Star Wars vs Star Trek, Lord of the Rings and Battlestar Galactica

Originally posted by Robtard
You are scripting, this a fact.

Answer:Because he gets transported and assimilated.
Answer:Borg transporters and Borg nanites.

Mine is actually backed up with evidence. The Borg do transport people and turn them into Drones.

By here, since my script of Luke becoming a Drone is too much for you to handle, it's Luke after all; he's a hero. I'll edit my script to say:

Luke gets transported into space; Luke dies a hero. /the end

W.T.F.?

How do borg transporters locate and somehow transport Luke? You do realize that Luke can hide himself from sensors, right?

Counter my argument:

Luke captures a drone.
Luke disables the self destruct feature on the drone.
Luke mind reads the drone and figures out the location of the transwarp hubs.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
W.T.F.?

How do borg transporters locate and somehow transport Luke? You do realize that Luke can hide himself from sensors, right?

Counter my argument:

Luke captures a drone.
Luke disables the self destruct feature on the drone.
Luke mind reads the drone and figures out the location of the transwarp hubs.

Much lesser ST ships can scan an entire planet and get an exact reading of the population. The Borg have done this on planets and on other ships. It's basic ST knowledge and you've been told this multiple times.

Why would Luke be hiding himself from a ship in orbit, one he's likely not aware of? Or while he's on another ship, say an SD?

Anyhow, those fictional facts are irrelevant, as we're scripting now.

I did answer your script, here, I'll counter it again with my own script:

-Luke doesn't capture a Drone. /the end

Here's some for you:

How does Luke capture a Drone, does he board a ship? Does a single Drone just beam down next to him and surrender?

Why would Luke just know to scan a Drone's mind for something he knows nothing about?

These are all important things you should cover when scripting out an outcome of your likeing.

Also, a Drone is connected to the entire hive, he'd hear a trillion different voices. Dianne Troi tried this, it ****ed her up for this reason. Again, more ST knowledge you lack. So it's best you just go about making fancier and fancier scripts that ignore what is known and common sense for that matter.. Maybe have Luke and Han "pwning" all of ST, by themselves.

Script away.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
The CIS was said to have a quintillion battle droids.

Remember that size does not always equate to power. Star destroyers have turbolasers of hundreds of millions of gigawatts.

Do you just ignore things?

I've already PROVEN that Star Trek ships give out far more power that Star Wars ships from canon sources.

Which begs the question as to why the Federation was able to do anything to the Borg when the Borg would supposedly be immune to Federation weapons in a matter of days after a battle.

Which is exactly what we see on screen.

In the federation's 1st encounter with the Borg, the Enterprise D manages to inflict enough damage on the Borg cube to shut down their systems and have them focused solely on repairing the vessel. A matter of hours later that Same Borg cube was completely repaired and completely immune to photon torpedoes and phasers of the Enterprise. They were only able to escape because Q flung the Enterprise D to safety by transporting it across the galaxy in seconds.

The 2nd encounter with the Borg and a single cube managed to destroy the entire fleet and reached Earth and was only destroyed because Picard, after he had been assimilated, had the strength of will to tell Data to implant an order through Picard's Borg implants to force the Drones to go into regeneration mode which made the Borg then cause the vessel to self destruct.

The Federation then developed quantum torpedoes which were effective against the Borg once. 4 of them along with the entire fleet firing on a point in a Borg cube designated by Picard destroyed a it and then the collective adapted to made them useless.

The only time any federation technology has been effective against the Borg is when a future Janeway brought tech back in time which allowed Voyager to deploy armour and weapons which destroyed one of the Borg transwarp hubs. This was in the final episode of Voyager so we never see the Borg adapt to it but given their history of adapting to absolutely everything the Federation could throw at them then it's safe to assume they would adapt to Transphasic torpedoes and Federation ablative armour as well.

FTL travel: Hyperdrive has shown to be able to travel accross the galaxy in a matter of hours. Warp drive can often take decades to do such a thing. Transwarp cannot be maintained for long periods of time, often requires external attatchments and is not known by all major ST civilizations.

Really don't know where you're getting the idea that transwarp can't be sustained for long periods because every Borg ship has one and can use them without any need to stop. The only example of a transwarp drive not being sustained is when Voyager stole one and had to adapt it to use with their own warp cells. It was damaged in the operation to acquire it and it wasn't perfectly suited and so gave out after cutting some 20,000 light years off the journey.

Space weapons: Turbolasers often generate hundreds of millions of gigawatts of energy. The Enterprise in comparison had main phasers of about 3.6 gigawatts.

