Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I think classic Mangog takes it pretty handily.He was basically a Unimind-type being that was purely physical.
Don't see Tyrant getting around that with plot device.
This is a joke right? So you're saying mangog would just beat Tyrant to death? Somebody a rival to Galactus and made in his own image... is going to lose to an insignificant creature like Mangog because he's a strong physical being? You jest.
^ No. Classic Mangog was strong and physical enough to task Odin and roflstomp Thor like a flea. Tyrant's origins have little to with this. And before we get into tangents, I don't believe depowered Tyrant's plot device ability to be powered by Galactus' attacks =/= Odin's plot device ability to undo Mangog's spell.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0Tyrant took on Gladiator, Surfer, etc. and beat them all down like fleas. Galactus is also higher than Odin this was recently proven.
^ No. Classic Mangog was strong and physical enough to task Odin and roflstomp Thor like a flea. Tyrant's origins have little to with this. And before we get into tangents, I don't believe depowered Tyrant's plot device ability to be powered by Galactus' attacks =/= Odin's plot device ability to undo Mangog's spell.
Originally posted by janus77Ok. Taking all that for granted doesn't change my opinion:
De-powered Tyrant was strong enough to stomp heralds and he did physically take on Galactus too, iirc.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ No. Classic Mangog was strong and physical enough to task Odin and roflstomp Thor like a flea. Tyrant's origins have little to with this. And before we get into tangents, I don't believe depowered Tyrant's plot device ability to be powered by Galactus' attacks =/= Odin's plot device ability to undo Mangog's spell.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ No. Classic Mangog was strong and physical enough to task Odin and roflstomp Thor like a flea. Tyrant's origins have little to with this. And before we get into tangents, I don't believe depowered Tyrant's plot device ability to be powered by Galactus' attacks =/= Odin's plot device ability to undo Mangog's spell.
Ummmm it wasn't just his plot device that scared Galactus in the first place, in fact, he was surprised he could even do that. Prior to learning Tyrant could even do that, he had backed down from Tyrant and let him take his herald for fear of Galaxies being destroyed. That's right backed down because of the collateral damage. Mangog can't produce that much firepower to destroy Galaxies as a side effect. Mangog can just stomp around Asgard and Earth acting and big and bad while the big boys play in space.
Again, via narration, we know DP Tyrant wasn't DP anymore.. the only thing he couldn't do was grow in size. However, he had got all of his power if not more back.. which is confirmed when he says he's finally ready to come out of hiding and challage Galactus... and when he states he's at the HEIGHT of his powers. Before being DP he was a rival to Galactus (made in his own image) Their original battle destroyed Galactus and lasted a very very very long time. So if Tyrant was back to that level or greater... he's once again a peer to Galactus. A peer to Galactus, just like Galactus, shit stomps all over Mangog like he was a petulant child.
^ Galactus not wanting to engage depowered Tyrant early on is a complete non-feat. Your reliance on the speculation that galaxies would be destroyed if Galactus took on depowered Tyrant at that moment is pretty much nonsense considering that when depowered Tyrant finally took on Galactus at the end of the arc, galaxies weren't being destroyed. The obviousness of this fact must have eluded you.
Depowered Tyrant had the plot device ability to amp himself with Galactus' attacks. Nothing else depowered Tyrant performed on-panel by way of independent feats places him on Galactus' level. Your deflections onto his origins are noted and dismissed.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Galactus not wanting to engage depowered Tyrant early on is a complete non-feat. Your reliance on the speculation that galaxies would be destroyed if Galactus took on depowered Tyrant at that moment is pretty much nonsense considering that when depowered Tyrant finally took on Galactus at the end of the arc, galaxies weren't being destroyed. The obviousness of this fact must have eluded you.Depowered Tyrant had the plot device ability to amp himself with Galactus' attacks. Nothing else depowered Tyrant performed on-panel by way of independent feats places him on Galactus' level. Your deflections onto his origins are noted and dismissed.
Dp Tyrant was losing against Galactus, until Galactus start using using his tech, that's when Tyrant took control of Galactus tech and caught Galactus off guard.
DP Tyrant wouldn't have that option against Mangog, plus DP Tyrant hatred for Galactus will just fuel Mangog even more, Classic Mangog is DC Version of PC Validus, a walking a$$ kicker!!
Originally posted by the Darkone
Dp Tyrant was losing against Galactus, until Galactus start using using his tech, that's when Tyrant took control of Galactus tech and caught Galactus off guard.DP Tyrant wouldn't have that option against Mangog, plus DP Tyrant hatred for Galactus will just fuel Mangog even more, Classic Mangog is DC Version of PC Validus, a walking a$$ kicker!!
No he was not losing. Galactus realized he couldn't beat Tyrant by blasting him so he resorted to his machines. Then that just made things worse for Galactus. Nothing he did, not his Power Cosmic or all his Tech, saved him from Tyrant's wrath.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Galactus not wanting to engage depowered Tyrant early on is a complete non-feat. Your reliance on the speculation that galaxies would be destroyed if Galactus took on depowered Tyrant at that moment is pretty much nonsense considering that when depowered Tyrant finally took on Galactus at the end of the arc, galaxies weren't being destroyed. The obviousness of this fact must have eluded you.
Galactus himself said the universe would be rubble if he faced off vs Tyrant when they first met after Tyrant came back from exile. That was his excuse to b|tch out and avoid fighting Tyrant.
Depowered Tyrant had the plot device ability to amp himself with Galactus' attacks. Nothing else depowered Tyrant performed on-panel by way of independent feats places him on Galactus' level. Your deflections onto his origins are noted and dismissed.
