Mass Effect 3

Spoiler:
Gathering the army has a massive impact on what happens. The ending cinematic may not change, but what happens during the last mission DOES change depending on the choices you've made throughout the game, and most of those choices are going to be directly or indirectly affected by previous choices in the series.

Also your stated plothole isn't really a hole. There are plenty of possibilities that make perfect sense as to why Sovereign was still left behind. Perhaps the AI was inactive during the events of the first game. Perhaps the Reapers aren't even aware that they are being controlled (much like indoctrinated people aren't aware that they're being controlled by the reapers). Perhaps the AI doesn't control the citadel itself, but only the reapers, and simply exists on the citadel. And of course there's the "dream" theory that GK mentioned earlier that seems to actually make a lot of sense when you break it down.

Simply because Bioware left some things open for discussion and interpretation doesn't mean the ending is inherently bad or doesn't make sense. It just means they wanted to provoke thought more than give a sense of complete and utter closure on the entire universe. Which makes sense seeing as there will absolutely be more games in the Mass Effect universe. And those games will likely answer whatever questions were raised at the end of this game

Spoiler:
I do think the whole thing is a dream sequence, if I recall months ago, the entire script was leaked and that would have forced Bioware to change the entire ending with only a month or two to spare, this would have given them time to think up of a new one. The reason why I think it was a dream is because of the fact that the catalyst taking the form of a human child when it is billions of years old is fishy, It was likely harbinger trying to break the fourth wall and indoctrinate the player himself with the choices, testing the players resolve to complete the mission and the whole point of the games, destroy the reapers and not attempt a compromise like other species have tried and failed in the past, that's why if you deny it and choose to keep your mission on destroying the reapers he will wake up at the end even though the child says you would have died, it's you waking up from an attempted reaper indoctrination.

Spoiler:
Shepard: I AM ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL!

😛

Originally posted by Nemesis X
You guys don't get it. The endings don't make sense!

Spoiler:
Okay so in the Citadel, there's a Reaper AI/God/Kid thing and it's the one responsible for creating the Reapers and if the Citadel has this thing, what's the point of leaving Sovereign behind after the Prothean genocide? Couldn't the Catalyst have just activated the Citadel in ME1 and then everything would've gone according to plan?

Our choices were supposed to be reflected in the end but they weren't. While they didn't seem reflected at the end of ME1 or 2 but this is ME3, the conclusion to Shepard's story. Everything he/she has done should've been worth mentioning in the end at least. Instead, almost everyone's **** gets ****ed up, the Mass Relays explode, and galactic civilization has been reduced to modern civilization (if you know what I mean) no matter which choice you make. What's the point of gathering this huge army if what you do is still gonna end with the same thing with the only difference in one of 'em is Shepard surviving?

Spoiler:
Throughout the second and third game, your choices are constantly being mentioned. Your getting feedback on every choice you made. Leaving Ashley to die in the first, is reflected back in the third game. Deciding to leave someone alive, or killing them off changes how your story pans out. I don't know what you expected but there is no way an ending could showcase everything you did in the previous two games. It would be like a list that needed to be check off. The ending was decent but it ended the game in a good way as well as ending Sheppard story without totally killing any sort of sequel.

Originally posted by Smasandian
I didn't know there was colours as well. Oh well.

I don't understand what the incredible problem people have with the endings. Is it just a case of people bitching online? Or is there an issue. I don't understand the idea that people are annoyed that none of their choices they made in the three games are not reflected with the endings. Isn't that the case with all three games? Each game has distinct ending that doesn't change with any sort of choices.

I might be wrong and forgetful but you will always defeat Saren and Sovereign, you will always defeat the human reaper in the second game. Why would the third game be any different. I could understand if the game ended abruptly but it did not. The ending was fitting.

It's illogical, full of plot holes, does literally nearly as much damage as it resolves, and there's a whole lot of things left unexplained. But at least we get a scene with stargazers!!

The only way this makes sense is if Shepard hallucinated the whole thing. It's laughable at the number of mistakes in the ending.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvrIFIjTGt0

All of this instantly irrelevant. Shepard better be freaking dreaming what happened.

Originally posted by BackFire

Spoiler:
Gathering the army has a massive impact on what happens. The ending cinematic may not change, but what happens during the last mission DOES change depending on the choices you've made throughout the game, and most of those choices are going to be directly or indirectly affected by previous choices in the series.

Spoiler:
The only thing War Assets and choices have given me in the final mission is the option to turn everyone into an organic-synthetic hybrid. Yay 🙄

With all the War Assets I collected, you'd think maybe you'd see some extra dead Reapers and more people in the battlefield on Earth. Maybe see Geth, Rachni, an Elcor with rockets mounted on it's back, or Salarians riding on cloned space dinosaurs (yes, that's actually one of the war assets I **** you not) mowing down husks but no, that doesn't happen much to my disappointment.