Are you going to keep repeating this despite the fact that i've proven it wrong by canon source about 100 times in this thread alone?

Shields: Star Wars shields have heat dissipation in the tens of trillions. The Enterprise in comparison has one in the thousands. Also, Star Wars has planetary shields capable of resisting prolonged orbital bombardment.

10's of trillion of what?...You don't even have a clue what the figures you are quoting even mean do you. Not to mention that you haven't even shown where you're getting them from.

Ship speed: although star destroyers do not appear to have a very high non hyperspace movement speed, starfighters have a speed often exceeding 10,000 km/hr.

Ah yes, Star fighters with their completely useless like spud gun blasters.

Support ships: Star Wars has starfighters of which Star Trek ships would have little defense against. Even starfighters would have enough firepower to penetrate most Star Trek shields and are faster than what Star Trek ships are used to.

You can't just say it...You have to prove it with figures.

Superweapons: The sun crusher can generate supernovas in stars and is virtually immune to all known forms of conventional weapons. The galaxy gun can destroy a planet from light years away. Centerpoint station can destroy or even move even a star from light years away. The Death Star can destroy a planet and has a huge number of powerful turbolasers and other defenses. Using the Star Forge, these could be mass produced.

8 species 8472 bioships can combine and destroy a planet (including shielded Borg planets) in a matter of seconds....The Star Wars equivalent is 8 Jedi Starfighter's or X-wings doing the same thing...Can they?...No...And species 8472 have an entire universe of numbers to draw on in which they are the sole surviving species because they have wiped out everything else.

The CIS had about a quintillion battle droids, which is a HUGE number.

Where are you getting this figure from...You've said this line to me often enough and i'm firing it back at you....PROVE IT.

Star Trek ships won't be able to penetrate a Star Wars planet's planetary shield.

Where exactly is your proof for this?...I've posted a video in this thread of species 8472 destroyed a shielded Borg planet in seconds.

If Star Trek is attacking, their ships would first have to deal with the defending fleet. The thing is that, due to the immense speed of hyperdrives, Star Wars can call upon reinforcements very quickly. Star Trek due to its limited warp drive capabilities would not want to sent too large of a fleet due to fear of Star Wars taking advantage of that, since less ships would be defending Star Trek planets. Even if the Star Trek ships can somehow fend off superior numbers and firepower, they'd have to somehow get past the planetary shield. Orbital bomardment would be prevented by the shield, so a ground invasion would be needed. However, as I have proven, Star Wars has far superior ground capabilities and would have the advantage due to being the defenders.

Nah...Here's how it would go....ST would use the Iconian gateway to send a multi kinetic neutronic mine to every key SW system.

3. Yet few of them have a significantly high place in the chain of command for some reason.

Janeway and Picard both Became Admirals. So did Kirk

Star Wars hyperdrive would be advanced enough to attack a planet before Star Trek can respond. Star Trek warp drive would not be advanced enough to send any significant number of reinforcements. Star Wars ships have superior range and firepower to Star Trek ships. Star Trek planets would have no defense against orbital bombardment, and any ground forces would fall quickly to a ground invasion.

Where do you get this stuff from?...ST ships have a far greater weapons range than SW ships. Hence the reason SW ships have to fight like ancient galleons by pulling up along side each other and blasting each other from point blank range. ST ships can fire while at warp speed from colossal distances.

2. BS. I said official Star Trek sources. George Lucas considers EU sources to be canon. The Star Trek guys do not consider Star Trek EU to be canon.

George Lucas has allowed massively conflicting stories and figures in to canon because he has no idea what's in it and what isn't. He cares about making money from it and that's all.

How is a Star Trek fleet supposed to capture a major Star Wars planet? Major Star Wars planets have multiple layers of defenses, large fleets, and a sizeable ground force. For example, Coruscant has: Mines Orbital space platforms A planetary shield Turbolasers Proton bombs Defending fleet Ground troops explain how an invasion force would get past these and reinforcements that other Star Wars planets could send.

I'm guessing you completely ignored the diagram I linked to earlier?

I'm also pretty sure that this "space station" completely out classes anything SW has

http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Dyson_sphere

What if Star Wars destroys the Borg transwarp hubs?

Would have to find them 1st. Voyager was practically on top of one and had no idea it was there until Janeway came back in time to tell them.

