Originally posted by marwash22
Edward went from Washington to Phoenix (that's roughly one thousand miles) in less than 10 minutes... which would clock him in at around 5000pmh.
It's 1500 miles, not 1000 (forks is north of Seattle by about an hour drive, but from Seattle, it's 1500.)
The speed would translate to 9,000 Mph.
And it wasn't Edward, it was James. Edward is faster (by far). Edward was left everyone in the dust when James started to go after Bella on the Baseball field.
I don't remember Edward running that distance in 10 minutes, though. That would put their speed into-perspective, though, and it would explain why Bella described Edward as seeming to teleport and, consequently, scaring her.
But it doesn't matter that a Twivamp is super fast: a Jedi can react to a 9,000Mph vampire, no problem, because their arms were seen moving 9,000 Mph in the films during saber duels.
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
Blaster bolts move much faster than commercial airliners, and Jedi can deflect them from multiple angles.Oh, and a Twilight vampire cannot defeat the 51st
No they don't. You're late to the game, man. It's been established that Blaster bolts move around 100-300 Mph, depending on the scene.
In some scenes, it's as low as sub-60 Mph (trash compactor).
Here's a frame by frame from another person:
http://www.electricferret.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=2638
46.5 m/s is about 105 Mph (did the math in my head, so it could be off a bit..but not much.) That's definitely within the range I already spoke about.
I think the scene with Obi Wan and Jango Fett, in Ep. II, had Jango's bolts traveling closer to 300Mph. (Maybe the difference is that Jango has super awesome pistols? Would be likely.)
Originally posted by dadudemonHaving an opinion on the victor and determining the outcome are two different things, babe.
Not even close. I haven't made tons of threads and determined the outcome before even making those threads yet. I also gave up after a dozen posts about it. I was also right, unlike everyone else that is blinded by their anti-twivamp rage.Four reasons why I can't even hold a candle to you yet, RJ.
I don't have any anti Twilight feelings.
Originally posted by dadudemon
No they don't. You're late to the game, man. It's been established that Blaster bolts move around 100-300 Mph, depending on the scene.In some scenes, it's as low as sub-60 Mph (trash compactor).
Here's a frame by frame from another person:
http://www.electricferret.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=2638
46.5 m/s is about 105 Mph (did the math in my head, so it could be off a bit..but not much.) That's definitely within the range I already spoke about.
I think the scene with Obi Wan and Jango Fett, in Ep. II, had Jango's bolts traveling closer to 300Mph. (Maybe the difference is that Jango has super awesome pistols? Would be likely.)
Originally posted by HewhoknowsallHere's my argument:
Jedi see vampires.
Vampires see Jedi. Jane uses her pain abilities, and Alec disables all their senses.
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
Vampires charge at Jedi.Jedi use the Force to hold the Vampires in place.
Jedi Force pull the Vampires to them while igniting their lightsabers and impaling the Vampires.
Yeah, except both sides have full knowledge and prep on each other (actually Jedi get no prep cause they would figure Alice would know their plan anyway, so their best plan is probably to have no plan) so they aren't going to run in and commit suicide like you would want them to.
Plus its been pointed out by DDM that the level of speed vamps have are too great for the Jedi to handle.
Oh, did I mention Jane and Alec screws them up from the get go?
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
I have not seen any argument that effectively counters this.
You might need to get your eyes checked.
Can Jane target more than one Jedi at a time? In the movies?
Can Alec target all the Jedi at once, who will surely be spread out over a wide area?
Not even gonna comment on Alice. The slightest thing can change her vision. A Jedi sidestepping, Jasper farting, someone tripping, and the entire vision is shot.
Speed......What difference does it make if the Twivamps are faster? The Jedi will know where the Twivamps will be before they get there. Wait, haven't I said that? Even the fattest, most out of shape Jedi, IF their precog was working, would be able to determine where and when he would be attacked. It's simple: Sense danger, extend lightsaber, hold on while it cuts. If the Jedi precog is working as it should, this isn't even open for debate. hell, the Jedi could be a buncha fatass Hutts and still win.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedinope. Her's only works on one person at a time but it's immediate.
Can Jane target more than one Jedi at a time? In the movies?
Originally posted by Rogue Jediyep. But what's this about them being spread out? That's not how Jedi operate in combat at all. There are always at lest two or three that stand back to back. Anyhow, yeah, Alec's power works on multiple targets at once.
Can Alec target all the Jedi at once, who will surely be spread out over a wide area?
Originally posted by Rogue JediHer precog works perfectly in combat 😬.
