Master Chief vs Sauron

Originally posted by Nephthys
Whoa, speculation much? 😬

I for one am completely for the school of logic that more feats = more powerful, or should I say more, superior feats = more powerful, just as I am that 5 is a higher number than 2. It's basic logic. Isildur and Elendil do jack all in the movies and pretty much both die like punks. Aragorn does actual impressive things in the movie. 5 > 2.

Brilliant.

Following that school of logic, Isildur defeating Sauron in direct combat trumps just about anything Aragorn has done, provided that the latter just faced Sauron's minions. There you go...

That aside: Aragorn uses Elendil's name as battle cry in multiple occassions of the trilogy - I think he does so for a reason...

a) Or it could mean that Aragorns ancestors ruled pretty much half the continent whereas Aragorn is some punkass ranger running around in the woods. Or possibly that one of his blood is directly responsible for Saurons continuation and was the Ring's ***** (though personally I see Elrond as much to blame for that, he didn't exactly bust a gut stopping him). Theres nothing suggesting Elrond was talking about combat ability at all.

Being aware of the backstories Tolkien did invent for all of his characters, this seems a somewhat laughable argument. In likewhise makes no sense for the movie version, when you consider the fact that Elrond wants Aragorn to take up the sword that was left as heirloom for him. He doesn't want him to knock on the gates of Minas Tirith to just make himself king, right? So, obviously, Elrond isn't referring to the birth rights of Aragorn here.

b) Agreed, his bloodline is superior to others. Numenorean (whose blood runs in his veins) are physically superior to other men and as you pointed out live longer.

Which was the entire point here. Numenoreans aren't normal men. Yet, Elrond mentions that the bloodline has watered down. Taking that into consideration, one has to assume that the likes of Isildur and Elendil were more powerful than Aragorn himself (since they were born Numenoreans).
In fact, Elendil was 322 years old when he was killed by Sauron (Aragorn died of old age when being 123 years old) and, according to the source material, Elendil was about 7.9 feet tall.

I remember in the appendix of LotR, an entry stated that Aragorn 120 years after he was crowned. That would make him about 209.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I remember in the appendix of LotR, an entry stated that Aragorn 120 years after he was crowned. That would make him about 209.

I think you're correct there. There is still a noteable difference between dying a natural death at 210 and being mortally wounded in battle at the age of 322. Especially when you consider that Elendil didn't exactly look like being on the brink of natural death in the movie.

Brilliant.

Following that school of logic, Isildur defeating Sauron in direct combat trumps just about anything Aragorn has done, provided that the latter just faced Sauron's minions. There you go...

That aside: Aragorn uses Elendil's name as battle cry in multiple occassions of the trilogy - I think he does so for a reason...

Umm, no. Isildur got off an incredibly lucky strike against Sauron while he was unprepared. He didn't defeat him in combat. Thats like saying that Pippin (or was it Merry?) > the Witch King becuase he stabbed him in the back. Furthermore, Isildur got killed in an orc ambush while he was running away like an utter sissy. The guys pathetic. 3.05

YouTube video

Aragorn would have taken out the entire ambush by himself, let alone with 50+ soldiers with him. 😬

Again, nothing suggests he uses Elendil's name because the guy was was complete badass. Especially when we see the guy get taken out in under a second by Sauron, as above. Thats the only quantifiable thing Elendil does on screen. Colour me unimpressed.

Being aware of the backstories Tolkien did invent for all of his characters, this seems a somewhat laughable argument. In likewhise makes no sense for the movie version, when you consider the fact that Elrond wants Aragorn to take up the sword that was left as heirloom for him. He doesn't want him to knock on the gates of Minas Tirith to just make himself king, right? So, obviously, Elrond isn't referring to the birth rights of Aragorn here.

Thats my point. Elrond calls the bloodline weak because its descendant is a random ranger, but that doesn't mean that it can't become strong again by retaking its rightful place as king. Also, Elrond directly links Isildur keeping the ring to the weakness of men, 'The blood of men is weak. I was there, X years ago. It should have ended that day. But Isildur kept the ring. There is no strength in the will of men.' See below for the actual scene.

