My opinion because it's my thread? The only authority I hold here is setting the conditions.
It's my opinion that Jean was blocking NC from jumping TO HIM, NOT from teleporting in general.
Fact? No force user, not one, ever displayed TK that is half of what Jean Grey displayed.
No, a force hold/grip/whatever does NOT keep people from teleporting.
Originally posted by truejedi
Not at all in fact. The Jedi are going to use their pre-cog to win this fight. That or these TP'ers can't escape a force hold.
Force grip is out as you said. So that leaves pre-cog, and that ain't really gonna help that much since most of them will attack from long range, and they also aren't fast enough to deflect bullets.
Originally posted by truejedi
There have been no examples given from a single movie of anyone ever teleporting out of a force grip.It is RJ's opinion that Jean was controlling his mind, it is my opinion that she was controlling his body.
Pure speculation. troublesome.
Point one was pointless.
Point two and point three holds, but as you said, it's RJ's thread, he sets the conditions (as long as they don't contradict the facts).
I'm personally not sure if it was TP or TK, but RJ did raise a good point when NC mentions "blocking" him. If anything I'd lean towards TP because of that. Also, DP's TK =/= force grip, nor does Jedi in this topic use force grip, which I've already mentioned, so I don't know why this is being repeated.
Originally posted by truejedi
You should reconsider this forum a bit I think. If you could read say, an Xmen novel, and count it as evidence, you could settle that part of the argument. Instead, in this forum, EVERYTHING you see onscreen can be interpreted in multiple ways. For instance, some might say Yoda was crushing Dooku, others might say Dooku and Yoda fought a pretty good duel (with just the film). The novels make it clear that Dooku was fighting for his life, and never had a chance to beat Yoda. Without them, a thread on that fight becomes one great big NO U argument, since 2 people don't agree on what they saw.
Using other material will pose its own problems as well. Can be frustrating sometimes, but its probably for the best.
As for Yoda vs Dooku, its kinda clear for me. Going by the film, Dooku wasn't going to win. Yoda was on the attax and Dooku kept backing off. Also, the fact that Dooku distracted Yoda to escape shows he knew he wasn't going to win. I don't think he was fighting for his life though, even Yoda said he fought well and he couldn't get past his defenses. Probably if they fought longer, Dooku would've eventually lost, but it wasn't like Yoda was whooping his ass during the fight.
On a side note, Dooku should've slashed Yoda while he was occupied with the fallen thingo. A saber throw would've worked too. Or even force lightning. I'm sure the SW fanboys will make up some complex excuse (this always happens, they never admit parts of the movie doesn't make sense, or that Dooku could've done those things).
Originally posted by truejedi
No way to win them, and everyone just keeps repeating themselves, because no one has really been proven wrong, they have just been presented with a different opinion of what is most important onscreen.
Trust me, on this forum, this will happen regardless lol.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
No, you made the claim that wizards cannot apparate while being TK'd, you need to prove it, that's how ti works. None of this "just cuz" shit.
I've already proved it: every single scene wizards are dueling. Every last one. Take you pick. 😐
It's a fact. You already know it is. We've talked about this already.
It is up to you to find just one scene where any Wizard apparates out of being knocked back from a spell or physical force. Prove. it.
If you can't, then the point stands that any amount of significant TK, which a padawan an exert, prevents them from apparating in any thread you choose to do jedi vs. HP-verse, in.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Apparating is a magical form of teleporting.http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Apparition
Apparition is a magical method of transportation, and is basically magical teleportation, having the user focus on a desired location in their mind, then disappear from their current location and instantly reappear at their desired location.
They think it, then they apparate. Why would they not be able to think while in motion (being knocked back, free falling, etc)?
I can name several instances in movies where a teleporter was in a free fall (which is the same as being knocked back, except they are moving downwards instead of backwards) and they TP'd out of it.
What do you think half apparating is? It's apparating over and over and over whilst in motion.
A wizard thinks where they wanna go, and they apparate there. Nothing stops them. The only thing that stops apparition is an anti-apparition charm, end of discussion.
No matter what counters you come up with, it's just a fact that the magical users don't apparate out of a knock back. That's it. 😬
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Blocking, like blocking a linebacker from getting to the QB. NC coulda still TP'd to the bathroom.
Blocking could be anything, in that scene. Anything. We don't know. Best guess is TK as that was the force she was using at the time and most associated with.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
My opinion because it's my thread? The only authority I hold here is setting the conditions.It's my opinion that Jean was blocking NC from jumping TO HIM, NOT from teleporting in general.
Fact? No force user, not one, ever displayed TK that is half of what Jean Grey displayed.
