Nah, Rambo is not a fool. Unless he had an M60, he wouldnt intervene in Takagis death.
Yeah, Mac has him in the brains department, no doubt there.
That's the point, Rambo wouldn't run from three men, especially when he has an assault rifle. He would have killed them in minutes, if not seconds.
McClane's way was more inventive and fun to watch though.
Even if he did have one, it would have been foolish. He'd have been shot as he went to take them out.
There were targets all over the room, the hostage was surrounded by them, no way could heve have got them without taking hits.
Then it may have been Rambo's folly, as the DH guys could shoot.
Unlike Rambo's standard enemies.
How many guys were in the room when Takagi got killed? I forget, 4-5 I think.
Rambo is a more efficient killer, let's not kid ourselves, Mac's advantage here is his luck and his police training. They're trained on building entry, sweeping, shit like that, right? In the jungle, Rambo would take Mac with only a knife.
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
I doubt it, Rambo would probably have tried to intervene in the Takagi killing, and would have been killed accordingly.
No. He would have stood up, with just a hand gun, and perfectly shot all of the bad guys in almost an instant, just like he did to the pirates on the boat.
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
He seems to lack McClane's smarts.
Actually, his smarts, especailly in battle, greatly exceed McClane's.
Originally posted by Sadako of Girth
Plus your statement contradicts itself, if he HAD killed them, there'd be noone to chase him into the vents, would there...?
Correct. If Rambo was in the buidling, the whole ordeal would have been over in about 30 minutes, with every bad guy dead, and all the good guys, alive (after the incident started.)
No, sadako is right, the positioning of the men would have made it impossible. Even Riggs would be SOL.
How is he smarter than Mac? Better trained at killing does not make one smarter in general. In the immortal words of Colonel Trautman:
"In Vietnam his job was to dispose of enemy personnel. To kill, Period."
And Rambo: "When you're pushed, killings as easy as breathing."
He's a killer, dude, a better killer than Mac, BUT Rambo has zero training fighting in buildings like Nakatomi. Throw Mac in the jungle with Rambo? One of the biggest mismatches of all time, but this thread is in Nakatomi.
And yes, Rambo would have won against Hans, but it would have been far more destructive than Mac (If thats possible lulz) and there would have been far more collateral damage. Nakatomi was tailor made for Mac.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
No, sadako is right, the positioning of the men would have made it impossible. Even Riggs would be SOL.
No, his bullets would have gone through multiple bodies.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
How is he smarter than Mac? Better trained at killing does not make one smarter in general. In the immortal words of Colonel Trautman:damage. Nakatomi was tailor made for Mac.
In every way possible cept for 1: general bs knowledge, math, science, art of war, women smarts (how to get along with women), children smarts (how toget along with kids), H2H knowledge, weapons' knowledge, flying vehicles knowledge, survival smarts, intelligence, etc. etc.
Rambo is McClane, with everything multiplied.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
"In Vietnam his job was to dispose of enemy personnel. To kill, Period."
And Rambo: "When you're pushed, killings as easy as breathing."
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
He's a killer, dude, a better killer than Mac, BUT Rambo has zero training fighting in buildings like Nakatomi.
Incorrect. Every single one of his films include some sort of fighting in buildings. 😄
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Throw Mac in the jungle with Rambo? One of the biggest mismatches of all time, but this thread is in Nakatomi.And yes, Rambo would have won against Hans, but it would have been far more destructive than Mac (If thats possible lulz) and there would have been far more collateral damage. Nakatomi was tailor made for Mac.
And the whole entire world is tailor made for Rambo. There's not a clime, dwelling, or setup that Rambo would be worse in than McClane. Rambo has him bested in all categories.
The movies feats alone prove that.
Originally posted by dadudemon
No, his bullets would have gone through multiple bodies.In every way possible cept for 1: general bs knowledge, math, science, art of war, women smarts (how to get along with women), children smarts (how toget along with kids), H2H knowledge, weapons' knowledge, flying vehicles knowledge, survival smarts, intelligence, etc. etc.
Rambo is McClane, with everything multiplied.
And Rambo: "When you're pushed, killings as easy as breathing."