Spoiler:
Also your stated plothole isn't really a hole. There are plenty of possibilities that make perfect sense as to why Sovereign was still left behind. Perhaps the AI was inactive during the events of the first game. Perhaps the Reapers aren't even aware that they are being controlled (much like indoctrinated people aren't aware that they're being controlled by the reapers). Perhaps the AI doesn't control the citadel itself, but only the reapers, and simply exists on the citadel. And of course there's the "dream" theory that GK mentioned earlier that seems to actually make a lot of sense when you break it down.

You actually have a point there I guess and it better darn well be a dream.

Spoiler:
Simply because Bioware left some things open for discussion and interpretation doesn't mean the ending is inherently bad or doesn't make sense. It just means they wanted to provoke thought more than give a sense of complete and utter closure on the entire universe. Which makes sense seeing as there will absolutely be more games in the Mass Effect universe. And those games will likely answer whatever questions were raised at the end of this game

Spoiler:
I'm getting the feeling you're just trying to convince yourself that the endings are good but really aren't. I see where you're coming from with this and all but it still doesn't make me want to forgive Bioware for that crap they just pulled anytime soon. It just feels wrong.

Originally posted by Nemesis X

Spoiler:
The only thing War Assets and choices have given me in the final mission is the option to turn everyone into an organic-synthetic hybrid. Yay 🙄

With all the War Assets I collected, you'd think maybe you'd see some extra dead Reapers and more people in the battlefield on Earth. Maybe see Geth, Rachni, an Elcor with rockets mounted on it's back, or Salarians riding on cloned space dinosaurs (yes, that's actually one of the war assets I **** you not) mowing down husks but no, that doesn't happen much to my disappointment.

You actually have a point there I guess and it better darn well be a dream.

Spoiler:
I'm getting the feeling you're just trying to convince yourself that the endings are good but really aren't. I see where you're coming from with this and all but it still doesn't make me want to forgive Bioware for that crap they just pulled anytime soon. It just feels wrong.

Spoiler:
The war assets also affect if team mates on the final mission die. If you don't have enough Liara and Garrus and anyone else on your team can die. And earth itself will be destroyed. So it does make a difference.

Also I'm not trying to convince myself of anything. You can agree or disagree, but I sincerely felt the endings were pretty good as is and was satisfied with the conclusions. I felt the ending was emotionally poignant and fitting of the theme and tone of the game/series. I know others disagree and that's fine, as I said there are reasonable complaints some have about the ending, just personally speaking I enjoyed it.

If you didn't not play multiplayer you need 8k war assets to get the "best" ending.

Spoiler:
When you get 4k EMS AND if you chose the destroy ending, you get a 1 second clip of Shepard breathing on Earth.

Which is further proof that Shepard was in the process of indoctrination. The scene of TIM and Anderson was a cliched conscience angel/devil shoulders thing however if Shepard were hallucinating it then it makes sense. And it covers all those plot holes.

Then it makes up for the ATROCIOUS adding of the reaper god kid. Why would the Reapers suddenly try to sympathize with Shepard when Soverign and Harbinger say all the time that humans can't understand the Reapers goal and that they are actually saving humanity? Hopefully it's not due to shitty writing but the Reapers trying to inception Shepard in choosing synthesis or control. Which explains those are the paragon and neutral choice, because you're in the middle on indoctrinated inception. Whereas the renegade choice is killing them all because the Reapers obvi don't want that.

But if BioWare were that sneaky the writers wouldn't hesitate to let us lesser beings know of their intentions. It's probably just shit writing.

Originally posted by Toshi
If you didn't not play multiplayer you need 8k war assets to get the "best" ending.

Spoiler:
When you get 4k EMS AND if you chose the destroy ending, you get a 1 second clip of Shepard breathing on Earth.

Which is further proof that Shepard was in the process of indoctrination. The scene of TIM and Anderson was a cliched conscience angel/devil shoulders thing however if Shepard were hallucinating it then it makes sense. And it covers all those plot holes.

Then it makes up for the ATROCIOUS adding of the reaper god kid. Why would the Reapers suddenly try to sympathize with Shepard when Soverign and Harbinger say all the time that humans can't understand the Reapers goal and that they are actually saving humanity? Hopefully it's not due to shitty writing but the Reapers trying to inception Shepard in choosing synthesis or control. Which explains those are the paragon and neutral choice, because you're in the middle on indoctrinated inception. Whereas the renegade choice is killing them all because the Reapers obvi don't want that.

But if BioWare were that sneaky the writers wouldn't hesitate to let us lesser beings know of their intentions. It's probably just shit writing.

Spoiler:
Bioware stated that we should hang on to our saves after we beat the game, and the ending itself said the story will be continued, in some manner, in DLC.