Not even gonna comment on Alice. The slightest thing can change her vision. A Jedi sidestepping, Jasper farting, someone tripping, and the entire vision is shot.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedisince when do all jedi have battle precog? I think you're confusing that with that weird Spidey-sense thing they have where they can "sense a disturbance in the force"... it's an extension of 'Force vision' and it only alerts them of impending danger, it's not battle precog like Alice has. So yeah, they'd be able to tell if danger was approaching but they can;t see the direction of an attack or predict their opponent's moves.
Speed......What difference does it make if the Twivamps are faster? The Jedi will know where the Twivamps will be before they get there. Wait, haven't I said that? Even the fattest, most out of shape Jedi, IF their precog was working, would be able to determine where and when he would be attacked. It's simple: Sense danger, extend lightsaber, hold on while it cuts. If the Jedi precog is working as it should, this isn't even open for debate. hell, the Jedi could be a buncha fatass Hutts and still win.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Speed......What difference does it make if the Twivamps are faster? The Jedi will know where the Twivamps will be before they get there. Wait, haven't I said that? Even the fattest, most out of shape Jedi, IF their precog was working, would be able to determine where and when he would be attacked. It's simple: Sense danger, extend lightsaber, hold on while it cuts. If the Jedi precog is working as it should, this isn't even open for debate. hell, the Jedi could be a buncha fatass Hutts and still win.
And er, where in the film do Jedi show precog on such a level? Anticipating someone will be speeding in and everything else they will do? Oh wait they haven't.
Guess Anakin, at the height of his power, should have seen Obi Wan cutting him down after performing that jump. + many countless other examples.
Also, even with Precog, vamp reflexes will trump them. Vamps will see the blade coming at them and move accordingly. Your theory is fail.
Originally posted by Placidity
And er, where in the film do Jedi show precog on such a level? Anticipating someone will be speeding in and everything else they will do? Oh wait they haven't.
On what level? Sensing danger, knowing when and where it's coming from? Um....All 6 movies.....
Guess Anakin, at the height of his power, should have seen Obi Wan cutting him down after performing that jump. + many countless other examples.I have already explained why precog sometimes fails. Shall I explain again?
Also, even with Precog, vamp reflexes will trump them. Vamps will see the blade coming at them and move accordingly. Your theory is fail.Vampires are fast when moving around, yeah, but when in actual combat? Not near as fast. A Jedi would have no problem striking them with their lightsaber.
Again with the vampires speed......Doesn't matter The Jedi will know where the vampires will be at any given second.If Emmett decides to run at Anakin, jump over him, land behind him? Anakin will know this. He'll reverse his saber and cut him in two.
If a vampire is twenty feet away and can be behind Obi Wan in the blink of an eye, Obi Wan will sense this, spin and decap them.
If Carlisle decides to jump at Dooku, Dooku will sense this, know right where Carlisle is, catch him in midair with a force hold, and hurl him into the lava.
I am forced to repost this:
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Who has the better precog, who is the fastest, who is the strongest, this shit is a moot point.So what if Alice has better precog? The Jedi have precog and will know [b]when
and where she will attack, as will every other Jedi. There is absolutely no way a Twivamp gets close enough to a Jedi without the Jedi knowing about it a split second beforehand. Anakin will sense Jasper coming at him and attacking from the right, so Anakin will force push him into the lava or cut him to bits.Look at how fast Yoda is while fighting:
And ANakin/Obi Wan/Maul:
bPLXwrj7i7Q&feature=related
Dooku:
Check out what he does to Obi Wan at 1:20.
And check out what Obi Wan does to the droids at 1:10.[/b]
Now pay attention, this part is the clincher:
Look at the speed that Anakin and Obi Wan and Maul display. Want more proof that a Jedi can fight/react fast enough that he strikes a Twivamp?
In the third vid, Obi Wan is rushing up the stairs to rejoin the battle at 1:10. Two super battle droids are a foot away, firing FULL AUTO blaster fire on him. Obi Wan blocks it all, quite easily, never slowing down, and wastes them. THAT is all the proof you need to answer whether a Jedi can strike a Twivamp with a lightsaber.
The droids are RIGHT THERE, in his face, a foot away, BOTH OF THEM pouring down AUTO BLASTER FIRE ON HIM. He blocked Blocked ALL of it and cut them to pieces.
If you ignore it, or try to reason why it happened, you're trolling.
Not to mention the Fett's attacking from above, raining down blaster fire and missiles on the Twivamps.
More, you say?
b-iHuz-mpq4&feature=related
Obi Wan and QGJ, facing two droidekas. Full auto blaster fire coming at them. Never hit them.
Force speed, anyone? Obi Wan and QGJ are down the hall, at least two hundred feet away, in less than two seconds. People like to argue that Jedi can use force speed whenever they want, so I'll go with that. Not as fast as the Twivamps, but fast enough to evade if need be. MORE than fast enough to cut them to bits.