Incorrect. Every single one of his films include some sort of fighting in buildings. 😄
And the whole entire world is tailor made for Rambo. There's not a clime, dwelling, or setup that Rambo would be worse in than McClane. Rambo has him bested in all categories.
The movies feats alone prove that.
And Mac has inferior bullets now? Yeah, through multiple bodies, into Takagi. Bong.
Math and science? Rambo was not a scholar, man. Art of war is a given in Rambos favor. Women and children smarts? Mac actually had a family, dude, Rambo didnt. H2H knowledge? Well, H2H Rambo would probably waste Mac, so you got me there. Weapons knowledge is a given for Rambo too, but Mac knew how to shoot and load a machine gun, thats all he needs here. Flying vehicles knowledge? I cant see Rambo flying a choper inside Nakatomi. Intelligence and survival smarts? Mac has the intel department all wrapped up. Rremember the scene in DH1 where he is writing the names of the terrorists on his arm with the red marker? Rambo is never shown gathering intel, man. Survival smarts? They are pretty much on par here, as far as surviving in an environment like Nakatomi.
I already said that.
Rambo is shown escaping a police station. He is shown fighting in an ancient Afghani prison. Thats it. He is never shown fighting an extended battle n a high rise office building.
The movie feats show, again, Mac fighting an extended battle against a superior force inside a high rise building, Rambo has nothing to compare against that.
Rambo takes this one.
While we have the much flaunted and exagerated single example of marksmenship from McClane. In the form of the Die Hard With a Vengeance. Which by the way was shooting a power box, which dislodged the power line, not shooting the power line itself.
His normal accuracy is far from stellar. Especially when it comes to submachine gun/automatic weapons. He contrary to an earlier poster assesment is far mor prone to the spray and pray method. He does thing like shotting wild while running away. Even with a pistol he seems to have the same tendencies. Though he has been known to control it and aim, but normally he gets flustered to easily and loses his cool. Something that once a battle has started Rambo tends not to do.
If you compare the pirate scene in Rambo to the "luggage thief" scene in Die Hard. You get an idead of the difference. Rambo manages to quickly pull his pistol and fire controlled/accurate shots into 3 assailants. 2 of which had weapons ready with fingers on the triggers. McClane on the other hand shoots wild while tripping backwards trying to avoid incoming fire. Lucky for him his assailants don't shoot much better then him in this instance.
As for accuracy with automatic weapons such as SMGs, assault rifles, or GPMG. Well as I said above McClane is very much a spray and pray type with these weapons. Rambo on the other hand while he may not hit every time fires in controled bursts. Even with an M60 he targets specific things and hits them with bursts. Same thing he does with an AK etc. He can dive arouns a corner and fire a short burst from the hip with AK varient(AKSU I think) and take out 3 guys. He does similiar things repeatedly through out the films. He is accurate with everything he picks up from rocks to RPGs. More over when ammo is scarce or the capacity of the weapon is limited. His accuracy increases by an order of magnitude. He does not miss with his bow, knives, pistol, or when he throws rocks. Nor when he uses heavy weapons that are single shot. Like RPG-7s or grenade launchers or LAWs.
Questioning weather or not Rambo can operate in a building is silly. He showed nearly as much stealth and aptitude in the prison in Rambo 3 and the city at town/buildings at the end of First Blood as he did anywhere else. The claim by other posters that the prison was far different from the Nakatomi building because it was ancient. Is a bit misleading. Both had the same basic structure. You know walls, rooms, windows, stairs, a roof etc. In fact Nakatomi being half done even had cat walks and the like. The only significant difference would be that the prison had no elevators.
So in closing. In a random encounter. McClane is the one most likely to run away spraying his MP-5 behind him while he goes at the same time Rambo either remains cool and fires a short controlled burst from his Steyr. Riddling McClane with bullets or he goes for cover and then sneaks up on McClane latter and snaps his neck. McClane may have had success with people well trained in hand to hand combat, but then so has Rambo. Rambo though has the advantage of being highly trained himself. Truth is their are examples of McClane being unable to deal with higly trained martial artists in direct melee combat. Stuart is the big example, but much of the same can be said for Rand and Lihn in Live Free or Die Hard. All this is of course if Rambo doesn't shoot McClane before McClane can resond. Though given McClanes history I figure he'll make more of a fight out of it then that.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Math and science? Rambo was not a scholar, man. Art of war is a given in Rambos favor.
