Zeus vs Hulk/Superman... fist fight

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I don't particularly care whether or not it was under a Blue Sun. I'm talking specifically about the application of this feat on to combat. If you wish, we can use the recent Flash tie in issue as a substitute.

whathefuk

If Superman can rebuild an entire city in moments -a long with his other speed feats- very few people can strike him. Due to the nature of comics however, he rarely applies this speed in combat and is most likely to take a punch to the chin.

It's very simple.

So you can do something just as quick if your moving stuff not resisting or moving or with intelligence as you would if something was actively resisting in many ways?

An amp of 2 or 3 times is not generous. It's realistic.

Otherwise there would not be anything worth even talking about with regards to an amp taking place.

It doesn't matter though.

If it took him let's say 10 seconds to fix the city, and let's say, he was amped by an obviously absurd multiplier, like 1 million. So at normal levels it would have taken him 10 million seconds to fix. Which equates to ~115 days.

That would still be a ridiculously fast amount of time to rebuild a city for one man.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
[B]I don't particularly care whether or not it was under a Blue Sun. I'm talking specifically about the application of this feat on to combat. If you wish, we can use the recent Flash tie in issue as a substitute./B]

Unless you don't mean what I think you do.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
So you can do something just as quick if your moving stuff not resisting or moving or with intelligence as you would if something was actively resisting in many ways?

I don't understand the analogy you're applying and why you're making it so complicated.

If Superman can operate at the speed he's shown, individuals who haven't, will not be able to strike him, react to him, or prevent him from punching them in the face many times in quick succession. I.e. they're f*cked.

Due to the nature of comics and characters, shit doesn't go down that way but we're debating speed feats so we won't get into the logic of comics.

I see... So Thor, Surfer, Thanos, Odin, BA, Orion would never be able to react to superman... and would be the same as moving a brick, a block etc etc? One is moving stuff not actively resisting you with a mind of their own.. the other is fighting against somebody that is and doing whatever they can to attack or not get hit. You don't see a difference there and think Superman can rebuild a city just as fast with somebody in the city destroying stuff he just put up as he could with nobody there? Really?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I don't understand the analogy you're applying and why you're making it so complicated.

If Superman can operate at the speed he's shown, individuals who haven't, will not be able to strike him, react to him, or prevent him from punching them in the face many times in quick succession. I.e. they're f*cked.

Due to the nature of comics and characters, shit doesn't go down that way but we're debating speed feats so we won't get into the logic of comics.

That has to be applied because that is THE source materal we use. It happens because Superman can and has been hit by people who AREN'T normal humans. They have crazy abilities and enhanced abilities themselves. These aren't normal humans we are talking about. They are also comic book charactes who can do the unimaginable. Yet, now you're saying Thor could never hit superman? interesting.... Point is, doing a speed feat with objects not resisting you or moving is much different then trying the same feat with things actively resisting you. Huge difference.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That has to be applied because that is THE source materal we use. It happens because Superman can and has been hit by people who AREN'T normal humans. They have crazy abilities and enhanced abilities themselves. These aren't normal humans we are talking about. They are also comic book charactes who can do the unimaginable. Yet, now you're saying Thor could never hit superman? interesting.... Point is, doing a speed feat with objects not resisting you or moving is much different then trying the same feat with things actively resisting you. Huge difference.

In my very first post regarding this subject, I pointed out that due to his character and the nature of comics, Superman does not apply this level of speed in combat. Which is why I specified an all out scenario for an example.

Do you want to actually debate the application of speed feats to combat?

What the f*ck does someone fighting back have to do with anything if they don't have the capability to counter his speed? If an opponent is noticeably slower than Superman and has no applicable methods of striking him or countering his speed.....they, wait for it, cannot handle Superman's speed.

And yes, if you take his speed feats at face value, Thor would not be able to land a punch on Superman. At least an all out one. In regards to speed that is.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I see... So Thor, Surfer, Thanos, Odin, BA, Orion would never be able to react to superman... and would be the same as moving a brick, a block etc etc? One is moving stuff not actively resisting you with a mind of their own.. the other is fighting against somebody that is and doing whatever they can to attack or not get hit. You don't see a difference there and think Superman can rebuild a city just as fast with somebody in the city destroying stuff he just put up as he could with nobody there? Really?

Specifying characters like this is irrelevant. Of course there are characters that can strike and counter Superman's speed. You're diverting the subject from the main point of contention with shit like this.

I'm pointing out that rebuilding a city reflects onto what he is capable in combat, and for those beings who lack similar showings or some other advantage, they would not be able to contend with his speed. Quite simple really.

