X Men versus Push

Started by Rogue Jedi5 pages
Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
its simple really, they have no answer for Xavier, or Jean who could prolly solo... nor do they have an answer for Logan who could solo as well..

Oh my facepalm ..........Xavier? There are two pushers who can do exactly what he can, and Shadows will hinder him. Jean? Her TK is not near as strong as the Movers, it's not even close. Logan? Lulz, dude, one Triad bleeder turns Logan's brain to mush. Not to mention, not to mention, dude, that the Push crew has watchers that can see the future crystal clear.

See, I know you and the others WANT the X Men to win, but it aint happening.

Here, check it:

* Chris Evans as Nick Gant, a Mover living in Hong Kong in order to stay hidden from Division, whose father was killed by Carver. He was born in America and once had a relationship with Kira. One form of income - although not always successful - is to manipulate betting games involving dice using his ability.
o Colin Ford as a young Nick Gant.
* Dakota Fanning as Cassie Holmes, the daughter of the greatest Watcher Division has ever encountered, and a Watcher in her own right. Like all abilities, hers is not fully developed as this happens through training. She is sometimes confused by what she draws in her premonitions.
* Camilla Belle as Kira Hudson/Hollis, a high-level Pusher, a recent escapee of Division, and the only Division patient to have survived experimentation.
* Djimon Hounsou as Agent Henry Carver, a Division agent and a powerful Pusher that killed Nick's father. He is sent to recapture Kira.
* Ming-Na as Emily Hu, a Sniffer who helps Nick & Cassie find Kira. She works as a fortune teller in Hong Kong.
* Cliff Curtis as "Hook" Waters, a Shifter. He used to be in Division and after getting out, his wife died in a car accident, and he knew Division was involved since his wife didn't drive. Since he moved to Hong Kong, hanging out in high class escort bars where he uses his shifting ability to pay his way. He implies that Nick's father had a similar past. He has a habit of saying "that won't last long" after he uses his abilities to help.
* Nate Mooney as "Pinky" Stein, a Shadow who hid Kira from the Sniffs. His nickname is derived from Division's removal of his right "pinky" finger.
* Corey Stoll as Agent Mack, a Sniffer agent.
* Scott Michael Campbell as Agent Holden, a Reader agent.
* Neil Jackson as Victor Budarin, an advanced Mover and Carver's right hand man.
* Maggie Siff as Teresa Stowe, a Stitch who helps heal Nick after an encounter with the bleeders, as requested by Cassie's mother, who told her to be in a certain place at a certain time and help whomever was there. She is, however, not seen as altruistic, but, instead, out for personal gain, rather than helping Cassie and Nick overthrow Division.
* Paul Car as Wo Chiang, a Wiper who lives on a house boat in Hong Kong Harbour.
* Xiao Lu Li as Pop Girl, a Chinese Triad Watcher femme fatale who tries to find Nick and Cassie throughout Hong Kong. Like Cassie, she draws her visions. Her visions are based on others' intentions and decisions.
* Kwan Fung Chi, Jacky Heung as Pop Boys, the two Triad Bleeders.
* Haruhiko Yamanouchi as Pop Father, Triad Bleeder and father to the three 'Pop' siblings.
* Joel Gretsch as Nick's father, an advanced Mover whose refusal to join the Division cost him his life. It is implied the he and Hook share a similar past.
* N/A as Cassie's mother, a powerful Watcher who was captured by Division and forced to work for them. It is through her that most of the events occur as she helped Kira escape Division HQ, paid Wo to erase Kira's memories, as well as get Teresa in the right place to heal Nick and told Nick's father to tell his son to follow the one who gave him a flower. Though this alone shows the strength of her Watcher abilities, as she saw this all happen at least a decade ago where most can only see a few hours or days into the future.

There's the Push crew. They have the entire division and the Triad backing them, as stated in the OP. And since It's too late to amend it, yes, include all mutants from the X Men movies.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Oh my facepalm ..........Xavier? There are two pushers who can do exactly what he can, and Shadows will hinder him.

Really? Have the pushers ever used there telepthany on hundreds of people simultaneously? Or how about locking away part of someone's mind for years? Or how about placing their minds in someone elses body? And proove that a shadow will hinder his ability. I don't recall them having any protetion from the pushers... Xavier can shut down all, or at least most, of the minds of the people from Push.

Jean? Her TK is not near as strong as the Movers, it's not even close.

