Battlezone: Voldemort (Quanchi) vs. Yoda (Vos)

Let’s start with another statement.

This is what you said:

Yoda has never disarmed a “skilled” opponent. He only disarmed a “schlub” Clone trooper. Voldemort is a “skilled” opponent who has never been disarmed prior to his final scene. Therefore, Yoda would be unable to remove the Elder Wand from the Dark Wizard.

In other words, this means that Yoda never disarmed Darth Tyranus and Darth Sidious (the two “skilled” opponents he has faced, according to you), which is true.

The thing is that both Dooku and Palpatine are Sith Lords who powers and abilities are situated amongst the highest of those in the Jedi Order. Thus, that they too have advanced precognition and Force Sense, along with bionic speed, reflexes, and overall Force and lightsaber mastery.

Therefore, Yoda won’t be able to just TK their swords from a distance because their powers and abilities are on par (Sidious) or slightly below par (Dooku) that of Yoda’s.

This is the reason why your argument of Yoda’s “embarrassing” performance against Dooku doesn’t hold. Dooku has Force-given powers almost on the level of Yoda’s. He isn’t a Royal Guard or Clone trooper who doesn’t possess precognition and Force Sense, and who doesn’t have metahuman reflexes and speed.

In fact, there’s so many points wrong this argument that I don’t know what to say.

Repetition #5:

Yoda had no intention to slay his ”old Padawan”. Secondly, how did Yoda have ample time to disarm Dooku? The man broke a pillar that was about to fall onto Kenobi and Skywalker. Yoda, at his height, cannot disarm Dooku from a saber lock. The dynamics of swordfighting change with the styles of your opponents. Yoda, at his position, would have to perform an aerial maneuver if he wished to remove Dooku’s lightsaber. And that would risk precious time to prevent the pillar from crushing Anakin and Obi-Wan.

Furthermore, Anakin, with an intent to kill, disarmed Dooku that quickly; there’s nothing to suggest that if he didn’t have this purpose, like Yoda, he would have lacerated the Count’s hands that rapidly.

1. Anakin did have an “intent to kill.” He wanted to hurt the man responsible for three years of warfare. He wanted revenge against the man who cut off his hand. When he had Dooku on his knees, he hesitated; however, with just simple goading from Palpatine (“Do it.”), he beheaded the Count. Thus, Anakin definitely had a desire to murder Tyranus.

2. Yoda may have wanted to defeat Dooku, but certainly didn’t possess any killer mindset. You don’t see Sidious or Yoda speaking to each other when they are fighting because they are hell-bent on slaying one another. However, Yoda and Dooku engage in dialogue throughout their duel because Dooku was Yoda’s Padawan and Yoda held a connection with him.

3. Finally, where the fvck did you get this notion that Yoda sat there while Dooku took his time to TK a pillar?

3 seconds?!

Dooku began his TK at 2:17 and the pillar began to fall by 2:20. 3 seconds! Voldemort’s Fiendfyre, which I later discuss, takes four times longer! Yoda, at his height, cannot disarm Dooku, a master swordsman, and a man whom he doesn’t want to kill, from a saber lock. Dooku takes three seconds to break a pillar. Yoda sees this happening, has to shift concentration, and not risk any time in the case that pillar was actually going to collapse over Kenobi and Skywalker.

Simply put, this fetish of yours that Yoda has piss-poor reflexes since he allowed Tyranus all the time in the world to topple a pillar is far-fetched.

Let us continue.

Repetition #6:

Palpatine and Yoda are essentially equals in their precognition, senses, reflexes, speed, and overall Force mastery. In lightsaber combat, neither can afford to disengage and take one or two seconds to use an offensive TK maneuver without the risk of a lightsaber up his throat. It’s the explanation behind the limited usage of Force attacks between Force-sensitives. All Jedi Knights have the precognition to ‘see’ the move and either block, dodge, or press forward with a speedier lightsaber strike to obtain the advantage.

It’s the reason why contests are not only won by those who are quicker or stronger, but also by those who have superior precognition to look farther ahead and counter their opponent’s maneuver.

Let us analyze what I just stated. Since Palpatine and Yoda are more or less on the same level, that means their powers and abilities negate each other. Hence, the precognition, heightened senses, metahuman reflexes, and bionic speed that would give them a significant advantage over lesser (those without comparable physical capabilities) adversaries wouldn’t exist.

