Originally posted by Nephthys
(I'm assuming thats what you're basing it on as you have so far just said Kas'im>Maul over and over).
You misunderstand completely. I am saying that ares' Maul > Qui-Gon > Bane > Kas'im can't work, on many levels, PIS included. Bane is obviously more powerful than Maul in the force. Come on, we don't exactly have much to work with here, but what we do know, is that Kas'im was able to block Bane's TK, leaving Bane exhausted and dead if not for the temple. To me, that indicates Kas'im's force superiority over Maul, as anything he will throw at him will be shrugged off just as easily. Unless you can prove to me that Maul has demonstrated anything spectacular with the force, a feat that trumps Bane, I will assume that Kas'im is superior in terms of force power.
The rest is simple. Maul is a beast, true, but he's not even in the same league as Kas'im, saber-wise. I mean his mastery of all forms is obviously a better feat than whatever proficiency Maul has in Juyo. And so what if he doesn't have the advantage of an unfamiliar form? His blade work more than makes up for it. Even Bane acknowledges that Kas'im was the greatest swordsman in the galaxy.
At least Ares named some opponents Maul did defeat. What evidence have you gave?
tl;dr: his defending of Bane's TK, demonstrating his force superiority (or at least adequate defense against Maul), and his absolute mastery of the blade, seem to be beyond Maul.
The rest is simple. Maul is a beast, true, but he's not even in the same league as Kas'im, saber-wise. I mean his mastery of all forms is obviously a better feat than whatever proficiency Maul has in Juyo. And so what if he doesn't have the advantage of an unfamiliar form? His blade work more than makes up for it. Even Bane acknowledges that Kas'im was the greatest swordsman in the galaxy.
1. Kasim's mastery aside, you have to be a master of multiple forms to master Juyo.
2. Bane doesn't acknowledge that, I believe it's the author's point of view.
Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
1. Kasim's mastery aside, you have to be a master of multiple forms to master Juyo.
Where is it stated he mastered Juyo?
2. Bane doesn't acknowledge that, I believe it's the author's point of view.
His mind was flooded with a million options of what his opponent might attempt, and he had no experience to draw on to eliminate any of them. Overwhelmed, he staggered back, floundering with the desperation of a drowning man. Within the first few passes Bane knew he couldn’t win. Kas’im had trained his entire life for this moment. After years of study, he’d mastered all seven forms of the lightsaber.
Then he’d honed his skill for decades, perfecting every move and sequence until he had become the perfect weapon and the greatest living swordsman in the galaxy. Maybe the greatest swordsman ever.
The last part... debatable. But he does acknowledge that Kas'im is the better swordsman.
Originally posted by ShoesKas'im's good force defense is not going to help him out much against Maul since Maul hardly ever uses TK during a duel. Kas'im, having good defenses against TK, does not make him a force titan. It just makes him hard to overcome for force titans like Bane. Tell us how blocking a powerful force wave is going to win him a battle against Maul.
You misunderstand completely. I am saying that ares' Maul > Qui-Gon > Bane > Kas'im can't work, on many levels, PIS included. Bane is obviously more powerful than Maul in the force. Come on, we don't exactly have much to work with here, but what we do know, is that Kas'im was able to block Bane's TK, leaving Bane exhausted and dead if not for the temple. To me, that indicates Kas'im's force superiority over Maul, as anything he will throw at him will be shrugged off just as easily. Unless you can prove to me that Maul has demonstrated anything spectacular with the force, a feat that trumps Bane, I will assume that Kas'im is superior in terms of force power.The rest is simple. Maul is a beast, true, but he's not even in the same league as Kas'im, saber-wise. I mean his mastery of all forms is obviously a better feat than whatever proficiency Maul has in Juyo. And so what if he doesn't have the advantage of an unfamiliar form? His blade work more than makes up for it. Even Bane acknowledges that Kas'im was the greatest swordsman in the galaxy.
tl;dr: [b]his defending of Bane's TK, demonstrating his force superiority (or at least adequate defense against Maul), and his absolute mastery of the blade,
seem to be beyond Maul. [/B]
Maul did defeat Anoon, who was said to be the best the galaxy had to offer as far as technical skill and mastery. Maul himself had high end mastery of multiple forms. So this fight is a lot closer than what you make it out to be. So far this debate seems to be in Maul's favor.
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Kas'im's good force defense is not going to help him out much against Maul since Maul hardly ever uses TK during a duel. Kas'im, having good defenses against TK, does not make him a force titan. It just makes him hard to overcome for force titans like Bane. Tell us how blocking a powerful force wave is going to win him a battle against Maul.