No, a force hold/grip/whatever does NOT keep people from teleporting.
LIES!
Galen Marek. awesome
Jean Doesn't even come close to showing TK on that level. 313
RJ - sorry I haven't been on, but here's your answer. Vader strangling the life out of the admiral in ESB from quite a long distance. When you're getting choked, it's kinda hard to move isn't it? Luke did the same in RoTJ in Jabba's Palace. When you're stuck in a Force-grip or Choke, you CAN'T move! Does that satisfy you? Obi-Wan in RoTS was thrown and kicked by Dooku in a Force-grip.
Or do you need the fact that in novelization, Galen Marek was throwing Vader around with a Force-grip? Your rebutall or do you even HAVE one?
Originally posted by Darth Truculent
RJ - sorry I haven't been on, but here's your answer. Vader strangling the life out of the admiral in ESB from quite a long distance. When you're getting choked, it's kinda hard to move isn't it? Luke did the same in RoTJ in Jabba's Palace. When you're stuck in a Force-grip or Choke, you CAN'T move! Does that satisfy you? Obi-Wan in RoTS was thrown and kicked by Dooku in a Force-grip.Or do you need the fact that in novelization, Galen Marek was throwing Vader around with a Force-grip? Your rebutall or do you even HAVE one?
Vader knew exactly where Ozzel was. If Ozzel was a teleporter, he could have teleported away. Also, the Gamorreans moved when Luke had them in force choke. They stumbled back several steps then fell. Pwned.
When one is stuck in a force grip, suspended in midair as Obi Wan was, yeah, they cannot move physically (forward. back, side to side), but teleporting is not exactly like taking a step this way or that. When one teleports, they are literally disappearing then reappearing somewhere else.
Galen is EU bullshit, movies only here.
Originally posted by dadudemon
I've already proved it: every single scene wizards are dueling. Every last one. Take you pick. 😐It's a fact. You already know it is. We've talked about this already.
It is up to you to find just one scene where any Wizard apparates out of being knocked back from a spell or physical force. Prove. it.
If you can't, then the point stands that any amount of significant TK, which a padawan an exert, prevents them from apparating in any thread you choose to do jedi vs. HP-verse, in.
No matter what counters you come up with, it's just a fact that the magical users don't apparate out of a knock back. That's it. 😬
Blocking could be anything, in that scene. Anything. We don't know. Best guess is TK as that was the force she was using at the time and most associated with.
YOU made the claim that teleporters/apparaters cannot TP when knocked back, up to you to prove it.
OK, if that's your line of reasoning, the following are true: Jedi cannot eat spaghetti. Wookkies have no penises. Luke cannot fight with a red lightsaber. Why? Because they are never SHOWN doing so.
HA 😉
And no, we didnt "talk" about it, you have "proven" nothing.
To end this bullshit "teleporters cannot teleport when knocked back", have you seen Jumper? The scene where Rice and Griffin are fighting over the detonator? Griffin jumps a truck at Rice (when Rice is in the Arctic). The truck hits Rice, then what does Rice do as he is being knocked back into the ocean?
Say it....say my name..........TELEPORT.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
YOU made the claim that teleporters/apparaters cannot TP when knocked back, up to you to prove it.
I just did. I cite every single duel that ever occurred.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
OK, if that's your line of reasoning, the following are true: Jedi cannot eat spaghetti. Wookkies have no penises. Luke cannot fight with a red lightsaber. Why? Because they are never SHOWN doing so.HA 😉
And no, we didnt "talk" about it, you have "proven" nothing.
By the golden rules, you are correct. Logically, you are not. Logically, I am. The fact that you have yet to find a single instance of a Magical user apparating, while, reeling, after an attack like I've described, more than prove my point. It's a fact of both the books and the movies: while they are getting their shit beat down, they don't apparate. They have to regain their "equilibrium/balance" or whatever, before they continue.
I can think of about 4 example right off the top of my head but I will not give you the satisfaction of telling you.
You already know what I'm talking about as you argued the point with me, in detail, already. Why would you deny something like that? That's not cool, dude.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
To end this bullshit "teleporters cannot teleport when knocked back", have you seen Jumper? The scene where Rice and Griffin are fighting over the detonator? Griffin jumps a truck at Rice (when Rice is in the Arctic). The truck hits Rice, then what does Rice do as he is being knocked back into the ocean?Say it....say my name..........TELEPORT.
Whew, luckily, we weren't talking about Jumpers. 😐
Originally posted by Placidity
awesome Indeed.Dark Phoenix would rape him though, and he'd love it.
Well, since I'm using a non-usable Movie Versus thread character, that's only fair.
