Palpatine isn't immune to anything. A barely trained Leia hurt him with Battle Meditation. Granted, he was weakened and taken by surprise, but there shouldn't be any comparison between DE Leia and FotJ Luke...
Likewise, Palpatine was affected by Luke's TK in DE. I imagine if Luke is stronger, his TK would simply overpower the Emperor, and that'd be that.
And of course, Palpatine is shown to still be susceptible to lightsaber attacks. If Luke outduels him and scores a hit, you can bet that Palpatine will be hurt bad.
Originally posted by SunRazer
Palpatine isn't immune to anything. A barely trained Leia hurt him with Battle Meditation. Granted, he was weakened and taken by surprise, but there shouldn't be any comparison between DE Leia and FotJ Luke...Likewise, Palpatine was affected by Luke's TK in DE. I imagine if Luke is stronger, his TK would simply overpower the Emperor, and that'd be that.
And of course, Palpatine is shown to still be susceptible to lightsaber attacks. If Luke outduels him and scores a hit, you can bet that Palpatine will be hurt bad.
I'm using out-of-character Palpatine, who is trying everything he can to win (same for Luke). Palpatine isn't even going to draw his saber, and has is offensive and defensive Force output at maximum all the time.
Unless you can prove Luke is so much more powerful with his TK, I don't see it affecting Palpatine. A slight difference isn't going to do it.
Palpatine on the other hand has far more lethal Force abilities to use as he sees fit.
Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Az quote for Luke canonically being more powerful?
If it doesn't exist can you give in depth reasoning for why Luke is more powerful?
I've explained it here:
Originally posted by Azronger
I'm using out-of-character Palpatine, who is trying everything he can to win (same for Luke). Palpatine isn't even going to draw his saber, and has is offensive and defensive Force output at maximum all the time.Unless you can prove Luke is so much more powerful with his TK, I don't see it affecting Palpatine. A slight difference isn't going to do it.
Palpatine on the other hand has far more lethal Force abilities to use as he sees fit.
This is all extremely vague and impossible for me to counter. What examples do you have for any of this? Assuming Luke goes all-out off the bat, I'm not seeing why his TK would be insufficient to hurt Palpatine in some form. Or more importantly, why he wouldn't run in with a lightsaber and try to keep it as a duel. Certainly not seeing anything that supports the notion of Palpatine being "immune".
Originally posted by SunRazer
This is all extremely vague and impossible for me to counter. What examples do you have for any of this? Assuming Luke goes all-out off the bat, I'm not seeing why his TK would be insufficient to hurt Palpatine in some form. Or more importantly, why he wouldn't run in with a lightsaber and try to keep it as a duel. Certainly not seeing anything that supports the notion of Palpatine being "immune".
I've explained this to you already here. But to briefly recap: Palpatine can deflect lightsaber strikes and stronger attacks (namely his own Force Lightning) from any direction without using gestures, with zero effort and absolutely no difficulty. Fast forwarding to DE, he has displayed the ability to shield others from the annihilating power of his Force Storms, which goes even beyond his own Lightning, doing so to R2-D2 and Luke himself, indicating he could shield himself as well. With this I'm not seeing any way Luke could put a dent in Sidious, even if it came to CCQ.
Of which there is no guarantee, as Sidious can teleport, and granted, so can Luke, but there's no way to know whether either could predict where the other teleports to, as a fight between two teleporting adversaries has never occurred in SW, so I'm not seeing how Luke could keep it strictly a duel. Not that it would matter, as Sidious can deflect his attacks and respond with more devastation in the form of Lightning, Storms, Telepathy and even Drain (which has affected Luke in the past). It doesn't really matter whether they keep it close or blast each other from afar.
And while TK could affect Sidious to an extent, I'm not seeing how Luke would solely win with it. TK is almost never a factor in fights where the opponents as close to each other in power, save for maybe affecting the environment. You need to be exponentially more powerful than your foe to ragdoll or semi-dominate them, and I'm not convinced Luke could do that to Palpatine. And even if he could, he'd have to deal with Palpatine's offense at the same time, so he wouldn't be able to focus all his effort into TK.
Where is it said that Palpatine specifically blocked the destructive power of his Storms when it hit Luke? It seems as though he simply controlled his Storms such that Luke wasn't hurt by them.
Secondly, Luke has already cut off Palpatine's hand in lightsaber combat. Of course he could deflect lightsaber strikes (lesser Force users have done so) but that hardly eliminates the possibility of Luke inflicting bodily harm with his blade.
If you believe Luke is more powerful, why wouldn't he be able to circumvent Lightning or Telepathy? Drain would be Palpatine's premier way of winning here, I agree.
Nowhere did I say Luke would solely win with TK — you're not only spectacularly failing to capture my argument but you're outright caricaturing it. I was skeptical of the notion that the Emperor would simply be outright immune to TK and proposed only that Luke could still hurt him with it.
Originally posted by SunRazer
Where is it said that Palpatine specifically blocked the destructive power of his Storms when it hit Luke? It seems as though he simply controlled his Storms such that Luke wasn't hurt by them.
Nowhere specifically. That was always my interpretation, but yours is equally valid.
Secondly, Luke has already cut off Palpatine's hand in lightsaber combat. Of course he could deflect lightsaber strikes (lesser Force users have done so) but that hardly eliminates the possibility of Luke inflicting bodily harm with his blade.
Except that it kind of does, when Palpatine's Barrier covers his entire body.
Nowhere did I say Luke would solely win with TK — you're not only spectacularly failing to capture my argument but you're outright caricaturing it. I was skeptical of the notion that the Emperor would simply be outright immune to TK and proposed only that Luke could still hurt him with it.
Okay, sorry. 🙁
If you believe Luke is more powerful, why wouldn't he be able to circumvent Lightning or Telepathy? Drain would be Palpatine's premier way of winning here, I agree.
Nowhere did I say Luke wouldn't be able to circumvent Lightning or Telepathy - you're not only spectacularly failing to capture my argument but you're outright caricaturing it. uhuh
My point was that Luke managing to keep the duel close and personal wouldn't matter as Sidious can still block his attacks and still has access to all the Force powers he would use from a distance. Luke's physical and dueling advantages are nullified entirely.
Originally posted by MythLord
Luke can hurt Sheev's essence with the whole Flow Walk. He's also still more than capable of using Force Light, which when used by DE Luke and Leia still managed to harm Palpatine. He can drop Sheev.
Mind elaborating on the Flow Walk thing? And whatbare you referring to with Force Light?
Originally posted by Azronger
Except that it kind of does, when Palpatine's Barrier covers his entire body.
Nobody's Barrier is permanent, as evinced by Palpatine having his hand cut off in DE.
Nowhere did I say Luke wouldn't be able to circumvent Lightning or Telepathy - you're not only spectacularly failing to capture my argument but you're outright caricaturing it. uhuh
My point was that Luke managing to keep the duel close and personal wouldn't matter as Sidious can still block his attacks and still has access to all the Force powers he would use from a distance. Luke's physical and dueling advantages are nullified entirely.
This makes no sense. DE proves that Palpatine is not above being bested in lightsaber combat by a superior swordsman ie. FotJ Luke.
And your comment strongly implied that Luke wouldn't be able to deal with Palpatine's own offensive powers. If I misunderstood, I apologize.