Which was the entire point here. Numenoreans aren't normal men. Yet, Elrond mentions that the bloodline has watered down. Taking that into consideration, one has to assume that the likes of Isildur and Elendil were more powerful than Aragorn himself (since they were born Numenoreans).

In fact, Elendil was 322 years old when he was killed by Sauron (Aragorn died of old age when being 123 years old) and, according to the source material, Elendil was about 7.9 feet tall.

Pure speculation that flys in the face of what we see on screen. You have nothing but your own interpretation that Elrond was speaking about Aragorns/Isildur's combat abilities. In fact, I'd quite like to see the scene in which he says this so we can know the context in which he was speaking. That ought to straighten things up a bit.

Source material has no place here. This is a movie forum. Only movie stuff applies.

Ah, here it is:

YouTube video

2.15 to the end.

Originally posted by Borbarad
I don't think that the "more screentime, more feats = more powerful" school of thinking does deliver accurate results when attempting to judge the power of characters. Elrond does mention multiple times, that the Numenorean blood is weak, because Aragorn refuses to act according to his role. That tells us two things:

a) That the ancestors of Aragorn have archived more things than Aragorn himself as of the time the words were spoken (which is after his fight on the Withertop against the Nazghul for example).

b) That his bloodline is considered something special, above the regular mortals. Which is also emphasised throughout the trilogy. In "The Two Towers" (at least the Special Extended Edition) Aragorn mentions to have fought among Theoden in the youth of the Rohan king, revealing that he's in his 80s.

Again: How do you conclude this? All you can compare them to are other individuals of Tolkiens universe and we don't know how they compare to ordinary humans of today. Going by the fact that Tolkiens narration follows a "golden age" topos in general, one could conclude, that the earlier people lived, the more powerful they were. This is hinted in the films and becomes painfully obvious, when one looks into the books, where Elves and Men of the past took it up with dragons and balrogs in single combat (not to mention with Melkor himself).

Right. Let me do a check here. Sauron was just killed, because he was hit with a lucky strike surprise attack, with a magic weapon that was previously broken. This just worked, because Sauron was seperated from his ring.

We don't know if any ordinary weapon would be sufficient to cut through Saurons armor (Narsil / Anduril has been shown to be sharp after serveral thousand years and could parry strikes of a ghost) and if a "regular human" could even perform that task.

And I think you're vastly underestimating Sauron. According to the movie canon (Gandalf claiming he could become as powerful and terrifying as Sauron should he use the ring), we have to assume that Sauron is at least as powerful as Gandalf. And that's refering to his magical abilities. Even by watching the introduction, when he starts swinging his mace, it's rather obvious that the result of his swings aren't coming from his physical strength only. In fact, we do see surges of energy emanating from the mace, tossing the victims of the attacks backwards (hard enough to actually kill them all, if going by the fade of the people we see getting hit).

I wonder if this all has been mentioned in the respective Halo sources. This is, after all, the movie versus forum, isn't it? Because if we use all kind of sources, this will be a landslide victory for Sauron, given that he is a demigod in Tolkiens world, capable of pretty powerful magic.

Yet, again: I think you're underestimating Sauron's abilities while not taking the circumstances of his "death" into consideration. Essentially, were talking about Sauron, armed with magical abilities, coupled with tremendous physical strength, going down because getting his by a magical weapon with a surprise attack - an attack that did hit his only weakspot, which is the only way to "kill" Sauron.

Do you really think that Master Chief would be able to cut Sauron's fingers off (removing the Ring) before getting clubbed to death? I'm not so sure here. But I have to admit that I don't remember all Halo cutscenes with Master Chief in action...

No, what I said. You're wrong on all accounts that contradict mine. This is the MVF, not another forum. Going by movie feats, Aragon is much more capable than his ancestors.

Stick to what is seen in the movie or the extras on the DVDs.

