Master Chief vs Sauron

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vm3BmjIvUtk

There, Last Alliance battle.

THe HUNCHED Numenenoreans are the same height as the elves.
Saurons head is above that. They are NOT normal sized men, also, Gil-Galad was an elf, Noldor to be specific. And there is also the fact that Sauron is NOT swinging that mace slowly, along with the magic hes putting behind it. Hes flinging 8 people around, no problem.

The Noldor thing, it has absolutely NOTHING to do with anything, so yeah, im throwing it there, Gil-Galad WAS said to be an elf, and an amazing fighter at that, same with Elendil.

Also, never said where the Numenoreans are from, so therefore wouldnt we wiki it?

Originally posted by Pwned
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vm3BmjIvUtk

There, Last Alliance battle.

THe HUNCHED Numenenoreans are the same height as the elves.
Saurons head is above that. They are NOT normal sized men, also, Gil-Galad was an elf, Noldor to be specific. And there is also the fact that Sauron is NOT swinging that mace slowly, along with the magic hes putting behind it. Hes flinging 8 people around, no problem.

The Noldor thing, it has absolutely NOTHING to do with anything, so yeah, im throwing it there, Gil-Galad WAS said to be an elf, and an amazing fighter at that, same with Elendil.

Also, never said where the Numenoreans are from, so therefore wouldnt we wiki it?

hahahahahahahahahaha

"hunched"

😆 😆 😆 😆

Good job at making the worst case, ever. Sorry, dude, what you just tried to pull isn't going to fly.

They are normal men. Deal with it. Even if you could successfully argue that those dudes were 7 feet tall and weighed 400lbs, that doesn't change a thing in the thread as that portion of the argument was covered, already.

Their size was not manipulated or substituted. They are the same size as their actors because, get this: the actors are real life people! 😆

True

But look, every time you see a Numenorean and an Elf together, the Numenorean is hunched over quite a bit, and the elf is standing straight. That implies height difference.

Also, just because so and so actor is this tall, doesnt mean the person he is acting is the same height.

For all we know, Sauron was 15 feet tall (not gigantic yet) and they were all 8 feet tall. We never saw any object we knew the height of to compare them, so stop being a douche and just accept the utterly worthless fact!

Seriously, the height has nothing to do with it, and typically people wearing chain mail and plate armor weighed around 400 pounds.

Im just arguing with you for the sake of fanboyismm Nummies=pwnage

Originally posted by Pwned
True

But look, every time you see a Numenorean and an Elf together, the Numenorean is hunched over quite a bit, and the elf is standing straight. That implies height difference.

Also, just because so and so actor is this tall, doesnt mean the person he is acting is the same height.

For all we know, Sauron was 15 feet tall (not gigantic yet) and they were all 8 feet tall. We never saw any object we knew the height of to compare them, so stop being a douche and just accept the utterly worthless fact!

Seriously, the height has nothing to do with it, and typically people wearing chain mail and plate armor weighed around 400 pounds.

Im just arguing with you for the sake of fanboyismm Nummies=pwnage

lol!

I'll accept the douche label only because you've already admitted to and accepted the fanboy label.

COMPROMISE IS AWESOME! 😆 😆 😆

And, no, they weren't 400lbs, full armor. You've got a case for 250 lbs, though.

Originally posted by Pwned

Seriously, the height has nothing to do with it, and typically people wearing chain mail and plate armor weighed around 400 pounds.

Not even close. Full-plate which included layers of cloth, animal-hide and chain-mail typically weighed around 70-75lbs, well crated gear could be as low as 50lbs.

So even with a large 225 man, you're looking at just under 300lbs. Though authentic plate-mail is typically small, as people were short back then. Typical knight in gear probably weighed less than DDM in just his boxer-shorts.

Originally posted by Robtard
Not even close. Full-plate which included layers of cloth, animal-hide and chain-mail typically weighed around 70-75lbs, well crated gear could be as low as 50lbs.

So even with a large 225 man, you're looking at just under 300lbs. Though authentic plate-mail is typically small, as people were short back then. Typical knight in gear probably weighed less than DDM in just his boxer-shorts.

I was going for the men in the movie. They were between 150-225. 250 seems about average for those actors.

Granted, they were in MUCH lighter armor so they didn't get tired or hurt from all that weight. But we are going for what they were being portrayed as, not real-world.

