Originally posted by Lunacyde
You do realize that Cassie is basically Shiva trained from an extremely young age to be the most efficient and deadly assassin she could be and then trained by Batman on top of that...Cassie knows 127 forms of combat, Daredevil knows 5.
So more equal better.
You do realize Nick Fury stated there only a hand full of people that know what DD does do you?
Meaning more doesn't always equal better.
She didn't lose to Connor Hawke, she won. The impressive thing Connor did was hold his own for awhile.
Batman's never beaten Shiva without outside aid.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
To my knowledge Shiva never lost to Connor Hawke she actually had the edge or beat him IIRC. Connor did stalemate Cass at one time.
I don't think Cass has even gone at it with Connor for real. They did clash a little at the start of their teamup but it was a ruse to find out if Connor was the one behind some arrow-killings.
Cassandra is generally considered the very top, IMO *slightly* higher than Shiva, and she's got some pretty crazy physical feats and probably the best move reading in comics. Losing to her doesn't say much.
Originally posted by Q99
She didn't lose to Connor Hawke, she won. The impressive thing Connor did was hold his own for awhile.Batman's never beaten Shiva without outside aid.
[quote=Daredevil1]To my knowledge Shiva never lost to Connor Hawke she actually had the edge or beat him IIRC. Connor did stalemate Cass at one time.
I don't think Cass has even gone at it with Connor for real. They did clash a little at the start of their teamup but it was a ruse to find out if Connor was the one behind some arrow-killings.
Cassandra is generally considered the very top, IMO *slightly* higher than Shiva, and she's got some pretty crazy physical feats and probably the best move reading in comics. Losing to her doesn't say much. [/QUOTE]
Yes, thats my bad, getting appearances mashe dup in my head. My point however is simple, pure H2H skill Shiva is better than Daredevil and Black Panther. Panther may win becaus eof enhanced physicality on top of skill, but not skill alone.
Originally posted by Q99
She didn't lose to Connor Hawke, she won. The impressive thing Connor did was hold his own for awhile.Batman's never beaten Shiva without outside aid.
[quote=Daredevil1]To my knowledge Shiva never lost to Connor Hawke she actually had the edge or beat him IIRC. Connor did stalemate Cass at one time.
I don't think Cass has even gone at it with Connor for real. They did clash a little at the start of their teamup but it was a ruse to find out if Connor was the one behind some arrow-killings.
Cassandra is generally considered the very top, IMO *slightly* higher than Shiva, and she's got some pretty crazy physical feats and probably the best move reading in comics. Losing to her doesn't say much. [/QUOTE]
I'm pretty sure Shiva also defeated her in a rematch, thanking Cassandra for showing her how sloppy she had gotten in the process.
Almost every time Shiva has been beaten some kind of plot device (usually poison) is involved.
Originally posted by Omega Vision
I'm pretty sure Shiva also defeated her in a rematch, thanking Cassandra for showing her how sloppy she had gotten in the process.
To my knowledge.....nope. Shiva once had a major advantage against Cass but that's when she was training Cass after she lost her body reading ability and Cass still KO'ed her via surprise attack IIRC.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
So more equal better.You do realize Nick Fury stated there only a hand full of people that know what DD does do you?
Meaning more doesn't always equal better.
Implying the Marvel Handbook(a secondary canon source) holds prevalence over the things said in comics which can directly contradict this.
Its better to go by things that actually happen in comics.
Even going by things that happen in comics Shiva is superior to DD and BP (w/o enhancements).
Daredevil is adept in 5 styles IIRC. He is peak human at most physically.
Shiva is said to be a master of all styles, has displayed peak human reflexes, and has beaten opponents that are both Daredevil's peers physically, and know more styles than him.
That's like a candidate in a Presidential debate saying I don't have the figures now but go look them up at the library, they're there and they're easily accessible. It's not our responsibility to provide the proof or even go look it up, it's the responsibility of the person making the claim.
I have no clue what scan you are referring to, there are tons of pages, and exponentially more scans in there...I will not go searching through it looking for something I don't even know what looks like or whether it's there.
If you wish to be lazy and not provide for the claims you make then don't debate in the thread.