Let's say that Star Trek wants to attack Coruscant, which is held by, say the Galactic Federation of Free Alliances (the civilization that held Coruscant changed many times). Explain how an invasion fleet would get past these: 1. Getting to Coruscant without being detected by Star Wars sensors and intercepted. 2. Getting past the defending fleet and reinforcements, which would be sent very quickly due to hyperdrive technology. 3. Getting past the space mines. 4. Getting past the planetary shield. 5. Getting past the turbolaser platforms and other defenses. 6. Landing ground troops while under fire from ground defense weapons. 7. Capturing and securing major cities defended by Star Wars ground forces, which would outnumber and outgun a Star Trek invasion force. 8. Stamping out resistance. 9. Keeping trillions of civilians in line. 10. Fighting the Jedi. 11. Dealing with a counter attack.

We've been through this....The Krenim time ship...Untouchable and so it wouldn't matter if you could detect it. They would simply erase all history of technological and biological advancements that ever began on Corascant.

Also, on the flipside, if Star Wars wanted to attack Earth, they would not have to deal with any of these to the same order of magnitude as Star Trek would. Earth would not have a planetary shield Earth would not receive reinforcements in time Earth would not have a comparable ground force Earth would not have as many civilians to secure etc.

That's good...But then Earth isn't the primary planet on the ST galaxy...It doesn't command all the forces like Corascant does in SW.

ZOMG he posted a picture so it must be right!!!! Nah, his picture was not backed up by proof.

Except that it was based on the known size of the craft compared with how far their respective weapons were shown to fire in their source material thus giving an accurate representation of their respective ranges.

I've seen videos where the Enterprise would fire a a Borg Cube within the distance of 10 kilometers.

I've seen videos of a Borg vessel travelling at over warp 9 and firing weapons ahead of itself. Clearly indicating that it's weapons can fire at speeds in excess of warp 9 and taking a second or so to hit their targets meaning they would have travelled. That's about 720,000,000 miles. So...who has better range?

Prove that the Borg can assimilate a planetary shield.

They develop by assimilation...They have planetary shields...Therefor they have assimilated planetary shields.

the Star Wars civilizations build up a huge number of star destroyers using their IMMENSE industrial capabilities.

So now you're making hypothetical ships rather than canon numbers?

The borg cubes would be stuck having to use regular warp

Except for the fact that they have transwarp drives ON BOARD THE CUBES.

Or, the Star Wars civilizations mass produce sun crushers using the star forge and proceed to wipe the Borg out of existence.

Once again using the hypothetical creation and combination of technologies that didn't actually happen in SW?...Nice argument.

Does that mean I get to amalgamate all the best technology from the Borg, Species 8472, the Voth, The Dominion, The Krenim etc all in to one utterly unstoppable ship?

Awesome...ST wins by an even more ridiculous degree then.

Prove that the Borg can adapt to a defensive technology.

They adapted straight through the enterprise's sheild without even assimilating it...They simply scanned it and bypassed it effortlessly.

ONE hub was destroyed by the Federation and it crippled the Borg.

It was destroyed at the very end of the very last episode of Voyager so where you get the idea or proof that it crippled the Borg is a mystery to me.

Star Wars technology is FAR greater than that of any species in which the Borg were able to adapt to.

The Borg have apapted technology that have allowed them to access other dimensions, timelines and universes....SW has nothing coming close to being that advanced. Time travel and opening holes to other universes is something the empire hadn't even dreamed of doing.

Legacy of the Force/Fate of the Jedi Luke captures a borg drone and disables the drone's self destruct device. Then, he mind reads the drone to figure out where the transwarp hubs are.

ST has telepaths with more power than Luke could dream of.

Originally posted by Robtard
Much lesser ST ships can scan an entire planet and get an exact reading of the population. The Borg have done this one planets and on other ships. It's basic ST knowledge and you've been told this multiple times.

1. How does getting an exact reading matter in this case?
2. You have not told me this multiple times.

Why would Luke be hiding himself from a ship in orbit, one he's likely not aware of? Or while he's on another ship, say an SD?

1. Luke can sense danger, and Star Wars sensors are very advanced.
2. Using your own logic against you, why would the borg try and attack Luke in particular?

Anyhow, those fictional facts are irrelevant, as we're scripting now.

You were scripting when you said that the borg would assimilate a planetary shield.

I did answer your script, here, I'll counter it again.

You did not.

-Luke doesn't capture a Drone. /the end

Why doesn't Luke capture a drone?

Here's some for you:

How does Luke capture a Drone, does he board a ship? Does a single Drone just beam down next to him and surrender?

The drones land on Coruscant to try and assimilate the population. Or a star destroyer disables a borg cube.

Why would Luke just know to scan a Drones mind for something he knows nothing about?