Originally posted by marwash22
Edward went from Washington to Phoenix (that's roughly one thousand miles) in less than 10 minutes... which would clock him in at around 5000pmh.
Originally posted by marwash22K. So as she is mind raping a Jedi, Dooku grabs her in a force hold and hurls her into the lava. Buh bye Jane.
nope. Her's only works on one person at a time but it's immediate.
yep. But what's this about them being spread out? That's not how Jedi operate in combat at all. There are always at lest two or three that stand back to back. Anyhow, yeah, Alec's power works on multiple targets at once.Jedi operate however they need to in combat. Knowing the Twivams powers, would you bunch up like a buncha covered wagins fighting against savages?
K, and it has been established that Alec needs line of sight. He messes with one Jedi, another will force push him into the lava. Buh bye Alec.
Her precog works perfectly in combat 😬.Never said it didn't.
since when do all jedi have battle precog? I think you're confusing that with that weird Spidey-sense thing they have where they can "sense a disturbance in the force"... it's an extension of 'Force vision' and it only alerts them of impending danger, it's not battle precog like Alice has. So yeah, they'd be able to tell if danger was approaching but they can;t see the direction of an attack or predict their opponent's moves.facepalm Force precog is a universal force power. It warns the Jedi of danger, of where and when it is coming.
Here, look at how fast the Twivamps move when actually fighting:
Not as fast as you guys are making it out to be.
And oh my, is that Alice being grabbed by a Volturi? Where's the precog?
BTW: So Alice has precog, big ****in deal. Every one of the Jedi have it. Alice is the only Twivamp to have it. Thanks for playing.
And look at how fast Obi Wan and Anakin fight/react:
MORE than fast enough. Nothing left to do but sweep up the Twi mess.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
On what level? Sensing danger, knowing when and where it's coming from? Um....All 6 movies.....I have already explained why precog sometimes fails. Shall I explain again?
No, you explained it as if they have Alice-level precog, knowing events well before they happen. That's a crock of shit and you know it, but you're welcome to point to feats. I know I could probably post about a whole page of instances where precog has failed, so don't even try that "fails sometimes" crap. They've only showed to have precog only briefly before things happen such as deflecting a blaster bolt.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Vampires are fast when moving around, yeah, but when in actual combat? Not near as fast. A Jedi would have no problem striking them with their lightsaber.Again with the vampires speed......Doesn't matter The Jedi will know where the vampires will be at any given second.If Emmett decides to run at Anakin, jump over him, land behind him? Anakin will know this. He'll reverse his saber and cut him in two.
If a vampire is twenty feet away and can be behind Obi Wan in the blink of an eye, Obi Wan will sense this, spin and decap them.
If Carlisle decides to jump at Dooku, Dooku will sense this, know right where Carlisle is, catch him in midair with a force hold, and hurl him into the lava.
Good job completely ignoring what I said.
Reasons why you are fail:
1. Again Jedi have only ever showed precog briefly before they happen, not minutes, not hours or whatever the shit you would try to have us believe. So they can only see things briefly before they occur. This is evident as they can deflect blaster bolts, but if there are too many of them, they often cannot handle it because they aren't fast enough even if they do see it coming. Same deal with Vamps, but only many times faster than a blaster bolt as per DDM.
2. Regarding striking where they think the vampire will be - you said it doesn't matter how slow the fat Jedi is. This is complete shit. Say you are moving in slow mo (as I perceive you), and you had a precog I will run behind you, so you swing your saber behind you preemptively. Too bad for you I am so much faster than you that I can see you swing it in slow motion. Am I going to continue on my path and run into the sabre?
Vamps can change their fate too. The future you saw did not include you preemptively striking where I will be, so the future that happens will not be the same future that you saw.
Or to put it in another way, the future you saw involved me coming up behind you and ripping your head off. Because you changed the events that were going to occur, by trying to cut me with a saber at where you think I will appear, you have effectively changed the future because I would react differently.
Consider your mind blown and owned.
Originally posted by Placidity
No, you explained it as if they have Alice-level precog, knowing events well before they happen. That's a crock of shit and you know it, but you're welcome to point to feats. I know I could probably post about a whole page of instances where precog has failed, so don't even try that "fails sometimes" crap. They've only showed to have precog only [b]briefly before things happen such as deflecting a blaster bolt. [/b]
Alice sees the future, yes, and it can all be changed in an eyeblink. I don't see how one Twivamp having precog helps them. If they all had it, yeah, but just Alice? It's not like she has some kind of mind meld with her comrades.
The Jedi have brief glimpses of possible futures, the past, and their battle precog. The possible futures are, as Yoda stated, always in motion, and difficult to predict.