What am I reading? This act demonstrates how powerful he is, in terms of force power. That's exactly it. Maul doesn't stand a chance in the force compared to Kas'im. See, this is also why Bane was beating Kas'im before he switched to two-handed saber combat. Even with all his instruction, all his technical skill, Bane was simply stronger in the force. So obviously their force power will be a contributing factor in the fight, as it boosts their saber combat prowess.
Maul himself had high end mastery of multiple forms. So this fight is a lot closer than what you make it out to be. So far this debate seems to be in Maul's favor.
Irrelevant. Kas'im has mastered and perfected every form, right down to the last detail. This, coupled with his force power, seems to be in Kas'im's favor.
Where is it stated he mastered Juyo?
Also disregard this please. I remembered 16 minutes after I posted.
Originally posted by Shoes
Where is it stated he mastered Juyo?
Didn't you just answer your own question below? 😗
Originally posted by Shoes[i]His mind was flooded with a million options of what his opponent might attempt, and he had no experience to draw on to eliminate any of them. Overwhelmed, he staggered back, floundering with the desperation of a drowning man. Within the first few passes Bane knew he couldn’t win. Kas’im had trained his entire life for this moment. After years of study, he’d mastered all seven forms of the lightsaber.
Then he’d honed his skill for decades, perfecting every move and sequence until he had become the perfect weapon and the greatest living swordsman in the galaxy. Maybe the greatest swordsman ever.The last part... debatable. But he does acknowledge that Kas'im is the better swordsman. [/B]
Originally posted by truejediKind of like this?
I haven't really seen anything in Maul's favor yet. The best he seems to be able to do is have accolades that can put him in the discussion. I see nothing that gives him an advantage.
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Are you new? This is a vs forum, feats and accolades are to be considered. Is this accolades only?
Yes, they're to be considered. But this was your entire post.
Maul has a couple of accolades and victories to his name. Kas'im has one accolade.
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Maul has a couple of accolades and victories to his name. Kas'im has one accolade.
😕
What? You're saying that because there are more books written about Maul, he automatically wins? I may be new to this forum, but this is utter nonsense. It's been explained to you that:
-Kas'im > Maul in terms of force power
-Kas'im > Maul in saber combat
-Force power is a contributing factor to saber combat
How can you possibly say that Maul could win? Not logical in the least. If, and this is a pretty big if, Maul did take down someone of Kas'im's stature, it's most likely PIS.
Originally posted by ShoesI think Kas'im would win, but:
What? You're saying that because there are more books written about Maul, he automatically wins? I may be new to this forum, but this is utter nonsense. It's been explained to you that:
Originally posted by ShoesProve it.
-Kas'im > Maul in terms of force power
Originally posted by ShoesProve it.
-Kas'im > Maul in saber combat
Originally posted by ShoesHow can you possibly say that Kas'im could win? Not logical in the least. If, and this is a pretty big if, Kas'im [did[/i] take down some of Maul's stature, it's most likely PIS.
How can you possibly say that Maul could win? Not logical in the least. If, and this is a pretty big if, Maul did take down someone of Kas'im's stature, it's most likely PIS.
See? Anyone can do that. I feel Kas'im would win only because I like the idea of the old generation being better. But "deadliest Sith apprentice in history" is a f*cking achievement. Can you kindly assert the validity of your candor?
His defending of Bane's TK wave, proves to me that he is capable of producing a shield powerful enough to fend off a force titan's strongest attack. This clearly requires Kas'im to have some force power, and it's a force feat unmatched by any of Maul's.
Then we have his lightsaber mastery, of every form, which he then perfected. Sure, Maul has mastery over Juyo, Niman, and other forms, but certainly not every single one, and not to the degree that Kas'im had attained.
the novel stated that every bone in his body was pulpified by it though, did it not? he "defended" himself from it by not dying, it was the temple collapsing that killed him, but he was clearly utterly defeated by the technique. he couldnt do a single thing to actually negate its affects...
and your second statement is another assertion with substantiation. its circular reasoning as well. "the reason why i think kas'im is a superior duelist is because he mastered his saber forms to a higher degree than maul did". thats circular logic unless you can back up the second half of that statement.
the truth is that theyre both ridicullous featless wonders. mauls saber prowess is a result of some ass kisser's quote quote stating that he is a "master" of juyo, and in order to become even proficient in juyo you have to be a master of multiple high end forms... and then theres kas'im who's saber prowess is a result of some ass kissing quote stating that hes a master of all forms. theyre both the same thing, honestly...
edit- for the record i havent read PoD in liek three years so i could be entirely wrong on that first point.