He reads the drone's mind and looks for important stuff.

These are all important things you should cover when scripting out an outcome your like.

I did cover them.

Also, a Drone is connected to the entire hive, he'd hear a trillion different voices. Dianne Troi tried this, it ****ed her up for this reason. Again, more ST knowledge you lack. So it's best you just go about making fancier and fancier scripts that ignore what is known and common sense for that matter.. Maybe have Luke and Han "pwning" all of ST, by themselves.

Script away.

Luke would have a more powerful mind that Dianne.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
1. How does getting an exact reading matter in this case?
2. You have not told me this multiple times.

1. Luke can sense danger, and Star Wars sensors are very advanced.
2. Using your own logic against you, why would the borg try and attack Luke in particular?

You were scripting when you said that the borg would assimilate a planetary shield.

You did not.

Why doesn't Luke capture a drone?

The drones land on Coruscant to try and assimilate the population. Or a star destroyer disables a borg cube.

He reads the drone's mind and looks for important stuff.

I did cover them.

Luke would have a more powerful mind that Dianne.

It shows the vast capabilities of ST. It has been told to you multiple times, the scanning abilities of ST tech.

Because he'd been seen as a great threat, considering he's attacking "at a blur". Though the Drones couldl likely adapt to his sabre after a few kills; as its an energy weapon, either way, transported Luke would be, in the end.

No, that wasn't a script. The Borg adapt/assimilate tech and they've done so to shielding before. This is a fact.

I did, with my own script. Stop lying/trolling.

Told you already. He's already transported and dealt with.

That was based on your script that ST would have to do this and that. Again, based on your script. The Borg don't have to land ground forces to assimilate, they can transport.

He'd hear a trillion voices all mixed together, it's be gibberish.

No, your scripting sucked.

So? He's still hear gibberish.

Originally posted by Robtard
Jaden,

We're scripting now.

So far it's:

"Luke captures a Drone" vs "Luke doesn't capture a Drone"

Ah well...I'll script this...

The Borg capture the Iconian Gateway and use it to send Multi Kinetic Neutronic mines to every planet in SW.

To stop the gateway getting destroyed they send every single Borg vessel to the planet it is located on (as does every other species in ST) They use their combined technologies to completely cloak every vessel with the same perfect cloak that the Reman Scimitar had and they extrapolate this technology to planetary levels by help of the species who had a planetary cloak.

They equip all vessels with Krenim temporal cores so they all exist outside of space time and so can't be hit with any SW weapon

This combination makes them completely undetectable and completely untouchable.

They collect every strong telepathic species to guard against Jedi mind trickery.

They put Nagilum and the crystaline entity out to hunt any approaching SW ships.

Originally posted by jaden101
Do you just ignore things?

I've already PROVEN that Star Trek ships give out far more power that Star Wars ships from canon sources.

Where?

Which is exactly what we see on screen.

In the federation's 1st encounter with the Borg, the Enterprise D manages to inflict enough damage on the Borg cube to shut down their systems and have them focused solely on repairing the vessel. A matter of hours later that Same Borg cube was completely repaired and completely immune to photon torpedoes and phasers of the Enterprise. They were only able to escape because Q flung the Enterprise D to safety by transporting it across the galaxy in seconds.

The 2nd encounter with the Borg and a single cube managed to destroy the entire fleet and reached Earth and was only destroyed because Picard, after he had been assimilated, had the strength of will to tell Data to implant an order through Picard's Borg implants to force the Drones to go into regeneration mode which made the Borg then cause the vessel to self destruct.

The Federation then developed quantum torpedoes which were effective against the Borg once. 4 of them along with the entire fleet firing on a point in a Borg cube designated by Picard destroyed a it and then the collective adapted to made them useless.

The only time any federation technology has been effective against the Borg is when a future Janeway brought tech back in time which allowed Voyager to deploy armour and weapons which destroyed one of the Borg transwarp hubs. This was in the final episode of Voyager so we never see the Borg adapt to it but given their history of adapting to absolutely everything the Federation could throw at them then it's safe to assume they would adapt to Transphasic torpedoes and Federation ablative armour as well.

This doesn't make much sense. Surely if the borg can adapt to a weapon in minutes the Federation would've been out of options a long time ago, especially against the millions of ships the Borg supposedly have.

Really don't know where you're getting the idea that transwarp can't be sustained for long periods because every Borg ship has one and can use them without any need to stop. The only example of a transwarp drive not being sustained is when Voyager stole one and had to adapt it to use with their own warp cells. It was damaged in the operation to acquire it and it wasn't perfectly suited and so gave out after cutting some 20,000 light years off the journey.