Magic weapon: nope. Not magical at all. You're introducing things in the movie that do not exist.

Already acknolwedged that the mace is magical. Already covered why the mace isn't doing jack.

No, if we get to use all kinds of sources, it's an even larger victory for Chief.

Fact is. the LOTR fanboys have vastly overestimated Sauron baed mostly on myth. What happened to Sauron IN STORY against two gents that were MUCH weaker and MUCH slower than John? They broght Sauron to his knees. What happened in the movie? A coward and a regular man grabbed a brokwn sword that was very brittle and cut off Sauron's fingers as he reached for Isildur. Much different...that movie Sauron would be even weaker, imo.

*Reads other posts in this thread*

I guess all of you are forgetting that if you use book materials, you still fail to overcome any Spartan II, much less Master Chief. A Nummie is a pile of pudding compared to a naked Spartan II. Lest you guys forget that a regular human of similar stature to a Spartan (that would be a select few Nummies) II would turn to pudding if they entered the Mark VI armor. That's because it takes an ultra=strong skeleton and muscles to wear the armor.

LOL at anyone who says Master Chief isn't as strong as the other Spartan II that was see throwing a large metal re-entry pod. It's a Spartan II: that's a fact. 🙂 I love it.

Well, Chiefs screen feats are about as equal to that of Faramir. Not that impressive, i have NEVER seen Chief do ANYTHING particularly "spartan-ish"

So quit saying he some uber human, while arguing that Sauron isnt nothing because he has few screen feats, fact is, Chief has LESS.

And, if we go by EXACTLY what we see on screen, Chief is a normal guy in armor.

Originally posted by dadudemon
No, what I said. You're wrong on all accounts that contradict mine. This is the MVF, not another forum. Going by movie feats, Aragon is much more capable than his ancestors.

Stick to what is seen in the movie or the extras on the DVDs.

And then, the Movie Versus Forum rule says this:

"What is seen on screen is canon in these forums. If your character you wish to use has feats/actions/handicaps that contradict what that character did on screen (movie canon), then it is a violation and is illegal."

Urm. To me that sounds that feats from non-movie material can be used unless contradicting what is shown on film.

Magic weapon: nope. Not magical at all. You're introducing things in the movie that do not exist.

Really? So regular blades stay sharp for several thousand years and can parry strikes from ghosts? Nope. I don't think so.

Already acknolwedged that the mace is magical. Already covered why the mace isn't doing jack.

You covered that how exactly? From what is seen in the movie, the mace simply kills anything it hits, regardless of armor or actual power of the victim. "The power of the one Ring could not be undone", as the narration says.

Fact is. the LOTR fanboys have vastly overestimated Sauron baed mostly on myth. What happened to Sauron IN STORY against two gents that were MUCH weaker and MUCH slower than John? They broght Sauron to his knees. What happened in the movie? A coward and a regular man grabbed a brokwn sword that was very brittle and cut off Sauron's fingers as he reached for Isildur. Much different...that movie Sauron would be even weaker, imo.

Fact is, that when Sauron comes walking on the battlefield, the situation, according to Galadriels narration changed from "victory was near" to "all hope was lost" only by Sauron's appearance on the spot. That implies that the entire assembly of elves and men gathered before Barad-Dur didn't have enough power to defeat Sauron in combat.

You think a single mortal can do the job? Seems a bit odd. But I'm not surprised, given your judgement of Sauron's presense in the books. He is directly defeated only twice. Once by the power of Luthien and Huan combined, with the former having enough power to bewitch Morgoth himself. The other incidence was Isildurs lucky strike in a situation, just to mention it again, in which "all hope was lost". That when the battle was, essentially, Sauron VS all men and elves still alive on the battlefield.

I guess all of you are forgetting that if you use book materials, you still fail to overcome any Spartan II, much less Master Chief. A Nummie is a pile of pudding compared to a naked Spartan II. Lest you guys forget that a regular human of similar stature to a Spartan (that would be a select few Nummies) II would turn to pudding if they entered the Mark VI armor. That's because it takes an ultra=strong skeleton and muscles to wear the armor.

