Atheism

Originally posted by 753
they are more than 50% of the global christianfold.

You mean "less than 50% of Christianfold." Additionally, not all Catholics believe in original sin

Originally posted by 753
you are correct that most contemporary catholics do not hold on to original sin doctrines any longer, however.

I appreciate you telling me I am correct: I need the affirmation and congratulation.

Originally posted by 753
...I understand of course that interpretations of scripture vary widely and most contemporary christians do not uphold the fundamentalist views prevalent among pentecostal protestants I was addressing.

That's definitely not who you were addressing in the post I quoted and responded to:

Originally posted by 753
the logic of salvation from eternal damnation through religeous conversion and adoration of the christian deity sure helped christianity spread.

It's really quite brilliant:

Originally posted by 753
what sin would be unforgiveable?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=unforgivable+sin

All the places I look up say it's pretty close to 50%, but above it.

Do you have sources, dadudemon? Didn't some major shift happen lately?

Originally posted by Bardock42
All the places I look up say it's pretty close to 50%, but above it.

Do you have sources, dadudemon? Didn't some major shift happen lately?

I do not like the Pew's numbers which is what you used, most likely.

I do not include Anglicanism, Oriental Orthodoxy, or Eastern Orthodoxy in the "Catholic" group. If it could be my way, only the Roman Catholic Church would be counted as Catholic and all other groups, even if in communion with the pope, would not count. You may now cry foul because of the Pew's study excluding or including various parts of what I mentioned.

However, by my counting, non-catholics comprise a majority. If you add in that Catholics baptize infants, the numbers are likely much smaller if asking people...which the Pew study did not legitimately find. They aggregated data: they did not ask people, themselves, for the most part.

Most of the groups you mentioned (with the exception of the Eastern Orthodox group, and I doubt anyone ever considers them "Catholic" for statistical purposes) would really change things much if you included or excluded them from the counting.

And even if you were to take a hammer to Catholic numbers, they still vastly outnumber ALL Protestant denominations combined. Even if Catholics aren't a majority (you still haven't offered any sources to show this), certainly they still make up a plurality by a comfortable margin against any other single denomination or denominational bloc.

Originally posted by dadudemon
I do not like the Pew's numbers which is what you used, most likely.

I do not include Anglicanism, Oriental Orthodoxy, or Eastern Orthodoxy in the "Catholic" group.

The 2010 Pew study classified the Orthodox churches as Orthodox and Anglican as Protestant. Although I would like to see an exact breakdown since they mention including small groups "not in communion with the Pope" as Catholics.

The strictest definition of Catholic I can think of is "Latin rite Catholic" (the Church of Rome). The non-Latin Catholic churches have about 17 million people. This would mean that Dadude wants us to say that 50.0% of Christians are Catholic rather than the 50.1% Pew told us.

http://www.cnewa.org/source-images/Roberson-eastcath-statistics/eastcatholic-stat10.pdf

1.295 Billion Non-Catholics

1.2 Billion Catholics.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations_by_number_of_members

The end?

I remember a few years back there being a big deal because, out of Christians, the non-Catholics outnumbered the Catholics for the first time. This was probably more than a decade ago. Protestant faiths rejoiced because it was a big milestone.

So 48.1%?

I think I'll round to avoid false precision. How about we call it 50%?

Originally posted by dadudemon
1.295 Billion Non-Catholics

1.2 Billion Catholics.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations_by_number_of_members

The end?

I remember a few years back there being a big deal because, out of Christians, the non-Catholics outnumbered the Catholics for the first time. This was probably more than a decade ago. Protestant faiths rejoiced because it was a big milestone.

The link you gave puts it between 1.05 and 1.25 billion and says "Some sources, which put the number at 800 million, include also Anglicanism (see below) within Protestantism." so excluding Anglicanism again, which would be counted double, it's between 1.05 and 1.174 ... both below the 1.2 billion your source gives for Catholicism.

So, taking your source alone, I agree, "the end", Catholicism is over 50% of Christianity.

If we want to look at "Protestant Faiths" being more than 50%, that is not even close, as Eastern Orthodox is by no means "Protestant".