Yup. Trig. 😐
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Women and children smarts? Mac actually had a family, dude, Rambo didnt.
Yup. Rambo had no problem getting women. McClane had problems just keeping one.
Rambo had no problem with kids. McClane had problems even dealing with his daughter.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
H2H knowledge? Well, H2H Rambo would probably waste Mac, so you got me there. Weapons knowledge is a given for Rambo too, but Mac knew how to shoot and load a machine gun, thats all he needs here.
Cool. We agree on something.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Flying vehicles knowledge? I cant see Rambo flying a choper inside Nakatomi.
That wasn't the point, though. He still has that knowledge, which counts to the overall "Rambo is smarter in every way" aspect.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Intelligence and survival smarts? Mac has the intel department all wrapped up. Rremember the scene in DH1 where he is writing the names of the terrorists on his arm with the red marker? Rambo is never shown gathering intel, man.
Rambo is never seen gathering intel? hahahahahaha
crylaugh
If that was true, then it only hurts your case, it doesn't help it. Here's why: Rambo did all he did without gathering intel whereas McClane had to sit around think about things that Rambo did while running. See, Rambo is more intelligent than McClane.
However, Rambo not planning/gathering intel is simply not true.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Survival smarts? They are pretty much on par here, as far as surviving in an environment like Nakatomi.
No, not even close. Rambo would have taken down everyone in the Nakatomi building much much faster, and not gotten beat up nearly as bad. He might of even come out of it without a scratch.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I already said that.Rambo is shown escaping a police station. He is shown fighting in an ancient Afghani prison. Thats it. He is never shown fighting an extended battle n a high rise office building.
Neither is McClane. He didn't have an extended battle, once, in die hard 1. It was little skirmishes here, littler skirmishes there.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
The movie feats show, again, Mac fighting an extended battle against a superior force inside a high rise building, Rambo has nothing to compare against that.
What you call an extended battle was actually a rag-tag war of attrition.
And, if they were a superior force, then McClane wouldn't have been able to beat them, now would he? If you meant superior numbers, sure.
And, yes, Rambo does have something to compare against that: all of his movies. 😐 McClane goes down absurdly fast. I don't see the battle lasting longer than 2 seconds.
Originally posted by dadudemon
Rambo. Cause he is more skilled, has better damage soak, and killed more people in all of his films.Also, Rambo is a better shot, and a faster shot.
Also, Rambo was and is in better shape than John McClane ever was or is.
Rambo also is a better H2H fighter.
Rambo doesn't need luck. He makes his own luck by ripping Luck's head off, biting out it's Larynx and using the larynx as chewing tobacco, and shooting people through Luck's bowels, just to silence his shots.
How did the thread even get past this?
Originally posted by ImpedimentScreen feats. Rambo takes on the following:
How did the thread even get past this?
Buncha redneck deputies (In the woods, Rambo was in his element)
Buncha shitty Vietnamese soldiers with some Russians throw in (Again, in his element, the jungle, Not in an office building) And without the help of the asian chick and the POW's, he wouldnt have survived.
Buncha Russians in the desert (This was impressive, no doubt) Without Trautman and the rebels, Rambo would have been killed.
Buncha crappy asians (Again, in his element.) Without Schoolboy, he would never have made it out of the prison camp.
Yeah, Mac had help along the way. Al saved him in DH1, Farrell saved him in DH4, but Rambo had WAY more help than Mac did.
Rambo was trained to fight in the jungle/desert/woods/whatever, not in an environment like Nakatomi. Mac fought in an urban environment 4 times and won 4 times, Rambo fought in an urban environment zero times, and, well......yeah.
Originally posted by dadudemonYeah, Rambo met one chick, and she died. Mac had Holly, and could have totally nailed the airport chick.
Yup. Trig. 😐Yup. Rambo had no problem getting women. McClane had problems just keeping one.
