Cloud Vs. Zidane

Started by GrieverSquall12 pages
Originally posted by Nephthys
No way is it as ridiculous as Zidane and co getting killed, beating Necron and this somehow miraculously ressurecting them. Its not FF10 where death is a minor inconvenience. If they'd died, they'd be fvcking dead.

Actually, that's an hypothesis regarding the origin of Necron and as far as I have read it seems plausible.

Here is the source:

http://faqs.ign.com/articles/657/657330p1.html

This article also explains other relevant points in the story but start reading from:

--------------In-depth analysis--------------[3.0An]
1) Necron [3.1An]

Originally posted by leonheartmm
the wikia articles are oppinions.

I seriously stopped there... Ok then so what is the info from the Ultimania that contains the same thing? Opinions? This is like me telling George Lucas that Vader is not Luke's father facepalm

Originally posted by Kazenji
Good luck proving your facts to this user ^

Is there a strategy guide for this guy?

Originally posted by GrieverSquall
Actually, that's an hypothesis regarding the origin of Necron and as far as I have read it seems plausible.

Here is the source:

http://faqs.ign.com/articles/657/657330p1.html

This article also explains other relevant points in the story but start reading from:

--------------In-depth analysis--------------[3.0An]
1) Necron [3.1An]

I swear I just posted that link 😐

I don't think they're reading these things ermm

Maybe posting it twice they will. :/

Originally posted by Nephthys
No way is it as ridiculous as Zidane and co getting killed, beating Necron and this somehow miraculously ressurecting them. Its not FF10 where death is a minor inconvenience. If they'd died, they'd be fvcking dead.

Sine Kuja can create stuff from the Crystal's memory, I'm sure he can revive people.

Originally posted by GrieverSquall
Actually, that's an hypothesis

I stopped reading.

Sine Kuja can create stuff from the Crystal's memory, I'm sure he can revive people.

Yes, I'm sure he revived the party. Gosh darn does he love those guys and totally wasn't trying to kill them 10 fvcking minutes ago.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I stopped reading.

It's backed up by evidence, though.

Spoiler:
Despite my glib remark, I did read the link, and no its not.

Care to elaborate your refutation?

Later perhaps.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I stopped reading.

Yes, I'm sure he revived the party. Gosh darn does he love those guys and totally wasn't trying to kill them 10 fvcking minutes ago.

Which is why he was so angry he teleported the party out, was very unapologetic, and wanted to kill Zidane at the end...

Wait, I think we're both thinking of a different FF9 ending right now.

Its only inferred that he 'helped them escape', not that he Jesus'd them. Plus he was near death at that point, in no shape to revive anyone or near the high of his powers. Plus his dimension thingy blew up when Necron was defeated, cutting him off from the Crystal.

And its funny how during the talk Zidane has with him that no mention is made of him ressurrecting the from the dead. Its almost like your theory is full of shit with no backing.

Originally posted by GrieverSquall
Care to elaborate your refutation?

His whole premise relies on Necron and the Iifa tree being linked, a premise that he admits has no support at all beyond his own fanwank.

Originally posted by Nephthys
His whole premise relies on Necron and the Iifa tree being linked, a premise that he admits [b]has no support at all beyond his own fanwank. [/B]

That's not a refutation, Neph. Point out the flaws in the argument. And provide us with a better explanation if you disagree with the current one. Simply saying 'No, that doesn't make sense, it's all fan-made' is not a counter-argument.

Garland specifically states that Zidane never saw the Iifa Tree's true form, just its 'material' one. When the party 'eliminated' the Mist by beating the crap out of SoulCage they never stopped the flow of souls. Necron being linked to the Iifa Tree itself it is the most logical explanation since when he was destroyed, the cycle of souls was successfully stopped.

I don't remember the characters saying that they 'escaped', by the way.

Originally posted by GrieverSquall
That's not a refutation, Neph. Point out the flaws in the argument. And provide us with a better explanation if you disagree with the current one. Simply saying 'No, that doesn't make sense, it's all fan-made' is not a counter-argument.

Yes it is. Him admitting his argument has absolutely zero concrete evidence behind means that its frankly a waste of my time refuting it. Its speculation. Nothing else.

Originally posted by Nephthys
And its funny how during the talk Zidane has with him that no mention is made of him ressurrecting the from the dead. Its almost like your theory is full of shit with no backing.

His whole premise relies on Necron and the Iifa tree being linked, a premise that he admits [b]has no support at all beyond his own fanwank. [/B]

Just talk of rescuing them, from a place that clearly was not inside the Iifa tree and was hinted to be on another plane of existence... full of the wonderful sounds of death? I got a question, then where do you think they were? Shouldn't be hard to answer.