Also, I weigh 224. You're right that they probably weigh that much as the average height of a man was...what...5'6", 5'7"? In shape knights would weigh about 150-170 at the most. Keep in mind that BIG muscular dudes did not exist, at all, back in the day. It was impossible for several reasons: they lacked the science, diet, workout routines, and they got sick far too often.

The "muscular" greek statutes were done after their athletes. We have an idea how muscular men could have gotten back then from those examples (they were probably better athletes than those of the middle ages due to the competitions they had...IMO, they were the best athletes in history before the 1900s rolled around)...and even those were exaggerated like super-heros in comic books are.

Eugene Sandow, imo, represents what was humanly possible before modern science. He was quite muscular and lean...but not even close to even a slightly above average gym rat.

But you have to take into account that they are taller than your standard knight, and weigh more. Watch the video, their armor covered, say, 90% of them, chain, plate and all? I remember reading somewhere that steel plate armor, with chain mail and all, weighed around 100-150 pounds. On a 250 pound guy (because remember, the warriors were some of the people in the best shape, due to the fact that if they werent they would die) thats 350-400

The actors, wearing that armor, if it had really been on them, would weigh around 400 or so pounds.

Im takin the actors height argument here, and i only got a sec, so yeah

Fine, those people in the film were hulking 400lbs men-brutes. Master Chief is still kicking ass here.

Also, I weigh 224. You're right that they probably weigh that much as the average height of a man was...what...5'6", 5'7"? In shape knights would weigh about 150-170 at the most. Keep in mind that BIG muscular dudes did not exist, at all, back in the day. It was impossible for several reasons: they lacked the science, diet, workout routines, and they got sick far too often.

Wait, in RL or in the LOTR-verse? Because the peasants/soldiers seemed fine in the movies. Plus Numenoreans are like 7 feet tall and shit. ****ers fought armies of Balrogs in their day man.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Wait, in RL or in the LOTR-verse? Because the peasants/soldiers seemed fine in the movies. Plus Numenoreans are like 7 feet tall and shit. ****ers fought armies of Balrogs in their day man.

IRL AND in universe FOR THE MOVIE. (Which would be the actors real heights except for those portrayed as larger or smaller: ie, Sauron and the Hobbits.)

Well, if their ACTUALY heights are the Numenoreans height, then their actual weights should be the Numenoreans weight, yes?

In that case, wearing steel plate armor and chain mail, modern men will weigh 350-400 pounds, due to the fact they weigh around 200 to begin with, if not more, due to the fact they live in modern times with the science, meals, and they dont get sick as often.

Honestly, they weigh more with the "Person A is the exact same as his actor" argument than the "They are Numenoreans, they are taller, and weigh more than a normal human" argument.

Besides, take one whos skill is about equal or lesser (ARAGORN) and look at the shit he pulled during the movies, and you have a base for their skill. Think of that.
Of course, he was faster in that he wasnt wearing as much armor.
Oh, and also, i dont believe the Spartans origins were EVER explained in Legends, and as far as i know that is the ONLY movie/film/whatever that provides feats for Chief, in which case, your argument is null.

Give me a video that explains their origins, their enhancements, and mentions Chief, and ill get something else, til then, Sauron wins.

Originally posted by Pwned

Give me a video that explains their origins, their enhancements, and mentions Chief, and ill get something else, til then, Sauron wins.

What an odd thing to ask for considering you're basing the Numereans who weren't named as such in the film and their height, weight and general awesomeness on the books.

Just Google John-117 or Spartan Project Halo. Each Spartan II was raised/trained from an early age to be a total bad-ass and they were given several biological enhancements. They're super-tanks and can run at cheetah speeds.

Sauron got his ass kicked by a injured man with a broken sword, Master Chief is 1,000+ times more capable than Isildur.

Originally posted by Pwned
Well, if their ACTUALY heights are the Numenoreans height, then their actual weights should be the Numenoreans weight, yes?

In that case, wearing steel plate armor and chain mail, modern men will weigh 350-400 pounds, due to the fact they weigh around 200 to begin with, if not more, due to the fact they live in modern times with the science, meals, and they dont get sick as often.

Honestly, they weigh more with the "Person A is the exact same as his actor" argument than the "They are Numenoreans, they are taller, and weigh more than a normal human" argument.