I still do not understand this analogy.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
yes, if you take his speed feats at face value, Thor would not be able to land a punch on Superman.

Originally posted by batdude123

Lose the boner. Thor would still beat Superman.

Originally posted by Newjak
I always forget but didn't he do that under a blue sun where his powers were really weird and could do strange things like giving his farther all of his powers?

If it was under the blue sun like I think it is I've always taken that feat with a grain of salt.

Originally posted by Allankles
Since when did Hulk become the bench mark for what Supes could do? Different powers, different abilities. It was impressive by Zeus, but Hulk is the kind of guy that is susceptible to that kind of beating. He fights with very little guile.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Lose the boner. Thor would still beat Superman.

What are Zeus top strength and physical durability feats?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Lose the boner. Thor would still beat Superman.

At least you have the "comic portrayal" where Thor was portrayed as superior, right?

Originally posted by quanchi112
You abandoned Thor today my friend. Welcome to phil's camp.

*high-fives quanchi*

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
In my very first post regarding this subject, I pointed out that due to his character and the nature of comics, Superman does not apply this level of speed in combat. Which is why I specified an all out scenario for an example.

Do you want to actually debate the application of speed feats to combat?

What the f*ck does someone fighting back have to do with anything if they don't have the capability to counter his speed? If an opponent is noticeably slower than Superman and has no applicable methods of striking him or countering his speed.....they, wait for it, cannot handle Superman's speed.

And yes, if you take his speed feats at face value, Thor would not be able to land a punch on Superman. At least an all out one. In regards to speed that is.

Specifying characters like this is irrelevant. Of course there are characters that can strike and counter Superman's speed. You're diverting the subject from the main point of contention with shit like this.

I'm pointing out that rebuilding a city reflects onto what he is capable in combat, and for those beings who lack similar showings or some other advantage, they would not be able to contend with his speed. Quite simple really.

I still do not understand this analogy.

No it's relevant.. Odin has never showed the speed to even perceive superman like you say if we go by Superman speed feats... So.. he wouldn't be able to touch superman right before he was getting hit 100's of times right?

Originally posted by Philosophía
Yeah, but it's still good to see you admit that on the forum, Thor wouldn't even be able to touch Superman.

At least you have the "comic portrayal" where Thor was portrayed as superior, right?

That was just brutal. Even for you.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
In my very first post regarding this subject, I pointed out that due to his character and the nature of comics, Superman does not apply this level of speed in combat. Which is why I specified an all out scenario for an example.

Do you want to actually debate the application of speed feats to combat?

What the f*ck does someone fighting back have to do with anything if they don't have the capability to counter his speed? If an opponent is noticeably slower than Superman and has no applicable methods of striking him or countering his speed.....they, wait for it, cannot handle Superman's speed.

And yes, if you take his speed feats at face value, Thor would not be able to land a punch on Superman. At least an all out one. In regards to speed that is.

Specifying characters like this is irrelevant. Of course there are characters that can strike and counter Superman's speed. You're diverting the subject from the main point of contention with shit like this.

I'm pointing out that rebuilding a city reflects onto what he is capable in combat, and for those beings who lack similar showings or some other advantage, they would not be able to contend with his speed. Quite simple really.

I still do not understand this analogy.

I will never forget this post. Wow Rage.

Zeus wins

Originally posted by carver9
I will never forget this post. Wow Rage.

I think he's cracked lately. 🙁

Hope the Thor movie is doing well for his sake.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
I think he's cracked lately. 🙁

Hope the Thor movie is doing well for his sake.

I agree. For the past couple of months he have been giving Superman the edge over Thor. Somethings wrong.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
So the story made it clear he got extra powers which is in fact making note of a increase in power clearly.. yet... you say the story made no mention of there being a "dramatic increase"? If you gain extra powers.. that is by default a pretty significant increase in power. So yes it was mentioned and made clear. Thus, when it's made clear you're more powerful by gettnig new powers (some of which were mentioned, commons sense there could be more) that makes the feat fall under scrutiny. Sure, he could still pull of stuff like this without being under the blue sun... that is possible. The fact is, he didn't and there were special circumstances for this feat. No way around that.

I ask again... so is this a combat related feat like it was being argued prior?

Eeeh! He's right. Theoretically a blue star gives him more power as do quasars and the other more intense or younger stars than yellow stars, but in this story this power increase wasn't shown. The only new power he showed in the story was a type of vision power that allowed him to give other people his powers.

He had problems with Bizzarro Doomsday and the like. Showing no increase in his abilities beyond the vision powers. More than likely, he hadn't been exposed to enough blue sunlight for there to be a marked increase in his physical stats, during the duration of his time in Bizarro world.