Rambo had no problem with kids. McClane had problems even dealing with his daughter.And they reconciled in the end. ✅
Cool. We agree on something.Um.....no. What good does it do him here, where all he has is a machine gun? McClane can shoot just as good as Rambo can.That wasn't the point, though. He still has that knowledge, which counts to the overall "Rambo is smarter in every way" aspect.
Rambo is never seen gathering intel? hahahahahahaYeah, Rambo did all that IN HIS ELEMENT. The jungle, dude, Not Nakatomi.crylaugh
If that was true, then it only hurts your case, it doesn't help it. Here's why: Rambo did all he did without gathering intel whereas McClane had to sit around think about things that Rambo did while running. See, Rambo is more intelligent than McClane.
However, Rambo not planning/gathering intel is simply not true.
No, not even close. Rambo would have taken down everyone in the Nakatomi building much much faster, and not gotten beat up nearly as bad. He might of even come out of it without a scratch.Speculation.
Neither is McClane. He didn't have an extended battle, once, in die hard 1. It was little skirmishes here, littler skirmishes there.Mhm, and he has that screen feat, whereas Rambo does not.
What you call an extended battle was actually a rag-tag war of attrition.Superior numbers, yes.And, if they were a superior force, then McClane wouldn't have been able to beat them, now would he? If you meant superior numbers, sure.
And, yes, Rambo does have something to compare against that: all of his movies. 😐 McClane goes down absurdly fast. I don't see the battle lasting longer than 2 seconds.
"All of his movies?" You mena the ones where he was never, not once, shown fighting in a high rise? Yeah.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Screen feats. Rambo takes on the following:Buncha redneck deputies (In the woods, Rambo was in his element)
Buncha shitty Vietnamese soldiers with some Russians throw in (Again, in his element, the jungle, Not in an office building) And without the help of the asian chick and the POW's, he wouldnt have survived.
Buncha Russians in the desert (This was impressive, no doubt) Without Trautman and the rebels, Rambo would have been killed.
Buncha crappy asians (Again, in his element.) Without Schoolboy, he would never have made it out of the prison camp.
Yeah, Mac had help along the way. Al saved him in DH1, Farrell saved him in DH4, but Rambo had WAY more help than Mac did.
Rambo was trained to fight in the jungle/desert/woods/whatever, not in an environment like Nakatomi. Mac fought in an urban environment 4 times and won 4 times, Rambo fought in an urban environment zero times, and, well......yeah.
Yup. You got him there. Hiding behind a tree is WAAAAAY different then hiding behind a corner or a support beam. And, hiding behind a desk is waaaaay different than hiding in a trench.
Seriously, though, one environment is easier to hide in: I'll give you a hint, it's not the Jungle.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Yeah, Rambo met one chick, and she died. Mac had Holly, and could have totally nailed the airport chick.
It wasn't just one chick that swooned for Rambo, though. 😉
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
And they reconciled in the end. ✅
But that misses the pint entirely. McClane had trouble with it, didn't even handle things properly, didn't know his own daughter very well, etc.
He wouldn't have had to reconcile had he not messed something up.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Um.....no. What good does it do him here, where all he has is a machine gun? McClane can shoot just as good as Rambo can.
You missed the point, even after I explained it to you. Remarkable. faceplam
And, no, McClane doesn't come close to Rambo in terms of marksmenship.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Yeah, Rambo did all that IN HIS ELEMENT. The jungle, dude, Not Nakatomi..
See my response to your original point.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Speculation.
ZOMG, really? Darn, and this whole time I thought that was fact, and in no wise captured the point of the thread...
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Mhm, and he has that screen feat, whereas Rambo does not.
Whaaa?
You're not making sense, now. An extended battle is just that, a battle that lasts for an extended period of time. Not little war of attrition skirmishes that McClane did, but the end of Rambo where he had an extended battle sequence against, get this, an army of Thai Mercanaries.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
"All of his movies?" You mena the ones where he was never, not once, shown fighting in a high rise? Yeah.
Right, cause, all of a sudden, being in a building completely nulls all of Rambo's skills. He's completely useless, now. Can't do a thing. He just sits there on the floor, crying cause he's about to get pwned. 😬