Cross-Genre Match #1: Vegeta vs Thor

Originally posted by Starscream M
abc logic is actually usable in regards to dbz, the fact that you think otherwise highlights your painful ignorance of said universe

a higher power level being in dbz is always faster and stronger than a lower power level being and can do anything that the lower level being can do better

Lol at using my "ignorance" of DBZ. Funny, considering you don't know what the hell you're talking about when it comes to Thor.

And no, not always. USSJ Trunks was more powerful than Cell, but his speed was shit. Once they reached a point, physically, the Z Fighters were essentially as strong and as fast as they were going to get. Their ki is what set them apart and made them insanely powerful. Just look at how the villains were all defeated. Spirit Bomb on Vegeta, Spirit Bomb on Frieza (at first), Gohan's Kamehameha, another Spirit Bomb to beat Buu. I just find it hilarious how energy attacks were being hyped up as the means to beat Thor at first until the multitude of scans flooded in. Now, because it's painfully obvious that Thor's energy defenses > Vegeta's energy offense, Vegeta will randomly not use any energy attacks because that's how he'd lose.

Even though that's how he fights consistently.

Originally posted by TheTyrant
Roshi with a power level of below 300 destroyed the moon. Picollo did the same thing with a power level below 500. SSJ Goku who was weaker than SSJ vegeta had a power level beyond 15000000 after just turning into a super saiyan.

Obviously, Vegeta could do alot more than destroy a solar system but i'm being generous.

The sun alone has over 1,000,000 times the mass of the moon.

thanks guys for letting me realize how powerful thor really is. well argued points

ABC logic isn't usable on this forum, DBZ or not.

Originally posted by marwash22
How is Durability Debatable when Vegeta get's cut/bruised, his bones can be broken, and his bones aren't nearly as tough as Thor's.

How is strength debatable? Has there ever even been a proper estimation of how Strong Thor is? As far i know, his strength is limitless.

Thors strength isn't limitless.You kinda have to use ABC logic to see just how powerful DBZ characters are.

Originally posted by marwash22
So far, all we have really discussed is Thor playing defense... Question is, how in the monkey tailed phuck, is Vegeta gonna survive an offensive attack from Thor?

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
-Even durability wise, Thor is Vegeta's superior. He's taken attacks from Odin, the Destroyer, Thanos, Celestials, etc. Adding in the defenses of Mjolnir make him quite capable against anything in Vegeta's arsenal.

-Without PIS? Yes. Even a CIS induced Thor won't tank attacks if he doesn't have to and his history shows more than enough feats to warrant him using Mjolnir to defend against every thing he can.

-DBZ characters have limits. After fighting for so long and using so many energy attacks, they begin to get tired and sluggish and more desperate. Their ki isn't unlimited. Hell, look at Super Saiyan 3 Goku. His body can't even sustain that transformation for too long. And in the Cell Saga, Vegeta was spent after the Final Flash, which took more than enough time for someone like Thor to interupt. Vegeta gets tired from using his energy attacks eventually, and Thor, on the other hand, can just use Mjolnir to defend as he remains fresh.

Null Bomb: http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Mjolnir/ThorMjolnir149-EnergyAbsorption.jpg

1/5 Universe destruction: http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Mjolnir/ThorMjolnir135-ForcefieldAvengersAn.jpg

Mjolnir can take everything Vegeta can throw at him and still be fine.

-Rain making it nigh impossible for even Hulk to move: http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsHulk51.jpg

-DBZ characters can "after image" but most of them can not legitimately teleport like Goku can. Cell and Buu both learn the Instant Transmission technique later. Vegeta never displayed teleportation.

-I doubt I can find a specific showing of this, but its something that most agree on. If Saiyans can breathe in space, it's not nearly as long as someone like Thor can. Not to mention Goku has almost drowned several times; they need to breathe. Thor doesn't.

-Thor being tossed on the other side of the planet is debatable if its even possible for Vegeta to accomplish. Even so, Thor can teleport on his own. Vegeta's not BFRing Thor more effectively than Thor can BFR him.

-He uses his powers when the situation calls for them. He has more than enough showings to suggest he'll use his versatility when he needs to.

In any case, Thor's more durable and has more stamina, is fast enough for Vegeta to be unable to "speed blitz" him like some people think he would. Skill goes to Vegeta, but it's not enough for him to overcome the advantages Thor has with Mjolnir.

Their durability is debatable.They have both taken very strong hits.Stamina goes to thor.Pretty much this

I see it more like this

-Their durability can be debateable
-Thor has more stamina
-Thor is faster
-Vegeta has faster combat speed
-Vegeta is more skilled
-Their strength is debateable.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Again, who said anything about the Godblast? He doesn't need the Godblast to beat Vegeta here, who conversely, needs the Big Bang or Final Flash to beat Thor. Standard lightning or energy blasts from Thor have been depicted as incredibly powerful, to say nothing of the Anti-Force or his geothermal blasts. Thor doesn't just "tank" energy blasts if he doesn't have to though, that's what most people are trying to tell you. Generally speaking, if people shoot a beam at Thor, he uses Mjolnir to block/absorb it. It's one of the main reasons why high end energy manipulators are at a disadvantage against Thor in forum fights.