Luke: "I saw a city in the clouds...."
Yes, precog has failed the Jedi before. A few instances:
Episodes 1-3: Why? Because Sidous was using the dark side to hinder the Jedi being able to see the future.
Episode 4: Vader ambushed by Han. Why did this happen? Because Vader was focusing completely on Luke in the trench.
Episode 6: Luke getting shot in the hand. How did this happen? Because he was fighting a shitload of guys, all blasting at him all at once.
Episode 6: Vader rose up and chucked Palpy down the shaft. Why did this happen? Because Palpy was completely focused on torturing Luke.
Verdict? When a Jedi is focusing completely on something else, their precog to other dangers around them is hindered.
QGJ "Keep your concentration here and now, where it belongs."
Obi Wan "But Master Yoda says to be mindful of the future."
QGJ "But not at the expense of the moment. Be mindful of the livjng force."
See? Focus completely on one thing and you risk missing something, more or less.
Good job completely ignoring what I said.Don't start that shit, I am speaking politely to you, speak politely to me.Reasons why you are fail:
1. Again Jedi have only ever showed precog briefly before they happen, not minutes, not hours or whatever the shit you would try to have us believe. So they can only see things briefly before they occur. This is evident as they can deflect blaster bolts, but if there are too many of them, they often cannot handle it because they aren't fast enough even if they do see it coming. Same deal with Vamps, but only many times faster than a blaster bolt as per DDM.
Because the future is always in motion, dude. What does seeing the future hours in advance help here? On the spot battle precog trumps that all day every day.
So if Edward Cullen is standing beside Han Solo, Han fires a blaster bolt at a target 100 feet away, Edward can run and reach the target first? I call bullshit.
2. Regarding striking where they think the vampire will be - you said it doesn't matter how slow the fat Jedi is. This is complete shit. Say you are moving in slow mo (as I perceive you), and you had a precog I will run behind you, so you swing your saber behind you preemptively. Too bad for you I am so much faster than you that I can see you swing it in slow motion. Am I going to continue on my path and run into the sabre?And the Jedi battle precog will see the adjustment as it is made, see where the Twivamp wil be next, will know just where to strike a second time. Continue reading for indisputable proof of this.
Vamps can change their fate too. The future you saw did not include you preemptively striking where I will be, so the future that happens will not be the same future that you saw.
Or to put it in another way, the future you saw involved me coming up behind you and ripping your head off. Because you changed the events that were going to occur, by trying to cut me with a saber at where you think I will appear, you have effectively changed the future because I would react differently.And the Jedi are more than fast enough to react and redirect their offensive.
Once again:
Now pay attention, this part is the clincher:
Look at the speed that Anakin and Obi Wan and Maul display. Want more proof that a Jedi can fight/react fast enough that he strikes a Twivamp?
In the third vid, Obi Wan is rushing up the stairs to rejoin the battle at 1:10. Two super battle droids are a foot away, firing FULL AUTO blaster fire on him. Obi Wan blocks it all, quite easily, never slowing down, and wastes them. THAT is all the proof you need to answer whether a Jedi can strike a Twivamp with a lightsaber.
The droids are RIGHT THERE, in his face, a foot away, BOTH OF THEM pouring down AUTO BLASTER FIRE ON HIM. He blocked Blocked ALL of it and cut them to pieces.
Hmm?
Now, how do the Jedi keep track of all that shit and move their attack to the necessary location? Battle precog. Auto fire Blaster bolts flying in from all directions, the Jedi blocks them all. Blaster fire. Precog. Block. Blaster fire at a different angle. Precog. Block. See?
Consider your mind blown and owned.Um.....I don't swing that way, babe. I'm bilangual, there's a difference.
Originally posted by Placidity
Vampires see Jedi. Jane uses her pain abilities, and Alec disables all their senses.Yeah, except both sides have full knowledge and prep on each other (actually Jedi get no prep cause they would figure Alice would know their plan anyway, so their best plan is probably to have no plan) so they aren't going to run in and commit suicide like you would want them to.
Plus its been pointed out by DDM that the level of speed vamps have are too great for the Jedi to handle.
Oh, did I mention Jane and Alec screws them up from the get go?
You might need to get your eyes checked.
I don't think you get it.
The Jedi turn on their lightsabers. Vampires can't stop this.
The Jedi Force pull the vampires. Vampires can't stop this.
The Jedi impale the vampires. Vampires can't stop this.
Vampires can't stop the Jedi from using their lightsabers, they can't stop the Force and they can't withstand a lightsaber attack.
All of these claims about the vampires being faster/stronger/etc. aren't that relevant when the Jedi just ignite their lightsabers and Force pull the vampires on to them.