No, but it does actually tie in very well with everything does it not? Well aside from it hurting your arguments.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Yes, I'm sure he revived the party. Gosh darn does he love those guys and totally wasn't trying to kill them 10 fvcking minutes ago.

For once I'd love for you to read, if you beat the game he says something like this
"When you guys beat me I saw what it means to live" then he asked if zidane's friend were ok

Originally posted by Nephthys
Yes it is. Him admitting his argument has absolutely zero concrete evidence behind means that its frankly a waste of my time refuting it. Its speculation. Nothing else.

No, it's not. The source is providing a logical/plausible explanation behind Necron's origin and the Iifa Tree. You are unable to refute it.

Gee it sure is awesome to have 3 guys jumping down my throat at once. So, so awesome.

Just talk of rescuing them, from a place that clearly was not inside the Iifa tree and was hinted to be on another plane of existence... full of the wonderful sounds of death? I got a question, then where do you think they were? Shouldn't be hard to answer.

No, but it does actually tie in very well with everything does it not? Well aside from it hurting your arguments.

Guess what stud, they were never in the Iifa Tree at all. They were in Memoria.

So yeah, they were in another plane of existence. All the time. A placed literally formed from their subconscious and from memories. That does not mean that they were dead, especially in a place as malleable as Memoria.

Oh and btw:

Look familiar? Its even in the same room.

For once I'd love for you to read, if you beat the game he says something like this
"When you guys beat me I saw what it means to live" then he asked if zidane's friend were ok

For once I'd love for you to stfu, but I doubt we'll be seeing that any time soon.

That dosn't indicate that he ressurrected them. You're reaching.

No, it's not. The source is providing a logical/plausible explanation behind Necron's origin and the Iifa Tree. You are unable to refute it.

Ok smart guy, hows this?

His argument is that they'd need to be dead to face Necron, because of the self-defeating argument that Necron is the intangible part of the Iifa Tree that Zidane and co were unable to destroy the first time, so they'd need to be somewhere where they can fight such an intangible foe in the first place. The problem with that is that first, he can't support that Necron's a part of the Iifa tree and secndly that they are already insuch a place:

"........."
"Why can I remember other people's experiences and events that happened before my time?"
"........."
"Garland, please! Tell me!"
"... Do not limit memory to just one individual's experiences from birth. That is only the surface.
Every life born into this world, whether natural or artificial, requires a parent.
And that parent also requires a parent.
Life is connected, one to another...
If you trace the root of all life, there exists one source.
The same can be said for memory.
All life constitutes an intelligence that holds memory beyond experience.
Memory is not isolated within individuals.
It is an accumulation of generations of memories that continue to evolve.
You can say that memory and evolution go hand in hand.
But most life-forms do not understand the true nature of memories... ... which explains why most memories never cross paths."
"... A presence that presides over all life and memories. The crystal...
You are on your own now.
Kilika... take care of Kuja.
... and protect the crystal. Farewell..."

They are in Memoria. A place created from memories, the subconscious of mankind, the collective will and experience of the entire universe.

Now lets look at your link:

Necron.

"Eternal Darkness
Monster created by fear of death.
A being awoken by the fear, despair, and hatred of Kuja, who discovered, with
the fulfillment of his ambition near, that he had little time left to live. It
rejects the cycle of life through the crystal and attempts to return every
world, including Terra and Gaia, to nothing. The final enemy to confront
Zidane's team."

"To return everything back to the zero world, where there is no life and no crystal to give life. In a world of nothing, fear does not exist. This is the world that all life desires."

Kuja has already created monsters in Memoria. Add this all up together and what do you get?

i think people who are quoting info from wikia and other non cannon sources maybe havent PLAYED ff9. nothing suggests that the party died, everything suggests that the crystal was destroyed.

zidane MURDERS cloud.

Oh and BTW? They party ALREADY tanked Trance Kuja's Ultima:

vs

Did they get LESS powerful since then? I don't think so.

Did I just win? It feels like I just won. Huh.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Oh and BTW? They party ALREADY tanked Trance Kuja's Ultima:

vs

Did they get LESS powerful since then? I don't think so.

Did I just win? It feels like I just won. Huh.

1. Kuja didn't put any effort into it
2. Kuja said "I won't die alone, you're all coming with me" then he used a full powered Ultima and their bodies disintegrated.

They were in Memoria

Umm no they were in the Crystal World