Transwarp consumes more energy and requires the use of transwarp hubs, which Star Wars fleets can destroy.

Are you going to keep repeating this despite the fact that i've proven it wrong by canon source about 100 times in this thread alone?

Please explain to me again.

10's of trillion of what?...You don't even have a clue what the figures you are quoting even mean do you. Not to mention that you haven't even shown where you're getting them from.

Tens of trillions of gigawatts.

Ah yes, Star fighters with their completely useless like spud gun blasters.

WTF? Those "useless like spud gun blasters" can damage star destroyers; well, heavier weapons such as proton torpedoes and concussion missiles from Star Wars can.

You can't just say it...You have to prove it with figures.

Slave 1's laser cannons: 64000 GW
Enterprise's shields: 3311 GW

Note that Slave 1's laser cannons are not even designed to attack large ships and have rapid fire capabilities.

8 species 8472 bioships can combine and destroy a planet (including shielded Borg planets) in a matter of seconds....The Star Wars equivalent is 8 Jedi Starfighter's or X-wings doing the same thing...Can they?...No...And species 8472 have an entire universe of numbers to draw on in which they are the sole surviving species because they have wiped out everything else.

In that case, I'll put the Star Wars Celestials on the Star Wars side, who had the technology to move stars and planets.

Where are you getting this figure from...You've said this line to me often enough and i'm firing it back at you....PROVE IT.

Revenge of the Sith: Incredible Cross-Sections

Where exactly is your proof for this?...I've posted a video in this thread of species 8472 destroyed a shielded Borg planet in seconds.

Superweapons are an exception.

Nah...Here's how it would go....ST would use the Iconian gateway to send a multi kinetic neutronic mine to every key SW system.

Except that there are millions of Star Wars systems.

Janeway and Picard both Became Admirals. So did Kirk

Yet they still weren't in a VERY high position as the Star Wars great military minds are.

Where do you get this stuff from?...ST ships have a far greater weapons range than SW ships. Hence the reason SW ships have to fight like ancient galleons by pulling up along side each other and blasting each other from point blank range. ST ships can fire while at warp speed from colossal distances.

Proof?

George Lucas has allowed massively conflicting stories and figures in to canon because he has no idea what's in it and what isn't. He cares about making money from it and that's all.

Strawman

I'm guessing you completely ignored the diagram I linked to earlier?

I'm also pretty sure that this "space station" completely out classes anything SW has

http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Dyson_sphere

Except that this space station won't be attacking a Star Wars planet.

Would have to find them 1st. Voyager was practically on top of one and had no idea it was there until Janeway came back in time to tell them.

Luke captures a drone and mind reads the drone.

We've been through this....The Krenim time ship...Untouchable and so it wouldn't matter if you could detect it. They would simply erase all history of technological and biological advancements that ever began on Corascant.

I'll admit that, if the Kremlin time ship is able to get past the planetary shield AND get past any attempt by the Jedi to use the Force (which one could argue is not part of standard space and time), then maybe that could grant Star Trek a win. However, you have yet to prove that it can.

1. Luke can sense danger, and Star Wars sensors are very advanced.

If SW sensors are very advanced then why didn't they pick Han, Chewy, Luke etc hiding under the floorboards of the millenium falcon?

They even send a designated team INSIDE the ship and still couldn't find them.

The drones land on Coruscant to try and assimilate the population. Or a star destroyer disables a borg cube.

Or they would do what they did in Next generation and simply scoop entire cities from the surface of the planet.

Originally posted by jaden101
That's good...But then Earth isn't the primary planet on the ST galaxy...It doesn't command all the forces like Corascant does in SW.

Yet it's the main planet of the Federation, or one of the main planets. Then Star Wars can do this to the other main planets of Star Trek.

Except that it was based on the known size of the craft compared with how far their respective weapons were shown to fire in their source material thus giving an accurate representation of their respective ranges.

Explain.

I've seen videos of a Borg vessel travelling at over warp 9 and firing weapons ahead of itself. Clearly indicating that it's weapons can fire at speeds in excess of warp 9 and taking a second or so to hit their targets meaning they would have travelled. That's about 720,000,000 miles. So...who has better range?

Source?

They develop by assimilation...They have planetary shields...Therefor they have assimilated planetary shields.

Yet you still haven't proven that they can do squat against Star Wars planetary shields.

So now you're making hypothetical ships rather than canon numbers?

It's called industrial capability.

Except for the fact that they have transwarp drives ON BOARD THE CUBES.

