Originally posted by Juntai
lol @ any of Bruce's showings over Shang being PIS by default.Sorry dude, Bruce at one time or another has absolutely wrecked nearly everyone in the DCU, good or bad-guy. Sometimes with prep, yes, and sometimes not. Sooner or later, you just have to accept that he's entirely -that good-.
When a character does a one off feat, accomplishing something extrodinary and out of character either in action or in combat against another character he has no business beating- that is PIS.When a character keeps doing it over and over making it his business, it becomes pretty obvious where they're intended to stand.
Don't get me wrong I'm a big fan of Batman and probably own slightly more of his comics than any other individual character but as you pointed out much of the time he uses gadgets, prep time plus he has his suit. This thread is straight up h2h no gadgets (though I assume he still has the Bat-suit).
Barring some sort of circumstance Bruce hasn't really wrecked any of DC's premier fighters and he has struggled quite a bit against enhanced characters in fist fights.
If we accepted Bruce's uber high end feats he would literally own almost anybody he is pitted against in this forum. A guy who can send Darkseid reeling with a kick,humiliate speedsters and sneak up on Superman should utterly and always obliterate Lady Shiva, Batgirl, Slade, the best NKVDemon, Bronze Tiger etc. *shrugs*
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Batman was able to endure Sensie's attacks and eventually beat him. Shows his ability to get things done when they have to. And this is Sensei we're talking about. Arguably a better MA than Shang and loads more experience.
What? lol
The Sensei was hardcore. He was whooping Bruce's arse and only lost because his stamina was so poor.Bruce had to get him to fall into the Fountain of Youth to avoid being killed outright.
I fail to see what that has to do with a fight against Shang Chi though. 😕
I know that. I was trying to referr to Batman's pain threshold and able to take those hits he did and not fall. There is no proof that Shang is a better HTH fighter than Bruce.
Hell, Bruce's encounter with Bronze Tiger indicates that he's a lot better than before. When he got whupped by Val Armorr, Bruce just smiled and said, "til next time". Or something to that. Meaning he would more than likely adapt to Val. Just like he did in B&B.
Originally posted by Prep-Man
I know that. I was trying to referr to Batman's pain threshold and able to take those hits he did and not fall. There is no proof that Shang is a better HTH fighter than Bruce.
I would say he is bare minimum at least as good or a bit better to be honest in many respects. Going by his old series he is essentially the Marvel equivalent of Richard Dragon in my opinion.
The real reason why I think Shang would win a pure h2h brawl in because he has truly impressive chi amping esoteric feats. He can increase his physical abilities to some very substantial levels which coupled with his high level of skill would give Bruce one hell of a headache. 🙁
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Hell, Bruce's encounter with Bronze Tiger indicates that he's a lot better than before. When he got whupped by Val Armorr, Bruce just smiled and said, "til next time". Or something to that. Meaning he would more than likely adapt to Val. Just like he did in B&B.
Bit of speculation on the part about KK. I must say I doubt Bruce or anyone else could 'adapt' to his level. He pummeled Bruce and would based on his abilites do so again.
Originally posted by Warrior18
I would say he is bare minimum at least as good or a bit better to be honest in many respects. Going by his old series he is essentially the Marvel equivalent of Richard Dragon in my opinion.The real reason why I think Shang would win a pure h2h brawl in because he has truly impressive chi amping esoteric feats. He can increase his physical abilities to some very substantial levels which coupled with his high level of skill would give Bruce one hell of a headache. 🙁
Bit of speculation on the part about KK. I must say I doubt Bruce or anyone else could 'adapt' to his level. He pummeled Bruce and would based on his abilites do so again.
I'm talking about hth fist fights. No Chi amping of any sort. I'd admit Shang would win if he gets to use his chi, but without it, they're really close in the skill department.
As for the KK vs Batman thing I was talking about. In Brave And the Bold, Bruce holds his own against Val Armorr, who was using flying techniques, because both had a legion flightr ring.
Val admits that he can LEARN a lot from Bruce and he was a legend in the 30th century.
Originally posted by Prep-Manhttp://img267.imageshack.us/img267/8196/asdfjk7.jpg
I'm talking about hth fist fights. No Chi amping of any sort. I'd admit Shang would win if he gets to use his chi, but without it, they're really close in the skill department.As for the KK vs Batman thing I was talking about. In Brave And the Bold, Bruce holds his own against Val Armorr, who was using flying techniques, because both had a legion flightr ring.
Val admits that he can LEARN a lot from Bruce and he was a legend in the 30th century.
Originally posted by Prep-ManBatman's not trying to fight either, he's trying to escape the legion. He started the fight on the defensive after being sneak attacked. -shrugs.-
I think Bruce would eventually lose. Val wasn't taking the fight seriously and was more astonished that he had met bruce. Plus he had more hits.
Originally posted by Prep-Man
When he got whupped by Val Armorr, Bruce just smiled and said, "til next time". Or something to that. Meaning he would more than likely adapt to Val. Just like he did in B&B.
As I recall, when they fought Val was diseased and dying, was amnesiac and didn't know he had any fighting skills at all, and I think he had several broken bones too. He beat the snot out of Batman and only 'lost' because Black Lightning shot him in the back.
Later, when he went to Batman and complimented him on him well he fought, Batman acted like a spoiled brat and threw a tantrum, going "I'll beat you next time! I'm the best! I'm the best! No one beats me!" Basically being the most pathetic sore loser ever.
Originally posted by chilled monkey
As I recall, when they fought Val was diseased and dying, was amnesiac and didn't know he had any fighting skills at all, and I think he had several broken bones too. He beat the snot out of Batman and only 'lost' because Black Lightning shot him in the back.Later, when he went to Batman and complimented him on him well he fought, Batman acted like a spoiled brat and threw a tantrum, going "I'll beat you next time! I'm the best! I'm the best! No one beats me!" Basically being the most pathetic sore loser ever.
LOL! I don't think he said it like that.
this is asinine........... with the whole Val worship and reference feats.... batman has more speed feats then val.... but no one is stupid enough to use it in a forum battle...... otherwise he can out speed reflex bart, superman, wonderwoman, and wally west and many others..... some ppl suspend disbelief to an absurd lvl.
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
this is asinine........... with the whole Val worship and reference feats.... batman has more speed feats then val.... but no one is stupid enough to use it in a forum battle...... otherwise he can out speed reflex bart, superman, wonderwoman, and wally west and many others..... some ppl suspend disbelief to an absurd lvl.
For once I agree.
Furthermore there were two versions of KK. As far as I know that Val in the scans showed doesn't have any MA feats with top tier fighters. I think he has a feat against Ultra Boy in training but thats it. The other Val who made Batman look like a chump has much more impressive feats.
Still waiting for proof. As its beem pointed out batman has actually has better feats than some of the peoples hes fought that doesnt stop Batman from nearly losing to people with far inferior feats and even looking worse off.
Common sense. Theres no proof that Batman better, so far we got a big fat zero.