When the Grand Master and Sith Lord battled at exceptionally high speeds (even from a Jedi POV, don’t forget that), both of them applied precognition equivalently to ‘see’ the other’s attack to determine the next move; this ‘cancellation’ resulted in whoever was the finer duelist to secure an advantage (which was Yoda). On the repulsorpod, Yoda’s better speed and swordsmanship left Palpatine besieged. When Sidious knew he was going to be overwhelmed in close combat, he fled to higher ground, where he commenced rocketing down Senate pods at the Jedi.

You could say that Yoda made a tactical mistake by allowing Palpatine to flee to the higher ground, but I’ll reply with this:

Repetition #7:

Sidious slaughtered 3 members of the Jedi Council in 9 seconds and only lost to Mace after an extended battle because Windu utilizes Vapaad, which is effectual against Dark Side practitioners. [Lightsabers forms were established at this point and the various styles were depicted on screen for the characters: Obi-Wan uses Soresu, a defensive form (shown against Grievous and Vader); Anakin/Vader uses Djem So, an aggressive overpowering form (shown against Dooku and Obi-Wan); Yoda and Sidious use Ataru, a form that utilizes intensive acrobatics; Mace employs Vapaad, a Dark Side-effective style known for its quick, deadly strikes.] Sidious was Dooku’s greater, and matched Yoda toe to toe until that point in which he had to retreat.

Basically, it’s saying Yoda allowed a larger version of himself to jump away; this shouldn’t be held against the Grand Master whatsoever since he is fighting an equal.

Anyway, this placed Yoda, a highly offensive player, on the defensive, which shifted the momentum in the Sith Lord’s favor. As a result, even after Yoda distracted Sidious by returning a repulsorpod, the Sith Lord still carried the momentum thanks to his vantage point. With the earlier equivalence broken, Sidious’s (now greater) precognition and senses prepared him for the Jedi’s landing on the ledge. That’s why he is able to instantaneously unleash his Force Storm at the Grand Master.

Now, your sad obsession to downplay Yoda has driven you to spew this drivel:

“Yoda ends up on his ass and later on admits he failed. It doesn't get any more clear than that and out of his own little disgusting mouth.

Y’know, idiotic declarations such as this one above are going to be part of the reason why you will lose this debate.

Repetition #8:

And as I said before, Yoda realized before he redirected the Senate pod that the Sith had adapted and succeeded while the Jedi Order under his leadership had remained static. Hence, the Sith could not be defeated that day regardless of the duel’s outcome, and the Grand Master understood that he had lost the fight before it even began. That coupled with the [I]arrival of Clone troopers forced him to retreat. Despite the thoughts that raged through the Jedi’s mind, Yoda still was aggressive to the degree that he was ‘winning’ the lightsaber contest (since Sidious had to flee to higher ground) and later ‘won’ the lightning/energy exchange.

Finally Yoda’s statement of, “Failed, I have,” is a reference to his bitter disappointment that he couldn’t instigate positive change within the Order and allowed the Sith to destroy the Jedi Knights under his leadership.

The burdens, doubts, and thoughts that plagued Yoda’s mind in both of those fights will be completely absent in this duel against Voldemort. He will fight without any reservations and will even be more deadly than he was against the two Sith Lords.[/I]

Sidious had already beaten Yoda before the fight began. But from a purely combat perspective, Yoda was the one who was ‘winning’/’won.’ He overwhelmed Sidious in lightsaber combat, and

Repetition #9:

Yoda has utilized tutaminis to take control of the Force Storm and redirect into pure energy that had Sidious overpowered. You see Yoda directing the counterattack at 3:31, which causes the explosion at 3:32 from the sheer chaos and power of the exchange (energy reached critical level). Yoda definitely won that sequence. The movie explicitly depicts his victory.

How can you possibly say Palpatine won that exchange? That makes absolutely no sense- you’re just trying to find a way to downplay Yoda. Yoda, being lightweight, would of course experience some recoil; unfortunately, he was right at the ledge of the repulsorpod, and that’s why he fell hundreds of feet.

Go ahead and keep contending that since Sidious was smack-dab in the middle of the Senate pod, and slammed into a railing that he held onto, he defeated Yoda from a combat perspective. That’s such a bullsh1t case, if I ever heard one.

