Originally posted by Galan007
^ "Try again?" What's with the arrogance around here?
I've earned the right to be arrogant by pwning people in debates using my secondary language for five years in a row. Nuff said? 😛
Anyhow, Yoda agreed with Obi-Wan's comment. So I'm assuming it was pretty valid. /shrug.
You do realize that it doesn't help your case when one characters opinion is shared by another character, right? They do not walk around in the various sources to speak the unquestionable truth. If we would follow that line of thought, Obi-Wan would be as wise as Yoda and as powerful as Mace Windu, because Anakin says so in AotC.
That aside, I don't see Yoda agreeing with Obi-Wan's idea that the trio belonged to the "best ever". He just agrees to the idea that, together, they might not be able to defeat Sidious.
So: Try again.
Why do people keep saying Sid defeated Yoda in battle... is there some alternate version of the movie or book that I missed when buying my copy?
Somebody said it best... those three Jedi, while technically skilled, weren't proficient force power users. It goes back to the debate I had with someone before.... You can be the best dojo jedi duelist in the world, but when when you face a life or death combat situation, then you truly know how skilled you are.
Originally posted by KuRuPT ThanosiIn some cases, superior technical skill with a lightsaber makes up for lesser prowess with the force.
Somebody said it best... those three Jedi, while technically skilled, weren't proficient force power users.
For instance: Kas'im vs. Bane, Anakin vs. Dooku (RotS), Mace vs. Sidious.
^ Ah yes, I forgot about the novel's interpretation. They both began tapping absurd amounts of force energy, but Dooku's body couldn't handle it as well as Anakin, and eventually began giving out. I think the novel stated something like Dooku aging 10 years for every strike Anakin delivered, or somesuch.
Regardless, my main point is still valid. Superior lightsaber skill can bridge the gap between lesser force powers.
Originally posted by Galan007
In some cases, superior technical skill with a lightsaber makes up for lesser prowess with the force.For instance: Kas'im vs. Bane, Anakin vs. Dooku (RotS), Mace vs. Sidious.
This can be true, but as I stated before my friend, those guys were technically good in the dojo but beat nobody of substance one v one. I equate them to be great teachers and technical masters in theory, but not awesome when it came to a one v one dual with somebody as good. They are what call All Star practice players... they look great and like all stars during practice.. come game time.. they don't make it off the bench.
^ That's your opinion, and it is fair. But remember, these same guys were actively fighting throughout the entirety of the Clone Wars. Call them 'theoretical masters' all you want, but they had battle experience under their belts.... And a lot of it.
Furthermore if they were merely 'fodder-Jedi', I doubt Yoda would have agreed with Obi-Wan's statement that "Sidious could easily pwn the two of us, if he killed all of them." /shrug
Originally posted by Galan007
^ That is your opinion. Remember, these same guys were actively fighting throughout the entirety of the Clone Wars. Call them 'theoretical masters' all you want, but they had battle experience under their belts.... And a lot of it.Furthermore if they were merely 'fodder-Jedi', I doubt Yoda would have agreed with Obi-Wan's statement that "Sidious could easily pwn the two of us, if he killed all of them." /shrug
It's my opinion because they beat nobody of substance in a one v one duel that I've ever heard of. If you can name me some people they beat, either jedi or sith, I would be more than happy to reconsider. Fighting in the clone wars and dispatching of random fodder proves they are technically awesome one ve one against a fellow force user and technical swordsman? Somebody can be technically good, but when it's game time, not so much.
^ It seems like you're stuck on the notion that these guys never laid their hands on a lightsaber in battle, before confronting Palpatine... Which isn't true. They fought [and survived] throughout the entire Clone Wars. Hell, even Mace Windu became much more battle hardened/refined from all the years of fighting -- so I'm sure they would have too.
Though I will admit that out of Kit, Saesee, and Agen, Kit certainly has the best feats (tooling Grievous and all.) But yeah, I understand where you're coming from. You want confirmed 'uber-class' feats, and [most of] these guys simply do not have them. However, I see no reason why Obi-Wan's "if Sids can defeat them, he could easily pwn us [he and Yoda]" comment wouldn't be valid in some way/shape/form.... Especially when Yoda agreed with it..?
Meh, it's all opinion based, I guess..