I guess you're forgetting that Sauron is a damn Maiar in the books, capable of shapeshifting and thereby altering his physical appearance according to his means. Morgoth, for example, using the same abilites once walked Arda in form of a giant, with his feet in the water of the oceans and his head in the clouds, while he literally knocked over mountains, spilled oceans and incinerated entire continents.

Master Chief is going to do what against magic? I may remind you that Saruman outright mentions that there is no way to stop Sauron, even for him and Gandalf combined, which should give you an idea about how powerful Sauron was while wielding the One Ring. Then, just to mention it again, we have the narration from the intro, marking Saurons appearance on the battlefield a turning point in that conflict (from the elves and men close to victory to them losing all hope). And, of course, we've seen that the Ring is capable of transporting the wearer into the wrath world, rendering him invisible.

Master Chief is going to triumph over an invisible enemy, that not only happens to be one of the most powerful creatures of Middle-Earth, but also wields a weapon who one-hit-kills anybody it hits? A being that, even when not in best shape, commands the likes of the Witch King of Angmar around, who easily "disarmed" Gandalf with magic:

YouTube video

Really. If the Witch King can do that, so can Sauron. I'd love to see what Master Chief does to Sauron, after his armor and all his weapons have been turned into tiny metal shards by Sauron's magic in an instant. Bore the Dark Lord to death?

Written material on characters, eg comic books, books, graphic novels etc doesn't count in here, as it's the Movie Vs Forum; not the Movie/Comic/Book Vs Forum.

Impediment has stated this before numerous times and it's been the rule in here since the start. Otherwise we have Ang Lee Hulk being able to hold up a mountain or Brandon Ruth Superman tugging shitloads of planets.

PM him if you must to clarify.

Originally posted by Robtard
Written material on characters, eg comic books, books, graphic novels etc doesn't count in here, as it's the [b]Movie Vs Forum; not the Movie/Comic/Book Vs Forum.

Impediment has stated this before numerous times and it's been the rule in here since the start. Otherwise we have Ang Lee Hulk being able to hold up a mountain or Brandon Ruth Superman tugging shitloads of planets.

PM him if you must to clarify. [/B]

I don't need any clarification on that issue. My argument also works without out-of-movie details.

Originally posted by Borbarad
I don't need any clarification on that issue. My argument also works without out-of-movie details.

Seems you do, cos you went on to cite the books concerning Sauron's power and also decided to give Sauron magical abilities he did not show in the film.

Originally posted by Borbarad
And then, the Movie Versus Forum rule says this:

"What is seen on screen is canon in these forums. If your character you wish to use has feats/actions/handicaps [b]that contradict what that character did on screen (movie canon), then it is a violation and is illegal."

Urm. To me that sounds that feats from non-movie material can be used unless contradicting what is shown on film. [/B]

Originally posted by Robtard
Written material on characters, eg comic books, books, graphic novels etc doesn't count in here, as it's the [b]Movie Vs Forum; not the Movie/Comic/Book Vs Forum.

Impediment has stated this before numerous times and it's been the rule in here since the start. Otherwise we have Ang Lee Hulk being able to hold up a mountain or Brandon Ruth Superman tugging shitloads of planets.

PM him if you must to clarify. [/B]

Additionally, you said this:

Originally posted by Borbarad
I don't need any clarification on that issue. My argument also works without out-of-movie details.

Incorrect. You've used multiple references external to the movies. I'm the type of person that will allow the featurettes and extended versions of films. Anything that is the movie, counts, imo. Now, if you got a digital copy of the books, with the movies, obviously, that doesn't count. Stick to the commentary, extended cuts, and featurettes. It's really up to the thread starter to decide that. But I say "have at it" until Imp. says no to it.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Really? So regular blades stay sharp for several thousand years and can parry strikes from ghosts? Nope. I don't think so.

Ill-found logic:

The Sword was preserved and maintained by the elves. If you'd like to see a blade preserved by "non-magical" humans for about 500 years, look no further than King Henry VIII's ceremonial sword.