Besides, take one whos skill is about equal or lesser (ARAGORN) and look at the shit he pulled during the movies, and you have a base for their skill. Think of that.
Of course, he was faster in that he wasnt wearing as much armor.
Oh, and also, i dont believe the Spartans origins were EVER explained in Legends, and as far as i know that is the ONLY movie/film/whatever that provides feats for Chief, in which case, your argument is null.

Give me a video that explains their origins, their enhancements, and mentions Chief, and ill get something else, til then, Sauron wins.

Nah.

Aragorn >>>>>> Isildur and Elendil in the movies.

They went down like punk bitches. (Isildur just ran.)

Additionally, they were regularly sized men, in the films. How many times are we going to cover this?

And, no, Sauron goes down like a punk *****: just like he did against Isildur. With one slight exception: Sauron goes down even faster and harder than he did against Isildur.

Even IF Sauron is 15 feet tall. This is not fanboyism: this is based on the fact that Spartan II's are supposed to have reflexes 300 times faster than human's and have bodies that are multiple times more durable and stronger than a humans. If a regular human at the height of 6'5" was to try and don Mark VI armor, it would turn them into pudding because of how powerful the armor is. A Spartan II? Nothing. This should make it obvious how much more durable the Spartan II's are.

Where is the source that says that?

You want in universe movie shit, i want it to.
Legends mentionend NOTHING of their training, of their armor, or of what they could do, all it said was that they were supersoldiers.
It showed 5 of the, in action in a suprise attack, and while fairly impressive, id laugh when Sauron ***** slapped them.

Also, what about the weights?

Oh, and Rob, i used the books because there was absolutly nothing said about ANY of them, short of "I am Isildur's heir."

I then took their origins from the books, and DDM is contesting it, plus, im talking about guys who had 5 seconds screen time, against a guy who had about 30 minutes or more, its not easy to do that.

If there is absolutly no mention of the Spartans origins in a movie, NONE whatsoever, as with the Numenoreans, then sure, get their origins from the books, ill run with it.

Originally posted by Pwned
Where is the source that says that?

You want in universe movie shit, i want it to.
Legends mentionend NOTHING of their training, of their armor, or of what they could do, all it said was that they were supersoldiers.
It showed 5 of the, in action in a suprise attack, and while fairly impressive, id laugh when Sauron ***** slapped them.

Also, what about the weights?

Oh, and Rob, i used the books because there was absolutly nothing said about ANY of them, short of "I am Isildur's heir."

I then took their origins from the books, and DDM is contesting it, plus, im talking about guys who had 5 seconds screen time, against a guy who had about 30 minutes or more, its not easy to do that.

If there is absolutly no mention of the Spartans origins in a movie, NONE whatsoever, as with the Numenoreans, then sure, get their origins from the books, ill run with it.

Sauron dies in less than a second.

Get over it.

Never saw Chief move that fast, i always saw him move at the speeds of a normal human.

Originally posted by Pwned
Never saw Chief move that fast, i always saw him move at the speeds of a normal human.

Huh? I don't know what you're talking about.

Halo Legends, Chief moved at the same speed as a fast human. Never saw any faster. Forgot to hit the quote button, i iddnt feel like taking some extra time.

As far as Chiefs screen feats go, he moves at human speeds, has the strength of a human (as the Spartan II that threw that pod could have been a mega strong one) and is an amazing aim with a weaponin each hand, and is a great energy sword duelist. He is also about 7 feet tall from looking at him standing next to Hayes, isnt it? The doctor person, though thats a guesstimation, considering how she looks like a midget next to him. 7 or 8 feet.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Aragorn >>>>>> Isildur and Elendil in the movies.

I don't think that the "more screentime, more feats = more powerful" school of thinking does deliver accurate results when attempting to judge the power of characters. Elrond does mention multiple times, that the Numenorean blood is weak, because Aragorn refuses to act according to his role. That tells us two things:

a) That the ancestors of Aragorn have archived more things than Aragorn himself as of the time the words were spoken (which is after his fight on the Withertop against the Nazghul for example).

b) That his bloodline is considered something special, above the regular mortals. Which is also emphasised throughout the trilogy. In "The Two Towers" (at least the Special Extended Edition) Aragorn mentions to have fought among Theoden in the youth of the Rohan king, revealing that he's in his 80s.