It wasn't a plot device. It was explained a few issues earlier that one of Tyrant's main sources of power is the biosphere of every planet in the universe (the other source being the Orbs of power he siphons from his victims). Galactus' Power Cosmic was/is nothing more than synthesized biospheric energy (which makes sense since Galactus feeds on living worlds).
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Galactus not wanting to engage depowered Tyrant early on is a complete non-feat. Your reliance on the speculation that galaxies would be destroyed if Galactus took on depowered Tyrant at that moment is pretty much nonsense considering that when depowered Tyrant finally took on Galactus at the end of the arc, galaxies weren't being destroyed. The obviousness of this fact must have eluded you.Depowered Tyrant had the plot device ability to amp himself with Galactus' attacks. Nothing else depowered Tyrant performed on-panel by way of independent feats places him on Galactus' level. Your deflections onto his origins are noted and dismissed.
A non feat... since when is on panel canon narration a non feat. Galactus, ya know, the being closely connected to the universe and exponentionally more informed on the Marvel universe and sensing Tyrant's power than you or I, believes Galaxies were going to be destroyed. That is far greater proof than, not uh I don't believe it from you. Further, did you consider Galacies weren't destroyed during their battle because it didn't go on very long. In their first encounter a battle that lasted significantly longer they were, so it's perfectly reasonable that a much much shorter battle hadn't destroyed any YET. However, this doesn't change the fact that Galactus believed they would be, and being that Tyrant was back to full power, if Tyrant hadn't kicked Galactus ass so quickly, they surely would've been.
Questions for you
1. Was Tyrant not created to be Galactus equal and a peer to Galactus?
2. Once Tyrant regained his power, did he not become a peer once again? (Which of course, is confirmed by Galactus prepping and feeding before battle which isn't typical and Galactus backing down form Tyrant for fear of Galaxies being destroyed)
3. Can Mangog destroy Galaxies as a side effect to a fight?
4. Would Galactus have trouble with Mangog?
^ We're talking about depowered Tyrant. The Tyrant that showed up out of exile, beat the crap out of Heralds and confronted Galactus in modern times. We're not talking about the original incarnation of Tyrant that was mentioned in flashbacks. Get with the program. Start by taking your foot out of your mouth. Then proceed to make a better argument.
Originally posted by zopzopWhich obviously is nonsense since when they finally fought each other at the climax of the entire Tyrant arc, the universe wasn't rubble.
Galactus himself said the universe would be rubble if he faced off vs Tyrant when they first met after Tyrant came back from exile. That was his excuse to b|tch out and avoid fighting Tyrant.
Originally posted by zopzopThat's a plot device to me. If you're trying to bandy words and draw me into a battle over semantics, I'm not interested. If you don't appreciate the term, "plot device," being used, fine. I'll call depowered Tyrant's power to amp himself with Galactus' attacks as "extremely convenient." And once again, completely irrelevant to classic Mangog.
It wasn't a plot device. It was explained a few issues earlier that one of Tyrant's main sources of power is the biosphere of every planet in the universe (the other source being the Orbs of power he siphons from his victims). Galactus' Power Cosmic was/is nothing more than synthesized biospheric energy (which makes sense since Galactus feeds on living worlds).
Originally posted by the DarkoneIt comes down to formidability. Tyrant is powerful enough to best Galactus just because he didn't do so when he was more powerful doesn't mean he can't when less powerful.
Great point, plus it nearly killed Odin in the process. DP Tyrant battle with Galactus was PIS since he was de-powered.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ We're talking about depowered Tyrant. The Tyrant that showed up out of exile, beat the crap out of Heralds and confronted Galactus in modern times. We're not talking about the original incarnation of Tyrant that was mentioned in flashbacks. Get with the program. Start by taking your foot out of your mouth. Then proceed to make a better argument. Which obviously is nonsense since when they finally fought each other at the climax of the entire Tyrant arc, the universe wasn't rubble.
That's a plot device to me. If you're trying to bandy words and draw me into a battle over semantics, I'm not interested. If you don't appreciate the term, "plot device," being used, fine. I'll call depowered Tyrant's power to amp himself with Galactus' attacks as "extremely convenient." And once again, completely irrelevant to classic Mangog.
But how could it be a plot device if it's in the characters powerset? Tyrant was made to be Galactus' equal not herald or servant. He drew his powers from the biosphere of every planet in the universe (and when he's greedy from power orbs he fills with his victims powers). Galactus feeds on living worlds (rich with biospheric energy). It was explained that the Power Cosmic Galactus fires off is nothing but synthesized biospheric energy.
Even Tyrant overpowering Galactus' control over his machines isn't PIS. It was explained in earlier issues that he's a technopath.
What's PIS is Galactus having no clue that Tyrant is a technopath and stupidly lashing out at him with his machines.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ We're talking about depowered Tyrant. The Tyrant that showed up out of exile, beat the crap out of Heralds and confronted Galactus in modern times. We're not talking about the original incarnation of Tyrant that was mentioned in flashbacks. Get with the program. Start by taking your foot out of your mouth. Then proceed to make a better argument. Which obviously is nonsense since when they finally fought each other at the climax of the entire Tyrant arc, the universe wasn't rubble. That's a plot device to me. If you're trying to bandy words and draw me into a battle over semantics, I'm not interested. If you don't appreciate the term, "plot device," being used, fine. I'll call depowered Tyrant's power to amp himself with Galactus' attacks as "extremely convenient." And once again, completely irrelevant to classic Mangog.
Concession accepted.
Did it ever occur to you that it wasn't turned to rubble because Tyrant kicked the crap out of Galactus too quick for that kinda of damage as a side effect?
Further, since Tyrant had gained most of his power back IF NOT MORE.. then it's totally relevant how their first battle went.. since ya know.. Tyrant was back again at that power or greater.