Lulz... She lifts a plane and holds back a flood simultaneously. And she also lifted an entire block of cars at once.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I actually meant the X Men themselves, not all the mutants. My fault for ****ing up the OP. Even so, the Pushers have the entire Division and the Triad on their side.

Ok.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
All Mutants versus the Pushers, the Division and the Triad, and yeah, the X Men mutants are far outnumbered.

All X-men mutants far out number all Push mutants.

Oh and Professor X, and Shadow Cat can solo.

Edit: Ok, since we're back to using everyone, X-men mutants win as per previous post.

You can't used unknown division/triad people... only characters we've seen on-screen.

^ Doesn't matter if he did, their powersets are too limited (relatively), with no counter to some of the X-men mutants.

Jean? Her TK is not near as strong as the Movers, it's not even close.

YouTube video

2.00. Especially look at 2.15. Iirc all the movers did was block bullets. Optic blasts >>>>> bullets.


Lulz... She lifts a plane and holds back a flood simultaneously. And she also lifted an entire block of cars at once.

Also that.


* Kitty Pryde (Makes Prof X intangible and they go on a mind-rape spree, shes also unstopibol herself)

/thread.

Give Nightcrawler a knife, and let Wraith go about his business, and Deadpool. Those three solo just about everybody in moments, with that German and Chris Evans maybe giving them trouble with their force fields.

For them though there's Colossus, Juggernaut, Shadow Cat, and of course Xavier.

Originally posted by ares834
Really? Have the pushers ever used there telepthany on hundreds of people simultaneously? Or how about locking away part of someone's mind for years? Or how about placing their minds in someone elses body? And proove that a shadow will hinder his ability. I don't recall them having any protetion from the pushers... Xavier can shut down all, or at least most, of the minds of the people from Push.
Two things: Watchers and shadows. Watchers see the future, Shadows block clairvoyance. If they can see the future, all the push crew has to do is send a stitch and a shadow after Xavier. The shadow will shield the stitch from being detected. All the stitch has to do is touch X when he is out and about, doing whatever. This will **** him up and good. One fingertip for a microsecond on him and he's useless, rolling on the ground in pain. Hell, they can just send 30 or 40 gun toting Triads and some Bleeders.

There's so many ways to kill Xavier it's ridiculous. The watchers are key here, they are what makes this a win for the Push crew. Without them, yes, the X Men probably rape.

Lulz... She lifts a plane and holds back a flood simultaneously. And she also lifted an entire block of cars at once.
Right, I should have said more versatile, not more powerful. The Movers were shown taking on 10-12 gunmen armed with automatic weapons, and they blocked all the gunfire, AND fought back with TK. Surround Jean with that many gunmen and she's toast.

And the movers were shown grabbing each other with TK and throwing each other around like rag dolls. Observe:

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You can also see the black haired chick mind raping multiple gunmen at once. She had them turning in unison, as one, firing on her enemies, AND was making them walk off the roof. She can do everything Xavier can, man. Put Jean on that rooftop with all those gunmen and she dies.

For the rest of you guys, get a clue, man.

Watchers: See the future. Cassie's mother was capable of seeing a decade into the future FFS.

Bleeders: Can and will take out multiple mutants at once.

Shadows: Can and will block Xavier from sensing the location of the Push crew.

Movers: Their TK is much better suited for battle than Jean Greys is.

Stitches: One touch and their opponent is done.

The division: A govt. agency, man. Send hundreds of gunmen after the X Men and they'll be overwhelmed.

I know you guys want the X Men to win, but it's not gonna happen.

Cool, they can see the future. They see people attending their funerals.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
For the rest of you guys, get a clue, man.

Watchers: See the future. Cassie's mother was capable of seeing a decade into the future FFS.
.

Not going to help. They see shadow cat coming to rape them, what are they going to do? Nothing. Same with many of the other mutants, Push team can't do jack. Their precog is also limited, funny you compared it to Alice. All they were shown seeing is how somebody is going to be at a particular place. Not very combat effective.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi

Bleeders: Can and will take out multiple mutants at once.

Sure. And then Nightcrawler/Deadpool/Wraith kills all of them in 3 seconds. How many bleeders were shown in the film? Like 1? 2? 3?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi

Shadows: Can and will block Xavier from sensing the location of the Push crew.

Yea no.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi

Movers: Their TK is much better suited for battle than Jean Greys is.

Agreed. There are two of them. They die quickly against all the mutants.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi

Stitches: One touch and their opponent is done.