Additionally, they were regularly sized men, in the films. How many times are we going to cover this?

Again: How do you conclude this? All you can compare them to are other individuals of Tolkiens universe and we don't know how they compare to ordinary humans of today. Going by the fact that Tolkiens narration follows a "golden age" topos in general, one could conclude, that the earlier people lived, the more powerful they were. This is hinted in the films and becomes painfully obvious, when one looks into the books, where Elves and Men of the past took it up with dragons and balrogs in single combat (not to mention with Melkor himself).

And, no, Sauron goes down like a punk *****: just like he did against Isildur. With one slight exception: Sauron goes down even faster and harder than he did against Isildur.

Right. Let me do a check here. Sauron was just killed, because he was hit with a lucky strike surprise attack, with a magic weapon that was previously broken. This just worked, because Sauron was seperated from his ring.

We don't know if any ordinary weapon would be sufficient to cut through Saurons armor (Narsil / Anduril has been shown to be sharp after serveral thousand years and could parry strikes of a ghost) and if a "regular human" could even perform that task.

And I think you're vastly underestimating Sauron. According to the movie canon (Gandalf claiming he could become as powerful and terrifying as Sauron should he use the ring), we have to assume that Sauron is at least as powerful as Gandalf. And that's refering to his magical abilities. Even by watching the introduction, when he starts swinging his mace, it's rather obvious that the result of his swings aren't coming from his physical strength only. In fact, we do see surges of energy emanating from the mace, tossing the victims of the attacks backwards (hard enough to actually kill them all, if going by the fade of the people we see getting hit).

Even IF Sauron is 15 feet tall. This is not fanboyism: this is based on the fact that Spartan II's are supposed to have reflexes 300 times faster than human's and have bodies that are multiple times more durable and stronger than a humans. If a regular human at the height of 6'5" was to try and don Mark VI armor, it would turn them into pudding because of how powerful the armor is. A Spartan II? Nothing. This should make it obvious how much more durable the Spartan II's are.

I wonder if this all has been mentioned in the respective Halo sources. This is, after all, the movie versus forum, isn't it? Because if we use all kind of sources, this will be a landslide victory for Sauron, given that he is a demigod in Tolkiens world, capable of pretty powerful magic.

Yet, again: I think you're underestimating Sauron's abilities while not taking the circumstances of his "death" into consideration. Essentially, were talking about Sauron, armed with magical abilities, coupled with tremendous physical strength, going down because getting his by a magical weapon with a surprise attack - an attack that did hit his only weakspot, which is the only way to "kill" Sauron.

Do you really think that Master Chief would be able to cut Sauron's fingers off (removing the Ring) before getting clubbed to death? I'm not so sure here. But I have to admit that I don't remember all Halo cutscenes with Master Chief in action...

I don't think that the "more screentime, more feats = more powerful" school of thinking does deliver accurate results when attempting to judge the power of characters. Elrond does mention multiple times, that the Numenorean blood is weak, because Aragorn refuses to act according to his role. That tells us two things:

a) That the ancestors of Aragorn have archived more things than Aragorn himself as of the time the words were spoken (which is after his fight on the Withertop against the Nazghul for example).

b) That his bloodline is considered something special, above the regular mortals. Which is also emphasised throughout the trilogy. In "The Two Towers" (at least the Special Extended Edition) Aragorn mentions to have fought among Theoden in the youth of the Rohan king, revealing that he's in his 80s.

Whoa, speculation much? 😬

I for one am completely for the school of logic that more feats = more powerful, or should I say more, superior feats = more powerful, just as I am that 5 is a higher number than 2. It's basic logic. Isildur and Elendil do jack all in the movies and pretty much both die like punks. Aragorn does actual impressive things in the movie. 5 > 2.

a) Or it could mean that Aragorns ancestors ruled pretty much half the continent whereas Aragorn is some punkass ranger running around in the woods. Or possibly that one of his blood is directly responsible for Saurons continuation and was the Ring's ***** (though personally I see Elrond as much to blame for that, he didn't exactly bust a gut stopping him). Theres nothing suggesting Elrond was talking about combat ability at all.

b) Agreed, his bloodline is superior to others. Numenorean (whose blood runs in his veins) are physically superior to other men and as you pointed out live longer.