Additionally, you have seem to have forgotten about attributes of the ghosts. You wanna know why that sword blocked the blades of the ghosts? Same way those ghosts were able to slay tangible flesh, blood, and bone orcs/trolls/goblins: they are can make themselves "tangible" as well.

Originally posted by Borbarad
You covered that how exactly? From what is seen in the movie, the mace simply kills anything it hits, regardless of armor or actual power of the victim. "The power of the one Ring could not be undone", as the narration says.

Go back and read the first two pages of the thread. It will actually be faster than reading our long ass posts: honest.

Additionally, you only have proof of one kill and that was the king. He might have died from the impact against the rock rather than flying 20 feet. You do know that humans can easily survive flying 20 feet, right?

In other words, you have only one instance of confirmed death from the mace but that is questionable as it could have been due to the impact trauma.

And you can't use that narrator's comment, in that manner, as versus debate"feats" because...get this...the power of the ring WAS undone. Sauron fell and was left to crawl the earth for hundreds of years as a lesser ethereal form. This is in addition to getting his ass destroyed by two child-sized hobbits on his own damn backyard.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Fact is, that when Sauron comes walking on the battlefield, the situation, according to Galadriels narration changed from "victory was near" to "all hope was lost" only by Sauron's appearance on the spot. That implies that the entire assembly of elves and men gathered before Barad-Dur didn't have enough power to defeat Sauron in combat.

That's untrue.

"Victory was near. The power of the ring could not be undone. It was in this moment...that all hope had faded..."

This is one top of them fighting THOUSANDS of enemies, not just Sauron.

Let's recap what you did:

1. Incorrectly quoted Galadriel.
2. Falsely attributed Sauron to being the sole reason for Mordor's victory.

#2 presumes that they didn't obtain some sort of partial victory against Sauron's forces, else "victory" wouldn't be near to begin with.

Originally posted by Borbarad
You think a single mortal can do the job? Seems a bit odd. But I'm not surprised, given your judgement of Sauron's presense in the books. He is directly defeated only twice. Once by the power of Luthien and Huan combined, with the former having enough power to bewitch Morgoth himself. The other incidence was Isildurs lucky strike in a situation, just to mention it again, in which "all hope was lost". That when the battle was, essentially, Sauron VS all men and elves still alive on the battlefield.

Yeah, a mortal can defeat Sauron considering it happened more than once. Once by Isildur by accident (keep in mind that I am referring to the movies. Your misplaced conversations about things other than the movies will not be entertained by me, any longer as I am putting myself in a position to get in trouble, along with you: not a good idea, right?) and another time by the tiny little hobbits. 😄

If Isildur, a far weaker, slower, less durable, less intelligent, smaller, and scared human can defeat Sauron with a very brittle blade, I'm quite sure the epitome of 26th century human genetic engineering, cybernetic engineering, and materials engineering can defeat Sauron.

It seems odd that you think that someone like that could NOT defeat Sauron.

Also, I would appreciate it if you would address the point you responded to. I am giving you far more respect than I would give most due to how respectful and civil you keep your discussions (until someone crosses the line.) I only ask that you directly counter the points I've made. If you cannot, concede the point. I will do the same, of course. That will prevent circles that seem to happen in the MVF which seem to be very common and one of the reasons I go on hiatus from this place, sometimes.

Originally posted by Borbarad
I guess you're forgetting that Sauron is a damn Maiar in the books, capable of shapeshifting and thereby altering his physical appearance according to his means. Morgoth, for example, using the same abilites once walked Arda in form of a giant, with his feet in the water of the oceans and his head in the clouds, while he literally knocked over mountains, spilled oceans and incinerated entire continents.

Spoiler:
Morgoth is not Sauron. Morgoth was a Vala (Melkor), Sauron was a Maia. Melkor is one of the great 14. So even if this was in the Sci-Fi Fantasy forum, you'd still be wrong. Can't make up abilities that do not exist for Sauron. Shape-shifter? Sure. Can shape shift into a titan? No.

