Originally posted by Shakyamunison
And the soldiers would shoot you with their M16s, oh wait, they didn't have M16s. Ok, let me revise that statement... And the soldiers would shoot you with their paint ball guns.
But apparently they have no problem shooting you with handguns.
...especially since the passenger's life vests proved to be an effective protection from paintballs.
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I have news for you, if you take a pipe and go up against a police officer you will be shot.
I have news for you: the police are not the armed services. On top of that, there is the whol issue of wether or not boarding these boats in the first place was legal. If a cop storms your house without a warrant, you're totally within your rights to take up a pipe.
I know such issues are really complex and difficult for you to understand. I have faith you will understand.
Besides, this is totally negating the entire fact that the activists probably wanted this to happen. And it did. And Isreal has already lost the PR war.
Originally posted by Ordo
If a cop storms your house without a warrant, you're totally within your rights to take up a pipe.
🤨
Unless you wanna get swiss-cheesed, no one in their right mind would do that.
Warrant or no warrant, a cop storming a house is totally out of their element, has his/her gun drawn and is ready shoot anything that moves. Ask any cop: house calls are the scariest art of their job.
That doesn't conflict at all with my statement. But since it was a dumb analogy that I tried to dismiss in my last post, its not worth continuing.
The point is Isreal's deputy foreign minister described the aid group as: “The armada of hate and violence in support of Hamas, a terror organization, was a premeditated and outrageous provocation. The organizers are well known for their ties to global jihad, al Qaeda, and Hamas. They have a history of arms smuggling and deadly terror.â€
Note, this group included ships carrying humanitarian aid, human-rights workers, about a dozen doctors, some 30 journalists, two retired U.S. diplomats (Amb. Edward Peck and Ret. Col. Ann Wright), a Nobel Peace Prize winner (Mairead Maguire), a former U.N. assistant secretary-general (Denis Halliday), and several members of parliament from Ireland, Germany, Sweden, Turkey, and Malaysia.
*facepalm*
FAIL.
Originally posted by Ordo
I have news for you: the police are not the armed services. On top of that, there is the whol issue of wether or not boarding these boats in the first place was legal. If a cop storms your house without a warrant, you're totally within your rights to take up a pipe.I know such issues are really complex and difficult for you to understand. I have faith you will understand.
Besides, this is totally negating the entire fact that the activists probably wanted this to happen. And it did. And Isreal has already lost the PR war.
So, in your world view, Israel does not have the right to defend its self?
BTW if you insult me again, I will place you on permanent ignore.
Originally posted by OrdoMore like take it UP the pipe.
I have news for you: the police are not the armed services. On top of that, there is the whol issue of wether or not boarding these boats in the first place was legal. If a cop storms your house without a warrant, you're totally within your rights to take up a pipe.
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
So, in your world view, Israel does not have the right to defend its self?BTW if you insult me again, I will place you on permanent ignore.
I really dont care about internet butthurt. It seemed to me that my jab was pretty damn mild.
What Isreal is doing is way beyond defending itself, even to the point of breaking international law. The problem with Isreal and its current insane government is that it views the very existance of Palestine as a threat to its existance. Thus, taking down Palestinians, anyone giving food to Palestinians, even US presidents and nobel peace prize winners who are trying to seek rational, interntationally supported solutions to the conflict is "defending its existance." Thats not defense, its paranoia and psychosis and Isreal is starting to act more like the rougue states it complains about.
The problem is, no one buys their bull anymore. Isreal is a nuclear nation with a tremendously powerful and advanced military. They're not the little guy, and they're damn near belligerant. If Isreal was Iran we'd be at war right now. DPRK did the same to South Korea a few weeks ago and look what kind of incident THAT caused...and at least that was a military target, not a civilian aid convoy.
The same thing? Are you completely nuts?
This was a cocked up boarding action- which, btw, is legal if the blockade is legal, even if it is in international waters. The intent was to seize the ships, not... sink them and kill everyone on board. The casualties are because it went wrong.
DPRK attacked and sunk a military vessel for no reason. A massacre with no provocation. The two are not even remotely comparable.
The Somalian pirates comparison is more appropiate, even though obviously different in many aspects.
Taking ships & folk hostages in international waters for money seems less bad and comical as attacking some aid carrying ships in international waters with PAINT BALL GUNS😆!! then shooting some people because after they noticed how #1 badly outnumbered #2 comically armed the Israeli´s were, decided to give them a kicking.
Well obviously, regardless of the literal legality of it, Israel would have done much better to wait for them to cross into their waters.
Of course, they didn't think they would cock up the boarding, which is where it has all gone wrong. Sure, it is likely the protesters were inflammatory and provocative, but Israel was the nation putting armed people onto the boat- the onus was on them to handle the situation properly. They cannot avoid responsibility for the deaths.
Originally posted by Ushgarak
Well obviously, regardless of the literal legality of it, Israel would have done much better to wait for them to cross into their waters.Of course, they didn't think they would cock up the boarding, which is where it has all gone wrong. Sure, it is likely the protesters were inflammatory and provocative, but Israel was the nation putting armed people onto the boat- the onus was on them to handle the situation properly. They cannot avoid responsibility for the deaths.
Though your words make a simple concept, it still amazes me that many, which includes the "expert" political commentary on cable news networks, seem to miss this.
Those tortilla (cause that's what flotilla reminds me of) Lil sh*ts should be called for what they are: instigators.
Israeli military should be called for what it did: hyperventilating, overzealous, war-mongers.
Which is why this whole scenario is ridiculous, because it clearly was a trap. Not only did Isreal all out take the bait, which had a very thick peace activist coating, but they killed civilians doing it.
And this of course gets back to the whole immature argument about Isreal "defending itself." Fania Oz-Salzberger summed it up well. "The army...is only good for one thing: to fight those who are aiming a gun at me. Not those who dislike me, demonize me, or hope to see me dead."
Isreal is doing more and more of the latter. Its not like Isreal doesnt get a lot of sympathy by default given its history, but antics like this wear that down, especially in the context of the past few years.
Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
i read that the Israelis found gas masks and bullet proof vests as well as individual envelops containing thousands of dollars, amongst the cargo.so, maybe there was more to this then just "providing aid".
Turkey searched the vessels before they left and said they were clean, so it might not be accurate