Supes and the narrator said that Supes and Diana are equals, they never said that they were equals until Superman stops holding back, Dc actually look at both as peers.

It was even stated in the max lord saga that Wonder woman was his equal and she proved it.

You can easily bring up the times where Supes pimped slapped her but you also have to look at it and think "was diana truly fighting him or was she holding back" because to my knowledge she ALWAYS held back against him, even during dying circumstances.

Originally posted by shiv
How would Supes defeat Black Adam.

only way supes beats BA is if hes willing to fight on BA's turf, I mean no hol;ding punches and be willing to kill him. Supes morality is his biggest weakness against BA. they are both peers but supes never gets a edge on BA like he has in the past against cap.

Originally posted by Badabing
Fine! I'll pick on someone else next week. grumpy

😛

LOL, can I pick who I want you to mess with. 💃

Originally posted by carver9
I give up, both of our minds is made up and I dont want this to be a never ending battle. I am going to say this though; all of the times that Supes and the narrator said that Supes and Diana are equals, they never said that they were equals until Superman stops holding back, Dc actually look at both as peers.

It was even stated in the max lord saga that Wonder woman was his equal and she proved it.

You can easily bring up the times where Supes pimped slapped her but you also have to look at it and think "was diana truly fighting him or was she holding back" because to my knowledge she ALWAYS held back against him, even during dying circumstances.

WW had chances to prove that she is stronger, or better in a way. At times she has (against magic user, better reflexes), but when it comes to Strength, Speed, Durability..etc, Superman has her beat. He has shown this through his SUPERIOR feats. Don't tell me you are one of those people that believe everything that is written like MM is stronger then the entire JLA?

Originally posted by Blanket
Superman holds back against Black Adam.

BA is not actually equal to Superman... we have to look at Superman's high feats, and it becomes obvious. Even though BA really has no low feats... and his high feats range from ripping off Amazo's head, beating up Shazam Billy, to tearing through Spectre...

Uh dunno, this thread kind of gives me the 'wats?'. I can see Darkseid being given the win, but to go out of your way to try and prove Superman when fighting Darkseid>>>anyone close to him? It kind of gets, what's the word, weird?

na there is no holding back. Ba and supes as far as duribilty go are bout even to me. As far as strength goes, very small advantage to supes. In combat speed id give supes a small edge. BA dont hold back his punches. Hes fighting on a agressive level in most cases. Although the last time BA and supes met supes was the agressor and ba was more mild mannered and he still held supes off.

I think supes and ba are peers but supes is the ultimate amper, between sun dips and rageing hes greater then ba or captian marvel. Thoses types of amps are a unfair advantge when he fights anyone. He doses well against darky due to theses ways of amping. By amping in this way hes able to take it to the next level unlike other heros in his class.

Originally posted by zeel
only way supes beats BA is if hes willing to fight on BA's turf, I mean no hol;ding punches and be willing to kill him. Supes morality is his biggest weakness against BA. they are both peers but supes never gets a edge on BA like he has in the past against cap.

Originally posted by carver9
LOL, can I pick who I want you to mess with. 💃

Maybe you can be my minion of chaos and I'll send you a list of who to pick on? 😛

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Listen, I think you are just going to have to accept that you are wrong.

WW had chances to prove that she is stronger, or better in a way. At times she has (against magic user, better reflexes), but when it comes to Strength, Speed, Durability..etc, Superman has her beat. He has shown this through his SUPERIOR feats. Don't tell me you are one of those people that believe everything that is written like MM is stronger then the entire JLA?

Bad to use Martian Manhunter as example. How about this, how about you name every power martian manhunter has at his disposal. Then after that, compare them to the powers that the people on the jla have. Then you'll see how much of his entire career falls under pis.

The thing is, I'm not basing my judgement off of a statement to prove that wonder woman and supes are equals. I'm basing my judgement off of showings alone. There are so many showing of wonder woman reflexes that make superman reflexes look like crap that its ridiculous. I agree, when it comes to flight there are so many superman flight showings that exceeds wonder womans.

Strength feats, she shares that with him also.

Durability; there are many showings that make me think wonder woman and supes are equals in that department.

Only people that dont like wonder woman degrade her and have yet to face true facts.

Originally posted by Philosophía
It's not so much that he doesn't hold back as it is to him not going all-out. Like I said, in his normal portrayal, Captain Marvel and Black Adam are his peers.

Oversimplifying it ? We're not using high showings but pointing out how Superman was shown to be. His powerlevel is dependent on his mindset. Also, lulz at you complaining that we use high showings when you form an argument using Black Adam's highest ones.

🤘