I was glossing over stuff, but ya, it was the Holy Roman Empire too, especially with the destruction of Greece.
There are interesting issues with, say, the Library of Alexandria, which, iirc, was destroyed more by angry mobs than by a Christian institution. But fair enough. At the height of the Islamic civilizations, many monks came to Baghdad or Iberia to study, for sure.
Originally posted by ~:Mr.Anderson:~
maybe. I'm not sure. Altruism, of course, would not entirely cease to exist, but undoubtedly christians are the founders of most of the largest charities. Goodwill, salvation army, and red cross were all formed by christians. America also has a large part of its creation thanks to the christian people.
Altruism would actually increase.
Yes, I'm serious.
No more "us" and "them" when it came to religion.
😐
Originally posted by ~:Mr.Anderson:~
I wonder if any good things would disappear if the muslims ceased to exist, however. I can't think of any.
Actually, I agree with you here. Islam is no exception to my distaste for religion.
not to mention, many women in immigrant communities are oppressed by their lack of access to institutions and society by over baring husbands and basic fiscal/linguistic concerns.
I'd agree, the problem isn't Islam, however, Islam is a HIGHLY patriarchal system, which is the problem, and those who want to keep power, need only pull the gender strings, and they are able to keep power. The use of women's bodies as political symbology in Iran is a really good example of this.
people using islam as an excuse to carry out such atrocities actually points at two things:
1) blatant lies on their part
2) EXTREME ignorance on the count of the tw@ts who actually buy it
Originally posted by BackinBlack
immigrant countries?
racist.... 😐
lol. anyway,
immigrant communities, reread please
Originally posted by BackinBlack
true to some degrees. however, people are misusing it to opress women. islam never said anything remotely close to starving your wife for pvssy, beating them, opressing them, preventing them from educaton, or refusing them the right to choose who they want to marry.
heck there is a hadith where the prophet very clearly said that a woman can work and support her family. this is 1400 years before western feminists came in and not only convinced men that they could work but forced fat lazy women to actually work.
I don't see how this is relevant to what I said. My claim was that the patriarchy within Islam is the problem, not Islam itself. The fact that there is any gender specific regulations, compound with the fact that men have given themselves the power and will use oppression along gendered lines to keep it, is the issue, and this issue is seen in many other communities, not just the Islamic ones.
Most south asian nations have issues with this. India and the Hindus there, for example, also have a very strict patriarchal system, and there are huge oppressions of women. Bride death, for instance.
Originally posted by BackinBlack
whch is the bit that i find very strange. everyone's quick to nitpick over political correctness of the quran (a concept i find beyond retarded), bring up some misinformed hadiths, quote one out of context, try to pass total shit as quranic versus (as we see with this Mr. Anderson dude)....and totally ignore the postive aspects about islam that favor women. aspects that out ratio the bad. more so when you consider the cultural situation at the time.
I wasn't speaking about the negative aspects of Islam, I was speaking of the negative aspects of patriarchal systems, which would apply equally across all patriarchal systems
Originally posted by BackinBlack
people using islam as an excuse to carry out such atrocities actually points at two things:
1) blatant lies on their part
Unless you are a scholar of Islam or a Muslim yourself, I'd hardly think you, or I for that matter, qualify as someone who gets to declare what is or is not part of Islam. All religions are different than their holy text, and even the most fundementalist don't ever follow strict interepretations of them. They try, but the books are self contradictatory in many parts.
I certainly don't feel I have the right to tell people what is or is not their religion
Originally posted by BackinBlack
2) EXTREME ignorance on the count of the tw@ts who actually buy it
see, this is prejudiced toward Muslims 😐
Originally posted by dadudemon
Altruism would actually increase.Yes, I'm serious.
No more "us" and "them" when it came to religion.
In the short term I agree entirely but people have always had things to fight about.
Originally posted by dadudemon
Actually, I agree with you here. Islam is no exception to my distaste for religion.
Personally I think dislike toward religion could be better targeted at other things in the same area. You're simply not going to take down religion, it's impractical and largely runs counter to belief in freedom.
Much better to make religion irrelevant and unneeded. Bill Nye probably did more to take down religion than Dawkins ever could.
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Personally I think dislike toward religion could be better targeted at other things in the same area. You're simply not going to take down religion, it's impractical and largely runs counter to belief in freedom.Much better to make religion irrelevant and unneeded. Bill Nye probably did more to take down religion than Dawkins ever could.
Woah woah woah. WTF?
That's not what I said at all. I don't aim to take down religion at all. I just said that the world would be better off with it.
Originally posted by ~:Mr.Anderson:~
I believe that the muslim religion is malignant. I do not believe in genocide though.
the funny thing about this is, well, you are empowering the people within the muslim faith who want to oppress women just by adopting this stance
The muslim community is hugely diverse, and there are muslim movements for democracy constantly struggling against oppressive regimes from North Africa to South East Asia.
By defining the faith as you do, you basically are saying people like the Iranian theocratic leaders and Al Qaeda have it right, when that is the equivalent of saying that the Army of God is the authority on christian dogma.