Originally posted by marwash22
That is incredibly dumb.

Vegeta's stamina is shit compared to Thor's, after all these energy attack you say will occur, Thor will be at full strength and Vegeta will be depleted. This is basically a waiting game for Thor, Vegeta has absolutely nothing to put Thor down and after his assault, Thor goes on the offensive and the prince of all Saiyan's will die.

Originally posted by Starscream M
abc logic is actually usable in regards to dbz, the fact that you think otherwise highlights your painful ignorance of said universe

a higher power level being in dbz is always faster and stronger than a lower power level being and can do anything that the lower level being can do better

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I just find it hilarious how energy attacks were being hyped up as the means to beat Thor at first until the multitude of scans flooded in. Now, because it's painfully obvious that Thor's energy defenses > Vegeta's energy offense, Vegeta will randomly not use any energy attacks because that's how he'd lose..

Their ki levels descend and they grow weaker as time goes by though.

Never mind the fact that even in the Buu saga, attacks which could blow up the planet still took time to prepare and charge up. Thor's not some idiot DBZ fighter who will let his opponent power up his attack and he sure as hell isn't stupid enough to not use Mjolnir to defend against it.

And even if Vegeta could casually rape galaxies (he can't), he's never even done so or attempted to do so in his fights, so it's baseless any damn way. If the planet gets destroyed, Vegeta just screwed himself.

Originally posted by Starscream M
I challenge you to find ONE statement where I mentioned vegeta's energy attacks will be an advantage.

I challenge you to back up anything you're saying with Vegeta's actual feats from the anime or manga.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
So because DBZ does thing realisticly that means he's not as durable?Because he gets cuts and broken bones when thor has taken attacks that should do that it means thor is tougher?

Thors strength isn't limitless.You kinda have to use ABC logic to see just how powerful DBZ characters are. By dodging it considering his combat speed it much faster or simply taking it.Vegeta warrior pride would make him tank things(but so would thors)but it's going to take a bit to put vegeta down.
-And vegeta has taken hits from cell,majin buu,etc... and some of those times he wasn't even SS2.If he goes to SS4 he's going to stomp thor.
-He will always try to absorb them?With CIS wouldn't he try even tanking one or two hits.And why are people thinking he's going to be able to absorb every single attack thrown at him.His blasts are pretty damn powerful so what happens when one connects?
-I'm just saying that yes they get tired but they have never collapsed from exashution during a fight.
-I noticed in both of those scans that thor is taking energy from something not moving.And thor died in one of them so...yeah.
-Don't want to downplay it but it looks like the rain held him for 1 panel.
-Huh...most people say he can't.I thought I remembered him having instant transmission but I guess I was wrong.Meh.But I still don't get what that after image thing is.And what about vegeta outrunning the hammer?
-So is thors tactic going to be to destroy the planet and let vegeta suffocate?I never remember thor not needing to breath.He might be able to hold his breath for hours but not need to breath?
-Thor has more methods of BFRing vegeta but that doesn't mean one is more likely to do it then another.
-Yes he has the showings.But will he do it?He might just try to bash vegetas head in.But when that doesn't work he will have the ability to go versitile

Their durability is debatable.They have both taken very strong hits.Stamina goes to thor.Pretty much this

No he doesn't need to use godblast to beat vegeta but vegeta also doesn't need big bang/final flash to beat thor.And standard ki blasts from vegeta have also been shown to be extremely powerful.Also will thor be able to absorb every single ki blast?If one connects it's going to hurt.A lot.And not saying thor is going to tank it but his warrior pride might make him(although the same can be said for vegeta). So thor does abosolutely nothing but play defensive until vegeta runs low on energy?No.Thor will go on the offensive.And vegeta or anyone has never collapsed from using too mcuh energy.The much they have done is pant really hard.

I don't get where you think Thor's CIS comes in so he feels this need to tank damage needlessly when its easier and more effective to use Mjolnir as he's done from like 40+ years. When does his warrior pride make him go "Phuck, I'm just going to take this attack."?

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Pretty sure blocking a blast from Phoenix's telepathic blast is a much better feat than catching bullets.

He doesn't fight like a DBZ character, no, flying around sending a flurry of punches and kicks in every which way. But he does have FTL reflexes where it counts. That's the thing people don't or simply won't get about Thor. He's not a super speedster like Flash or even Superman. But his feats show him able to respond at incredibly fast levels and he has enough of them to prove that "speedblitzing" alone won't be his downfall.

Heck, Thor's moved faster than Heimdall could react. HEIMDALL.

And if he can move that fast, I'm reasonably certain that Vegeta's not going to phuck him up with speed.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
So now we've gone from Vegeta beating Thor clearly to now using Thor's CIS against him? There are far more instances of Thor using Mjolnir to block energy attacks than there are of him "tanking" them. Thor's CIS has him use his weapon when needed and as often as necessary.