However, movie version of Phoenix didn't even come close to the mass that Galen moved. 313 That Star Destroyer was quite huge.
Originally posted by dadudemon
I just did. I cite every single duel that ever occurred.By the golden rules, you are correct. Logically, you are not. Logically, I am. The fact that you have yet to find a single instance of a Magical user apparating, while, reeling, after an attack like I've described, more than prove my point. It's a fact of both the books and the movies: while they are getting their shit beat down, they don't apparate. They have to regain their "equilibrium/balance" or whatever, before they continue.
I can think of about 4 example right off the top of my head but I will not give you the satisfaction of telling you.
You already know what I'm talking about as you argued the point with me, in detail, already. Why would you deny something like that? That's not cool, dude.
Whew, luckily, we weren't talking about Jumpers. 😐
Follow the bouncing ball, dude, going somewhere with this.
Lookie, at 2:50. Rice is KNOCKED back by a damn truck, and he teleports away while being knocked back.
Also, Griffin can jump anything that is in motion, a bus, a truck, a car, anything.
Also, David, in the end, jumped an entire section of his GF's apartment.
But hey, being knocked backwards will stop them from teleporting, yeah?
haermm Nah.
Now, we have established that apparating is a magical form of teleporting. It is basically the same. Why then would apparaters NOT be able to apparate when knocked back? You are making a claim about apparaters, one that is never implied nor said in any of the HP movies. You have to provide proof of it.
Apparaters think where they want to go, then they apparate there. All that is required is that they think it. Why, when being knocked backwards, would they not be able to think a desired location?
Why are we even discussing this here? No wizards are invloved here. And dude, don't say "Jumpers and the X Men TPers are different!!!!"
Teleporting is teleporting, they are pretty much equal in power. The Jumpers are stronger in the sense that they can jump anywhere in the world. The X Men TPers showed better FOOM FOOM FOOM jumping, like the white house scene with NC. But in the end, they are all on par with each other in raw power.
Originally posted by dadudemon
Indeed. Trying to remember a lame conversation you had with a homie would be difficult to remember when you are decking the Halls of the bowels of holly. 313That's an inside joke that I hope you get. pained
Priorities.
Answer me this: Jumpers (Rice and Griffin) and Teleporters (Wraith, XI, and NC). Who is superior, as far as teleporting goes? And why?
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Priorities.Answer me this: Jumpers (Rice and Griffin) and Teleporters (Wraith, XI, and NC). Who is superior, as far as teleporting goes? And why?
NC has better 3D space awareness than everyone else except for XI. All in all, I'd say that Wraith, XI, and NC are all better than the Jumpers. The only time we get to see some very rapid jumping is when Griffin was doing that uber punch against Samuel L. Mother ****in' Jackson.
Originally posted by dadudemonOK. I agree to an extent. I say the Jumpers are superior due to their range, Griffins ability to jump a bus, and David's ability to jump a damn apartment.
NC has better 3D space awareness than everyone else except for XI. All in all, I'd say that Wraith, XI, and NC are all better than the Jumpers. The only time we get to see some very rapid jumping is when Griffin was doing that uber punch against Samuel L. Mother ****in' Jackson.
But close quarters TPing, yeah, the TPers are better.
Now...A teleporter TPing while being knocked back would fall under close quarters combat. If the Jumpers can do it, then the TPers can do it.
Bong.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
OK. I agree to an extent. I say the Jumpers are superior due to their range, Griffins ability to jump a bus, and David's ability to jump a damn apartment.But close quarters TPing, yeah, the TPers are better.
Now...A teleporter TPing while being knocked back would fall under close quarters combat. If the Jumpers can do it, then the TPers can do it.
Bong.
That's right. The Jumpers have superior range and "mass" jumping abilities. Griffin jumped that whole bus/car/etc.
As far as a fight, though, the other three are better in 3D space...hard to explain what I mean.
Originally posted by dadudemonAnd all can jump/TP when knocked back, or when in a force choke.
That's right. The Jumpers have superior range and "mass" jumping abilities. Griffin jumped that whole bus/car/etc.As far as a fight, though, the other three are better in 3D space...hard to explain what I mean.
Thanks for playing.
I think he means combat teleporting. Like, if you watch Nightcrawler's White House scene or Weapon XI fight Wolverine and Sabretooth you can see they teleport in and out mid attack and using their teleporting to hit at weird angles. There's also a neat part where Nightcrawler is flipping towards a secret service agent and as he's landing he teleports onto the wall and pushes off it onto the agent.
The Jumpers did some amazing things but I don't remember them using their jumping to do that kind of thing.