That's off subject. You shouldn't post on that, anymore, in here. We'll get in trouble.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Master Chief is going to do what against magic?

Sauron is going to do what against 26th century technology? The powers he's shown do not come remotely close to the strikes from a brute.

Originally posted by Borbarad
I may remind you that Saruman outright mentions that there is no way to stop Sauron, even for him and Gandalf combined, which should give you an idea about how powerful Sauron was while wielding the One Ring.

That fails as a work-able logical comparison.

You do realize that Gandalf and Saruman could easily be killed by Master Chief, right? And, yeah, controlling tens of thousands of units, being in an etheral form, and being unable to resist the temptatious magic of the one ring, are all pretty good reasons that two very weak wizards (compared to other wizards' powers we've seen from other movies) is a pretty good reason to think that they would not have victory.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Then, just to mention it again, we have the narration from the intro, marking Saurons appearance on the battlefield a turning point in that conflict (from the elves and men close to victory to them losing all hope). And, of course, we've seen that the Ring is capable of transporting the wearer into the wrath world, rendering him invisible.

I concede the Sauron was turning point, in the film, for Mordor's forces, but only a morale one, not an actual one. Keep in mind that the wording was "seemed lost", not "it was lost": that's because it was a commentary on morale, not an actual ability of Sauron's slow striking movements making him invincible. He could easily be circled and beat down by enough men that decided to kamikaze.

The Ring did not make Sauron invisible. In the films, all people that put on the ring turn invisible: except for Sauron. Sauron specifically did not turn invisible.

Spoiler:
It did not do that for Sauron, in the books, either. Specifically, it was mortals that became invisible when wearing the ring. Higher beings did not. So even in the books, that's not a power the ring gave Sauron.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Master Chief is going to triumph over an invisible enemy, that not only happens to be one of the most powerful creatures of Middle-Earth, but also wields a weapon who one-hit-kills anybody it hits?

This conclusion relies on two false assessments, on your part.

Here is the list in order of your two points:

1. The Ring did not make Sauron invisible. In the films, all people that put on the ring turn invisible: except for Sauron. Sauron specifically did not turn invisible. Any conclusion that it turns Sauron invisible, is false, from both a movie approach and a book approach.

2. Additionally, you only have proof of one kill and that was the king. He might have died from the impact against the rock rather than flying 20 feet. You do know that humans can easily survive flying 20 feet, right? In other words, you have only one instance of confirmed death from the mace but that is questionable as it could have been due to the impact trauma.

However, I do concede that he was one of the most powerful creatures of Middle-Earth.

Originally posted by Borbarad
A being that, even when not in best shape, commands the likes of the Witch King of Angmar around, who easily "disarmed" Gandalf with magic:

YouTube video

This confuses the "control" issue. The Witch King was corrupted by his ring of power. That was in FotR. The king was controlled by Sauron WHEN Sauron had the One Ring. After they were corrupted, Sauron no longer directly controlled their will when he did not have the One Ring. They were, by all accounts, free agents. There is nothing in the films to suggest otherwise. There is nothing in the books to suggest otherwise.

However, Sauron controlling magical beings under the powers of magical rings, plays not part in his fight against John-117.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Really. If the Witch King can do that, so can Sauron. I'd love to see what Master Chief does to Sauron, after his armor and all his weapons have been turned into tiny metal shards by Sauron's magic in an instant. Bore the Dark Lord to death?

Incorrect: you cannot give feats or powers to Sauron that he did not have in the films. We can speculate, but it's baseless. Sauron never showed that ability in the movies or in the books.

And, Gandalf's Magical Staff seemed to "magically" reform itself for his Mithlond appearance, which occured many minutes later. Now, this is mostly baseless, but we can be more correct in assuming that the Witch King can only explode the magical staff of weaker wizards, but not anything else. That's about as far of a conclusion that we can make. Anything beyond that will net you contradictions such as: why didn't he "explode" other things...especially in the battle that he DIED.