What does that tell you?

Spoiler:
I don't know why people keep insisting certain endings are renegade or paragon. All the endings broke away from these criteria. For example, people keep insisting that the destroy ending is the paragon choice. It's not, afterall you are committing genocide against the Geth.

It tells me that they want to screw me over for more money like every other company? Or is the new over defending narrative one that BioWare is so charitable and full of good that all appeals to authority are valid?

Originally posted by BackFire

Spoiler:
The war assets also affect if team mates on the final mission die. If you don't have enough Liara and Garrus and anyone else on your team can die. And earth itself will be destroyed. So it does make a difference.

Also I'm not trying to convince myself of anything. You can agree or disagree, but I sincerely felt the endings were pretty good as is and was satisfied with the conclusions. I felt the ending was emotionally poignant and fitting of the theme and tone of the game/series. I know others disagree and that's fine, as I said there are reasonable complaints some have about the ending, just personally speaking I enjoyed it.

Spoiler:
Still doesn't change any events on the battlefield and even though my squadmates seem to get hit by Harbinger's beam, they keep reappearing next to Joker on a faraway planet. Why does that happen anyway? Did my squadmates seriously think to themselves "**** this $#!+" and actually leave when I wasn't looking? Jerks. Anyways, at least the assets I collected in ME2 were mentioned and shown unlike the assets I collect in 3 which, to me, I think is lazy.

Okay, so it's your opinion. I can respect that.

Do you really think Bioware is going to start talking about the ending when the game's only been out a week? They've said they aren't saying anything yet because there are still a lot of people who haven't completed the game.

Originally posted by BackFire
Do you really think Bioware is going to start talking about the ending when the game's only been out a week? They've said they aren't saying anything yet because there are still a lot of people who haven't completed the game.

http://www.ingame.msnbc.msn.com/technology/ingame/director-mass-effect-3-responds-those-critical-its-ending-442217

Originally posted by Nemesis X

Spoiler:
Still doesn't change any events on the battlefield and even though my squadmates seem to get hit by Harbinger's beam, they keep reappearing next to Joker on a faraway planet. Why does that happen anyway? Did my squadmates seriously think to themselves "**** this $#!+" and actually leave when I wasn't looking? Jerks. Anyways, at least the assets I collected in ME2 were mentioned and shown unlike the assets I collect in 3 which, to me, I think is lazy.

Okay, so it's your opinion. I can respect that.

Spoiler:
If you look during the final charge in London, your squadmates are behind you, and don't move at all. Personally I think they appear on the Normandy at the ending because it's some extension in Shepard's head of wanting her companions to be safe.

Originally posted by BackFire
Do you really think Bioware is going to start talking about the ending when the game's only been out a week? They've said they aren't saying anything yet because there are still a lot of people who haven't completed the game.

Or started even...there's a good load of people not playing it until they fix the face import issue

Originally posted by CadoAngelus
Or started even...there's a good load of people not playing it until they fix the face import issue

And they can't just bring their Shepard's appearence back through customs?

Originally posted by Toshi
If you didn't not play multiplayer you need 8k war assets to get the "best" ending.

Spoiler:
When you get 4k EMS AND if you chose the destroy ending, you get a 1 second clip of Shepard breathing on Earth.

Which is further proof that Shepard was in the process of indoctrination. The scene of TIM and Anderson was a cliched conscience angel/devil shoulders thing however if Shepard were hallucinating it then it makes sense. And it covers all those plot holes.

Then it makes up for the ATROCIOUS adding of the reaper god kid. Why would the Reapers suddenly try to sympathize with Shepard when Soverign and Harbinger say all the time that humans can't understand the Reapers goal and that they are actually saving humanity? Hopefully it's not due to shitty writing but the Reapers trying to inception Shepard in choosing synthesis or control. Which explains those are the paragon and neutral choice, because you're in the middle on indoctrinated inception. Whereas the renegade choice is killing them all because the Reapers obvi don't want that.

But if BioWare were that sneaky the writers wouldn't hesitate to let us lesser beings know of their intentions. It's probably just shit writing.

Spoiler:
I was under the impression when Sheppard got the the final control room, the "kid" decided to change the outcome of what has happened for many thousands of cycles because he was the first organic to ever step foot in that room, and that's why he was giving the choice to change the predictable event.

As well, I was under the impression that the little boy controls the Reaper and they do whatever the "kid" says. Also, I don't remember any sort of mention that the kid was a Reaper, I thought he was something more powerful that uses the Reapers for its own means.

Rumor/Leak of upcoming ME3 DLC (Which may potentially be free)

(Spoilers in the comments, obviously, fyi)

http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2012/03/16/rumor-mass-effect-3-story-dlc-the-truth-arriving-in-april