Then why were the borg crippled when one of their transwarp hubs were destroyed?

Once again using the hypothetical creation and combination of technologies that didn't actually happen in SW?...Nice argument.

This Star Wars vs Star Trek war is hypothetical. My argument is hypothetical but based off of evidence.

Does that mean I get to amalgamate all the best technology from the Borg, Species 8472, the Voth, The Dominion, The Krenim etc all in to one utterly unstoppable ship?

If possible, maybe.

Awesome...ST wins by an even more ridiculous degree then.

"more ridiculous"?

http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/FiveMinutes.html

They adapted straight through the enterprise's sheild without even assimilating it...They simply scanned it and bypassed it effortlessly.

Which doesn't explain why they couldn't destroy the enterprise.

It was destroyed at the very end of the very last episode of Voyager so where you get the idea or proof that it crippled the Borg is a mystery to me.

It was certainly a major setback to the borg, hence why the Federation went to great efforts to destroy it.

The Borg have apapted technology that have allowed them to access other dimensions, timelines and universes....SW has nothing coming close to being that advanced. Time travel and opening holes to other universes is something the empire hadn't even dreamed of doing.

When have they adapted time travel technology?

ST has telepaths with more power than Luke could dream of.

Give an example. BTW remember the thread rules.

Originally posted by jaden101
If SW sensors are very advanced then why didn't they pick Han, Chewy, Luke etc hiding under the floorboards of the millenium falcon?

They even send a designated team INSIDE the ship and still couldn't find them.

Or they would do what they did in Next generation and simply scoop entire cities from the surface of the planet.

Didn't Darth Vader want them to escape as a trap?

Originally posted by Robtard
It shows the vast capabilities of ST. It has been told to you multiple times, the scanning abilities of ST tech.

Because he'd been seen as a great threat, considering he's attacking "at a blur". Though the Drones couldl likely adapt to his sabre after a few kills; as its an energy weapon, either way, transported Luke would be, in the end.

No, that wasn't a script. The Borg adapt/assimilate tech and they've done so to shielding before. This is a fact.

I did, with my own script. Stop lying/trolling.

Told you already. He's already transported and dealt with.

That was based on your script that ST would have to do this and that. Again, based on your script. The Borg don't have to land ground forces to assimilate, they can transport.

He'd hear a trillion voices all mixed together, it's be gibberish.

No, your scripting sucked.

So? He's still hear gibberish.

I've shown how Luke DOES capture a drone.
WHY doesn't Luke capture a drone?

Even if the Borg use transporters, they'd still have to deal with the Star Wars ground forces, who are far superior to Star Trek ground forces.

In that case, I'll put the Star Wars Celestials on the Star Wars side, who had the technology to move stars and planets.

Pretty insignificant power compared to the ability to destroy areas of space covering light years isn't it?

Revenge of the Sith: Incredible Cross-Sections

Post the link.

Superweapons are an exception.

What do you mean an exception?...That ST aren't allowed to use them but SW is?...

Besides they're not even a superweapon. It's just 8 standard species 8472 ships combining their firepower.

Except that there are millions of Star Wars systems.

So?...A multi kinetic neutronic mine can destroy an area of space over 4 light years across. It would take 30,000 multi kinetic neutronic mines to destroy then entire SW galaxy.

Yet they still weren't in a VERY high position as the Star Wars great military minds are.

So an admiral isn't a high position now is it?

Proof?

Watch the batlle of Corascant.

Strawman

It's not a strawman. Do you even know what a strawman argument is?...It's when I take something you've said and change it completely and then attack the changed argument as if it applies to yours. In this case I haven't done that. I've merely stated the fact that SW canon is absolutely all over the place and conflicting on massive levels because GL either doesn't pay enough attention or doesn't give a **** what gets considered canon.

Except that this space station won't be attacking a Star Wars planet.

Your argument is that ST doesn't have planetary defences...It does...To the point where they can build not just around a planet but around a star, completely enveloping it. This would dwarf anything SW could do in terms of technological advancement.

Luke captures a drone and mind reads the drone.

lol

I'll admit that, if the Kremlin time ship is able to get past the planetary shield AND get past any attempt by the Jedi to use the Force (which one could argue is not part of standard space and time), then maybe that could grant Star Trek a win. However, you have yet to prove that it can.

No you couldn't argue that without proof that it is.

I'm yet to prove what?...That the Krenim as effectively undefeatable. They are...There is no SW tech that can touch it. Nothing...Plain and simple fact. They can also launch weapons that no SW tech can stop.