Yea no.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi

The division: A govt. agency, man. Send hundreds of gunmen after the X Men and they'll be overwhelmed.

Gunmen nice, that'll work against people like Magneto and Xavier amirite.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi

I know you guys want the X Men to win, but it's not gonna happen.

You don't know anything. X-men win based on facts.

RJ at absolute maximum there are what 16 pushers in all and most of whom we have never seen on screen. And about the bleeders finding them as we saw when they ambushed Nick it takes at least 3 -5 seconds to render someone completely helpless which is how he was still able to push them away during that time. And just like the Watcher situation they can still be wrecked through trickery or misinformation as shown at the end of the movie with inly the Japanese girl being worth anything and even then they can on functionally take down one mutant at a time and even then imagine them trying to jump someone like cyclops or deapool it would be a slaughter. Whats stopping Magneto from having Callisto find the Watchers first and Crush them under mountains of metal or Callisto run around with a Louisville Slugger? The only real direct combat effective people are the Bleeders, Movers and the Pushers and they are so low in number confirmed and coupled with their less capable abilities when referencing to someone like Xavior that its just nowhere near enough. Hell, put Xavior even in the vicinity of the building they are hiding in and everyone kills each other or goes after Keera who is the only possible person to defend from this.

X-Men win with ease.

RJ gimped the Pushers because he didn't give each side prep.

If the Push muties get prep, they win 10/10 times.

RJ gimped the Push characters. He's not even back a day and he's already gimping.

I fail to see, even with prep, how they'd deal with an intangible Prof. X.

Originally posted by dadudemon

If the Push muties get prep, they win 10/10 times.

No they wouldn't.

X-men would know they have precog, and would plan accordingly. Best plan would be to strike straight away.

Also don't Watchers just receive 'visions'? Like they don't get to selectively watch someone like Alice can.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I fail to see, even with prep, how they'd deal with an intangible Prof. X.

You don't see how seeing the future will help? Time is "perception" of events.

With prep, Kitty doesn't even get a chance to put her hand on the Professor because they are not aware of the assassin that is "dark" to all the Telepaths.

Well, I'd like to see someone argue against that because I could easily argue with myself and pwn myself from both sides. Arguing with myself is not fun.

Originally posted by Placidity
No they wouldn't.

X-men would know they have precog, and would plan accordingly. Best plan would be to strike straight away.

Also don't Watchers just receive 'visions'? Like they don't get to selectively watch someone like Alice can.

Yeah, it's a landslide victory. And, no, that's the little girl with no training that didn't know shit.

Originally posted by dadudemon
You don't see how seeing the future will help? Time is "perception" of events.

With prep, Kitty doesn't even get a chance to put her hand on the Professor because they are not aware of the assassin that is "dark" to all the Telepaths.
.

What? Who is this mystery assassin?

They have prep time, and then this random guy teleports in next to Xavier right after and kills him?

Wat?

Edit: Ok, it seems you just pulled that completely out of your bum.

X-men win. Even with prep involved. Which they don't.

Originally posted by Placidity
What? Who is this mystery assassin?

They have prep time, and then this random guy teleports in next to Xavier right after and kills him?

Wat?

Edit: Ok, it seems you just pulled that completely out of your bum.

X-men win. Even with prep involved. Which they don't.

No prep in this thread.

I was saying that WITH prep, they win 10 out of 10 times.

And, did you watch Push? I've seen both Push and all the X-men movies. I think it's rather close-minded and bias to think that the Muties have a chance IF the Push peeps are given prep.

Why haven't you made actual good arguments, though?

Such as: Clairvoyance is not telepathy.

Professor Xavier has been gimped because he cannot use Cerebro, a legit tool.

Jean has been gimped because she cannot use her full powers.

The pushers are not gimped at all besides the no-future seeing due to not prep time.

The only thing I've read in this thread is whining/complaining/bitching/trolling about what one side can do or cannot do.

You don't see how seeing the future will help? Time is "perception" of events.

Seeing someone doesn't mean shit when there is literally no way to affect them.


With prep, Kitty doesn't even get a chance to put her hand on the Professor because they are not aware of the assassin that is "dark" to all the Telepaths.

Could you rephrase that, please? I don't see how they could stop her, but anyway, with prep she can be touching him before the fight even starts.

What? Who is this mystery assassin?

They have prep time, and then this random guy teleports in next to Xavier right after and kills him?

Wat?

Edit: Ok, it seems you just pulled that completely out of your bum.

Agreed. What?