Here's the problem: Master Chief is gimped in this thread, from the beginning. However, he still rapes, utterly. Pretty much every point you made, was invalid, not applicable, or relied on false information. I conceded two points which have no bearing on his fight with John-117.

Well, obviously im just being ignored......

Guys, think, if your former arguments apply, then what i had been saying applies.

Also, show me ONE THING where Chief does ANYTHING exceptional. I have seen NOTHING. Up til the point where i do, and where it EXPLAINS the Spartans origins, what they can do, and if Chief is above them, then all you are giving in baseless speculation and non movie feats, rendering your arguments null and void.

Legends shows nothing other than 3 Spartans pulling off a rush through a ship, John being among them. Let me remind you, he LOST to that Elite, as it had disarmed him, and was about to kill him BEFORE HE WAS SPACED.

That Elite would kick Sauron's ass though

Originally posted by Pwned
Well, obviously im just being ignored......

Guys, think, if your former arguments apply, then what i had been saying applies.

Also, show me ONE THING where Chief does ANYTHING exceptional. I have seen NOTHING. Up til the point where i do, and where it EXPLAINS the Spartans origins, what they can do, and if Chief is above them, then all you are giving in baseless speculation and non movie feats, rendering your arguments null and void.

Legends shows nothing other than 3 Spartans pulling off a rush through a ship, John being among them. Let me remind you, he LOST to that Elite, as it had disarmed him, and was about to kill him BEFORE HE WAS SPACED.

Go back to the beginning of the thread.

Read everything and watch everything.

When you're done, you'll have your answers.

If you think jumping 20-30 meters and killing everyone on a catwalk, while upside down, while running, is "unremarkable", the I'd like to meet your super-human friends and family. Additionally, if grabbing and throwing a space re-entry pod (probably weighing around a ton or two) and throwing it 20-30 meters is unremarkable, I'd like to meet your superhuman friends and family. If you think running down a cooridor while headshotting over 60 "bad guys" is unremarkable, then I'd like to meet your super-human friends and family.

A: Dont remember the headshotting, he was just shooting them. Has good aim, i never doubted that, only an idiot would.
B: Chief did not throw that pod. That was an anonymous Spartan, and for all we know she could have had more strength enhancements than the others.
C:Where the hell is he running upside down on a catwalk?

He JUMPED about 15 feet in the air and spun, spraying 2 fully automatic sub machine guns.

Also, only showed 2 headshots.

So he can jump 15 feet and spin. Suaron is 10 feet tall with a more than likely 4 foot long mace, if not longer. He has arms. He swings up when he sees Chief jump. Chiefs head gets ***** smacked, and the magic takes effect and throws him REALLY far, and his skull has been crushed. Fight over.

Chief has a chance, but the arguments you went with have brought out points for me and Borabad to.......

Originally posted by Pwned
A: Dont remember the headshotting, he was just shooting them. Has good aim, i never doubted that, only an idiot would.
B: Chief did not throw that pod. That was an anonymous Spartan, and for all we know she could have had more strength enhancements than the others.
C:Where the hell is he running upside down on a catwalk?

A. Watch it again, like I suggested.

B. She was not anonymous. Read the thread. She did not have any more enhancements than John-117, just the same as all other Spartan II's wearing the Mark VI armor. Additionally, John DID show a bit of his strength by doing that radtastical jump. 😉 Nice try, though, right?
C. Never said he was running upside down on a catwalk.

Originally posted by Pwned
He JUMPED about 15 feet in the air and spun, spraying 2 fully automatic sub machine guns.

Indeed. He jumped about 20-30 meters and about 5 meters into the air. Thanks for agreeing with me.

Originally posted by Pwned
Also, only showed 2 headshots.

Watch it again. Indeed, there were headshots. Also, how many were NOT headshots? 🙂

Originally posted by Pwned
So he can jump 15 feet and spin.

I know, such a lame stupid ability to be able to casually jump 15 feet in the air.