A single strike with their main weapon on Corascant would wreak havoc across the entire SW galaxy because of the causality paradox it creates.

Didn't Darth Vader want them to escape as a trap?

Haha...no.

Originally posted by jaden101
Pretty insignificant power compared to the ability to destroy areas of space covering light years isn't it?

Not necessarily.

Post the link.

Wookieepedia

What do you mean an exception?...That ST aren't allowed to use them but SW is?...

Besides they're not even a superweapon. It's just 8 standard species 8472 ships combining their firepower.

No, I was saying that the Borg couldn't penetrate a Star Wars planetary shield using conventional weapons in a reasonable amount of time.

The sun crusher is one vessel and can make a sun go nova.

So?...A multi kinetic neutronic mine can destroy an area of space over 4 light years across. It would take 30,000 multi kinetic neutronic mines to destroy then entire SW galaxy.

That's assuming that:

1. The Star Wars inhabited star systems are next to each other, even though they are spread out across a galaxy of billions of stars.

2. The borg have 30,000 of those.

So an admiral isn't a high position now is it?

Not as high as, say, Thrawn, who was Grand Admiral for a while.

Watch the batlle of Corascant.

The CIS wanted to land on Coruscant and commence a ground invasion to capture Palpatine, although Palpatine being Darth Sidious worked with Dooku to pre plan the invasion and stage it. They would have to close their distance to orbit Coruscant in order to commence a ground invasion.

It's not a strawman. Do you even know what a strawman argument is?...It's when I take something you've said and change it completely and then attack the changed argument as if it applies to yours. In this case I haven't done that. I've merely stated the fact that SW canon is absolutely all over the place and conflicting on massive levels because GL either doesn't pay enough attention or doesn't give a **** what gets considered canon.

Whether or not you agree with George Lucas, what he says about Star Wars is canon within Star Wars.

Your argument is that ST doesn't have planetary defences...It does...To the point where they can build not just around a planet but around a star, completely enveloping it. This would dwarf anything SW could do in terms of technological advancement.

Yet Star Trek worlds are still not as heavily defended as Star Wars worlds.

lol

I'm right.

No you couldn't argue that without proof that it is.

I'm yet to prove what?...That the Krenim as effectively undefeatable. They are...There is no SW tech that can touch it. Nothing...Plain and simple fact. They can also launch weapons that no SW tech can stop.

A single strike with their main weapon on Corascant would wreak havoc across the entire SW galaxy because of the causality paradox it creates.

Prove that it can get past a planetary shield.

Originally posted by jaden101
Haha...no.

I remember reading a source involving that.

Still, the novel Star Wars: Death Star shows that the security on the Death Star was crap by Star Wars standards.

Source?

While chasing the Enterprise D in the episode Q-who.

Yet you still haven't proven that they can do squat against Star Wars planetary shields.

You realise that the Borg haven't assimilated a SW shield because THEY EXIST IN DIFFERENT FRANCHISES.

What I have shown is that they have assimilated planetary defence shields previously in ST...thus they CAN assimilate planetary shields.

Also shown that they can bypass shield technology WITHOUT assimilating it.

It's called industrial capability.

It's called you making stuff up.

Then why were the borg crippled when one of their transwarp hubs were destroyed?

Covered already. You don't see the Borg after the hub was destroyed because there have been no more episodes of ST that happen after the hub was destroyed so how you have the notion that it crippled them is a mystery...You've clearly just made this up in your head.

When have they adapted time travel technology?

In the movie First Contact, they use time travel technology to go back and try and sabotage the 1st human warp flight by Zephram Cochrane.

"more ridiculous"? http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire...iveMinutes.html

We've been through those figures several times now and i've proven them wrong. Your refusal to accept that doesn't make it any less true.

Which doesn't explain why they couldn't destroy the enterprise.

They weren't trying to destroy the Enterprise.

Give an example. BTW remember the thread rules.

The Ocampa could actually use telepathy to manipulate matter at the sub atomic level and even see beyond that to the sub quantum level (which the Federation don't have have the technology to detect). They then evolved to be able to travel through space without ships and to travel through time using their telepathic abilities.

The Aenar were able to physically project themselves on to other humanoid species using telepathy.

The Halanans are able to project and entirely solid and living other version of themselves via telepathy.

The Letheans telepathic attacks are almost always fatal.

The Lumerians can use their telepathic abilities to prematurely age someone by dumping bad emotions on their chosen victim.

Species 8472 were able to inflict massive pain on their enemies by simply trying to telepathically communicate with them.

Originally posted by jaden101
While chasing the Enterprise D in the episode Q-who.