Vegeta's CIS makes him unload a crapload of energy attacks which Thor just blocks or absorbs. Thor counters. The end.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Lol.

Vegeta can't win this without his energy attacks, which easily dwarf the damage of his physical blows. And his energy attacks get nullified by Thor and Mjolnir anyway.

Besides, Vegeta isn't going to melee Thor, not based on like every single fight in DBZ history. He's going to use his energy attacks, and that's when Thor trounces him.

And once vegeta relizes energy attacks don't work he's not going to keep doing them.Vegeta is arrogant,not an idiot.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
lulz

this begs the question: when prey tell does vegeta realize he is only relegated to melee attacks? is this before or after he gets his signature attack(s) thrown back at him one hundredfold?

Originally posted by Starscream M
vegeta only uses final flash and big bang as a last resort

fights usually start off as melee

and thor wouldn't last long enough for vegeta to have to resort to his 'big' attacks

thor would be like a statue punch bag for vegeta to work his anger issues off on

Originally posted by marwash22
Whaaaaaaaaa? That's fanboy-level hyperbole. Planet busting ki blasts take at least a few minutes to charge. Not to mention they are slower than shit.

Originally posted by marwash22
I didn't look for it. The basic idea that you think Vegeta will beat Thor using melee attacks, is what made me laugh.

Originally posted by -Pr-
ABC logic isn't usable on this forum, DBZ or not.

level one freiza was a planet buster
he was surpassed by level 2 freiza
he was surpassed by level 3 freiza
he was surpassed by final level freiza
he was surpassed by SS goku
SS goku would be surpassed by SS2 vegeta.

Also are you really leaving or was that another planned joke in the mod lounge?

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Never mind the fact that even in the Buu saga, attacks which could blow up the planet still took time to prepare and charge up. Thor's not some idiot DBZ fighter who will let his opponent power up his attack and he sure as hell isn't stupid enough to not use Mjolnir to defend against it.

And even if Vegeta could casually rape galaxies (he can't), he's never even done so or attempted to do so in his fights, so it's baseless any damn way. If the planet gets destroyed, Vegeta just screwed himself.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I don't get where you think Thor's CIS comes in so he feels this need to tank damage needlessly when its easier and more effective to use Mjolnir as he's done from like 40+ years. When does his warrior pride make him go "Phuck, I'm just going to take this attack."?

Originally posted by Black bolt z
ABC is really the best way to distunguish just how powerful people are.Like

level one freiza was a planet buster
he was surpassed by level 2 freiza
he was surpassed by level 3 freiza
he was surpassed by final level freiza
he was surpassed by SS goku
SS goku would be surpassed by SS2 vegeta.

Also are you really leaving or was that another planned joke in the mod lounge? Buu took about 5 sec to charge a blast that destroyed a planet... Thought I've seen him do it before.Doesn't thors warrior honor sometimes get in the way?The again the exact same thing can be said for vegeta.

So, because DBZ is hard up on the actual feats needed to debate characters, it's okay to use ABC logic? Because it's DBZ? That's faulty and phucked up logic. I don't see what's so hard about using Vegeta's feats from the Buu Saga, ie. things Vegeta actually did on his own, not projecting feats on to him because he's supposedly more powerful than another person. Show or tell me exact speed feats from Vegeta. Show me these strength feats of his. Not Frieza's, not Cell's, but Vegeta's and his alone.

If I used ABC logic with Thor, this thread would veer off the edge.

Five seconds is a lot to work with when you're Thor and you have the reaction time he does, anyway.

And no, I'm hard pressed to find a situation where Thor decides not to block with Mjolnir because his pride dictates it.

http://www.otakucenter.com/dragon-ball-z-ep-113-double-t1923.html

^ talking about androids draining their energy just by touch + goku fighting an android (while SS) and others noticing him steadily losing power + the same android absorbing his kamehamaha wave like nothing

we learn that ki energy can be absorbed either directly from the character or in the form of blasts just by the palms of endroids

🙂

5 seconds is a really, really, really long time if both parties have ftl combat feats

Originally posted by Lord_Talron
5 seconds is a really, really, really long time if both parties have ftl combat feats

if thor wanted to, he could toss mjolnir twice lightspeed, vegeta is thus phucked

Originally posted by psycho gundam
http://www.otakucenter.com/dragon-ball-z-ep-113-double-t1923.html

^ talking about androids draining their energy just by touch + goku fighting an android (while SS) and others noticing him steadily losing power + the same android absorbing his kamehamaha wave like nothing

we learn that ki energy can be absorbed either directly from the character or in the form of blasts just by the palms of endroids

🙂

So bascially what you guys are saying is that Roshi/Frieza wwere more powerful than vegeta?

Originally posted by Starscream M
and of course mjolnir can replicate what androids do, RIIIIIIIGHT? 🙄

😆

Anyways, this thread shows that the entire cross genre threads can work at least to some extent. That counts for something.

I'm off.

By the way, Thor wins.