Originally posted by Pwned
Suaron is 10 feet tall with a more than likely 4 foot long mace,

It looks more like 7-8 feet, to me. The mace is about 3-4 feet, so I'll give you that.

Originally posted by Pwned
He has arms. He swings up when he sees Chief jump. Chiefs head gets ***** smacked, and the magic takes effect and throws him REALLY far, and his skull has been crushed. Fight over.

Oh, you mean that very sloooooow Sauron that would be made mince meat by any Spartan II, much less the best Spartan II? Yeah, let's put a slow swinging Sauron up against a super-human martial artist, recon solider, weapons export, demolitions expert, inside of a 26th century cybernetic suit. Great match-up.

Originally posted by Pwned
Chief has a chance, but the arguments you went with have brought out points for me and Borabad to.......

You have that wrong.

Sauron has no chance. This is an unintentional spite thread. The best you have come up with is "Well..uh....the lesser Spartan II is obviously stronger despite canon sources saying otherwise. HA! I win! WEEEEEE!" Also, don't lump Borbarad in with your arguments. You lost all credibility when you tried to pass off that hunched argument.

Where did it say Chief was the best? No movie source i know of.
Where did it say that Chief could throw a pod like that? No movie source that i know of.
If your only source is Legends, then Chief loses.
If you include the books, Chief loses.

Chiefs jump was by no means casual, he was in the middle of a run and gun spray down, (only 4 shots or so were shown to be heashots, and at a stretch, because the crosshairs on his HUD were on their head/upper neck) with adrenaline flowing through his body. With the enhancements that the movie DID mention, improved physical capability, then yes, it is possible for him to do that. I do not remember where it says they are superhumans. Also, keep in mind a professional basketball player, being average height, (5 foot something in a few cases) can dunk a basketball no problem, on a (i think) 12 foot goal. Its not as impressive as you would like it to be.

Originally posted by Pwned
Where did it say Chief was the best? No movie source i know of.

Good point. Where did it ever say that Sauron was the most powerful Maia left?

As fact, we know that John was the last Spartan-II.

Did you even see Legends?

Originally posted by Pwned
Where did it say that Chief could throw a pod like that? No movie source that i know of.

It's not required: another Spartan II did it and Chief is greater than all Spatarn IIs. All Spartan-IIs are "legendary" in ability compared elite soldiers: they were topc secret and highly expensive. Or did you forget about that when one of them tired to run away?

Originally posted by Pwned
If your only source is Legends, then Chief loses.

If our only source is Legends then John-117 take out Sauron, Gandalf, Sarumon, the Witch King, and 10 Elvish Nights, all on his own, bare handed.

Originally posted by Pwned
If you include the books, Chief loses.

If you include the books, then Chief can take out an army of Covenant forces all by himself. Every last one of those individual troops would be >>>> Sauron's book form (minus the grunts.)

Originally posted by Pwned
Chiefs jump was by no means casual,

It was. He didn't strain or grunt. Deal with it.

Originally posted by Pwned
he was in the middle of a run and gun spray down, (only 4 shots or so were shown to be heashots, and at a stretch, because the crosshairs on his HUD were on their head/upper neck) with adrenaline flowing through his body. With the enhancements that the movie DID mention, improved physical capability, then yes, it is possible for him to do that. I do not remember where it says they are superhumans. Also, keep in mind a professional basketball player, being average height, (5 foot something in a few cases) can dunk a basketball no problem, on a (i think) 12 foot goal. Its not as impressive as you would like it to be.

An NBA hoop is 10 feet high. About 15 feet in the air, upside down, while leaping 20-30 meters long, IS, however, far beyond human.

It's much more impressive that you'd like it to be because it pains you that your obsession loses to a "human."

I know you think Sauron is badass, but he's really not, not even in the books (He's a really weak bad guy compared to other fantasy). PLEASE tell me you don't LARP as Sauron. At least have some balls to LARP as Aragorn! (I could easily pass as a hobbit with my hairy ass feet. 😆 Makes me think...I might go as one for halloween, now. 😄)