Ok.

You realise that the Borg haven't assimilated a SW shield because THEY EXIST IN DIFFERENT FRANCHISES.

What I have shown is that they have assimilated planetary defence shields previously in ST...thus they CAN assimilate planetary shields.

Also shown that they can bypass shield technology WITHOUT assimilating it.

Star Wars shields > shields that the borg assimilated

It's called you making stuff up.

In WW2 the Allies won in part because of the United State's vast industrial capabilities.

Covered already. You don't see the Borg after the hub was destroyed because there have been no more episodes of ST that happen after the hub was destroyed so how you have the notion that it crippled them is a mystery...You've clearly just made this up in your head.

Why would they show that if it wasn't important?

In the movie First Contact, they use time travel technology to go back and try and sabotage the 1st human warp flight by Zephram Cochrane.

Ok.

We've been through those figures several times now and i've proven them wrong. Your refusal to accept that doesn't make it any less true.

Those are canon figures.

They weren't trying to destroy the Enterprise.

What were they trying to do?

The Ocampa could actually use telepathy to manipulate matter at the sub atomic level and even see beyond that to the sub quantum level (which the Federation don't have have the technology to detect). They then evolved to be able to travel through space without ships and to travel through time using their telepathic abilities.

Darth Bane manipulated sub atomic particles, although I'll admit that this species is rather powerful.

The Aenar were able to physically project themselves on to other humanoid species using telepathy.

Luke has done similar things.

The Halanans are able to project and entirely solid and living other version of themselves via telepathy.

Luke has done similar things.

The Letheans telepathic attacks are almost always fatal.

Many Force users have done similar things.

The Lumerians can use their telepathic abilities to prematurely age someone by dumping bad emotions on their chosen victim.

Many Force users have done similar things.

Species 8472 were able to inflict massive pain on their enemies by simply trying to telepathically communicate with them.

Many Force users have done similar things.

Not necessarily.

Yes, necessarily.

Wookieepedia

Odd that, because I've been reading wookipedia to try and validate your claim and couldn't find any mention of such high numbers regarding the CIS droid armies.

So...again...Link please.

No, I was saying that the Borg couldn't penetrate a Star Wars planetary shield using conventional weapons in a reasonable amount of time.

Yet the Borg have been canonically shown to analyse and completely bypass shields because it has nothing to do with the power of the shields and everything to do with their frequency.

The sun crusher is one vessel and can make a sun go nova.

A trilithium torpedo does the exact same thing and one guy managed to make one by himself out of spare parts and some stolen trilithium.

2. The borg have 30,000 of those.

The Borg have billions of them. An average cube either carried them or could make them on board. And there are billions of cubes.

The CIS wanted to land on Coruscant and commence a ground invasion to capture Palpatine, although Palpatine being Darth Sidious worked with Dooku to pre plan the invasion and stage it. They would have to close their distance to orbit Coruscant in order to commence a ground invasion.

We're not talking about the politics behind it. We're talking about how the ships fought one another in space.

Whether or not you agree with George Lucas, what he says about Star Wars is canon within Star Wars.

So I used canon star wars figures (from the films thus no higher canon available) to show that the empire, at it's height, had less than 1000 imperial class star destroyers.

Yet Star Trek worlds are still not as heavily defended as Star Wars worlds.

Does SW have anything close the level of tech of the Dyson shell/sphere?...No...So no...SW worlds aren't more heavily defended because clearly their tech is eons behind that of many species in ST...Once again...No temporal or spacial based weapons...No time travel ability...No alternate universe travel ability...Yet you're still arguing that SW has more advanced tech. THEY DON'T...THEY JUST DON'T.

Prove that it can get past a planetary shield.

How many times have I had to repeat myself on how the Krenim weapons work?

It must be at least 10...Yet you still can't comprehend it. If you don't know how it gets past shields by now then you're never going to. I've explained it simply enough for a retarded child to understand and yet you still can't grasp it.

Star Wars shields > shields that the borg assimilated

False and already proven to be with canon figures.

In WW2 the Allies won in part because of the United State's vast industrial capabilities.

And this is relevant how?

Those are canon figures.

FROM 1991...ONCE AGAIN...NEXT GENERATION WENT ON FOR ANOTHER 3 YEARS WITH CANON FIGURES WITH THEN SUPER-SEED THE OLD FIGURES.

What were they trying to do?

Assimilate it. Which, before you start another bullshit argument, they were just about to do before Q rescued the Enterprise.

Many Force users have done similar things.

No use just repeating it...You have to give examples.