Originally posted by Bardock42
The link you gave puts it between 1.05 and 1.25 billion and says "Some sources, which put the number at 800 million, include also Anglicanism (see below) within Protestantism." so excluding Anglicanism again, which would be counted double, it's between 1.05 and 1.174 ... both below the 1.2 billion your source gives for Catholicism.

Your math is wrong: it would be 1.246 not 1.174.

.800+.23+.085+.082+.049=1.246 billion.

Check the result:

is 1.246>1.2?

Yes.

Conclusion: there are more non-Catholic Christians than Catholics in the world.

Also, the Catholic side would be 1.094 if you want to use a legit low-end estimate.

Originally posted by Bardock42
If we want to look at "Protestant Faiths" being more than 50%, that is not even close, as Eastern Orthodox is by no means "Protestant".

If that were my point, then I would have said it. Since I didn't, then there's no need to explore this.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Your math is wrong: it would be 1.246 not 1.174.

.800+.23+.085+.082+.049=1.246 billion.

Check the result:

is 1.246>1.2?

Yes.

Conclusion: there are more non-Catholic Christians than Catholics in the world.

See, that's where you are bullshitting, you are taking the high end estimates for Protestantism, even though your source even states that the high end estimates include the Anglican church. That's counting .085 billion twice. You also disregard that the estimate for protestantism starts at .6 billion.

So yes, if you count Anglicanism twice, and take the most generous estimates for protestantism, then non-Catholics might have a slight edge. But taking this discrepancy into account at most we can say it is close and we can't call it (although the numbers are leaning towards Catholicism being larger)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations_by_number_of_members

If you want to use a different source, go ahead, but this one mostly speaks against your claim.

Yeah, that math was inflated, here it states a total of 2.1 bil Christians (as a whole), not that 2.45 bil number.

List of religious populations

couldn't you just say Catholicism is, by far, the largest Christian denomination, with some nod to it being close to, if not, 50%?

otherwise the argument is more semantic/about demarcations than any substantial differences between the groups...

Originally posted by Oliver North
couldn't you just say Catholicism is, by far, the largest Christian denomination, with some nod to it being close to, if not, 50%?

otherwise the argument is more semantic/about demarcations than any substantial differences between the groups...

Why not argue about it instead though? Thread's pretty boring otherwise.

ok...

why group Protestant denominations together? The church of England in the UK shares very little in common with Evangelical communities in the southern United States. The "non-Catholic" group is fairly artificial in the first place.

Why it matters so much if Catholics are 49% or 52% or whatever% of Christians? lol

Originally posted by Bardock42
See, that's where you are bullshitting, you are taking the high end estimates for Protestantism, even though your source even states that the high end estimates include the Anglican church. That's counting .085 billion twice. You also disregard that the estimate for protestantism starts at .6 billion.

Wrong: I also included the 1.2 for the Catholics. 😐

And, no, sorry, I'm still right. You just don't see it. You get like this sometimes. It is better to just ignore it.

Hint: Just because some sources that conclude 800 million for protestants include Anglicanism does not mean that that group is required to reach 800 million. Look down the list that I listed: it is not included and it separate. I am not counting it twice. In fact, I am not "counting" anything as that is not my list. 😐

Originally posted by Oliver North
ok...

why group Protestant denominations together? The church of England in the UK shares very little in common with Evangelical communities in the southern United States. The "non-Catholic" group is fairly artificial in the first place.

There are significant differences between the Anglican Communion and the Roman Catholic Church. Also, The Troubles continue today between Catholics and protestants. Lastly, the Anglican Communion is so diverse in the way it does stuff that it makes it near impossible to group it with the Roman Catholic Church.

On another note, I am glad to see the protestants being separated out from the Orthodox, Roman Catholics, and the Restorationists.

So, in conclusion, Catholicism is probably more than 50% of Christians, but the margin of error is too large to say for certain.

They all worship a magic zombie, isn't that description apt?

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
They all worship a magic zombie, isn't that description apt?

All atheists are smug and worship science even though the majority of them have little to no scientific knowledge whatsoever. Isn't that description apt?