That reminds me, you made the argument that Sidious’s powers pale in comparison to Voldemort’s, even though you haven’t properly justified how powerful is Voldemort’s attacks. You have unreasonably tried to use Voldemort’s breaking of the Hogwarts barrier as some sort of quantification. Here is what I said in response:

Repetition #10:

1. Any shield becomes more damaged/less effectual the more blows it absorbs. If that’s the case, then if the Hogwarts’ barrier had already been bombarded with the spells of some 100 Death Eaters, Voldemort only truly destroyed an already broken shield.

2. (If #1 isn’t true) We don’t know what spell Voldemort utilized to break that protective barrier. For all we know, the other Death Eaters may not have known the correct incantation, but the Dark Wizard did.

3. And yes, the barrier’s destruction was due to Voldemort (fueled by his excessive rage/horror) rather than the powers of the Elder Wand. The movie explicitly depicts the Elder Wand resisting his spell.

Your responses:

1. It wasn’t going to be broken anytime soon. It wasn’t going to be broken anytime soon. How in the world is that a proper rebuttal? How do you know that? That doesn’t even bother countering the fact that all those Death Eaters massively damaged the shield for Voldemort.

2. Voldemort just let an energy attack without an incantation? And since when did Voldemort not have the ability of wordless magic?

3. “The wand was actively going against its owner” because Harry was in the castle. What a bullsh1t excuse; if that’s the case, Harry wouldn’t have wanted Neville to have gotten hit by the spell- are we going to agree that the “wand was actively going against its owner” in that moment. The movie explicitly depicts the Elder Wand resisting his spell(s). Fact.

On the other hand, you have tried to downplay Force Lightning because it isn’t instantaneously fatal. You know why it’s called Force Lightning/Storm. Because it has “force” behind it.

Dooku’s Force Lightning slammed a hardy Anakin into a wall and rendered him unable to fight for several minutes.

Sidious’s Force Storm ejected Mace Windu at least a mile (past “gusting winds”) into Coruscant. Yoda stopped such force (from hitting his body) single-handedly without any traction on the Senate pod from point-blank range, and still managed to utilize tutaminis to transfer and redirect the lightning into a pure energy pulse.

And did you even watch Episode VI? The Emperor was torturing Luke the entire time with his lightning. Even after he mentioned, “Now young Skywalker, you will die,” he inflicts him with lightning to make him suffer till the very end. It’s blatantly obvious Sidious could have quickly killed Luke in any way; the film portrays him as sinister because he wanted Luke to experience as much pain as possible before his death.

Finally, what in the world is this garbage that Yoda can only redirect concentrated energy in a short distance?

First of all, watch this:

Yoda redirects Force Lightning from a distance [0:59]

Secondly, let us think about this logically. If Yoda can manage to redirect something that incredibly powerful a few feet away, why wouldn’t he be able to send back energy from an attack that’s more than arm’s length?

Again, when you simply repeat arguments and don’t actually provide proper counters, you cause yourself to make mistakes such as these.

With all that discussed, I’ll carry on.

See, Voldemort & Clone troopers are humans/humanoids whose senses, reflexes, and overall speed are roughly on par.

Repetition #11:

..magical spells are slow enough for human wizards to be able to sidestep. Therefore, they are not as rapid as bullets; logically, the blasts from the futuristic Star Wars guns are likely faster than bullets. Jedi are able to dodge gunfire and have the reflexes to block them; Yoda himself simultaneously engaged at least 9 Clones from the 501st, evading all of the fire and crippling/killing all of them with his lightsaber or with telekinesis. Even if you can make the assumption that magical fire rate = blaster fire rate (which I think is slightly unreasonable), in the Jedi Incursion on the Temple, Yoda was able to dodge multiple blaster fire coming in from all directions and still rush forward and eliminate his opposition.

The reason behind Yoda being able to evade this sheer amount of firepower can be attributed to his metahuman speed and reflexes, as well as his advanced precognition and Force Sense that can tell him where the blasts are coming from. Consequently, the Clones’ senses are unable to sustain with the Jedi Grand Master’s pace.

Therefore, if Yoda landed point-blank range from Voldemort (place him in Sidious’s spot), the Dark Wizard wouldn’t be able to release a spell before he’s sliced in half with a lightsaber or TK-ed off the Senate pod.

Hmm…a comparable example would be from Spiderman when Peter Parker fights the school bully. He observes the punch coming in slow motion, which for all intents and purposes can be viewed as ‘seeing’ the attack beforehand (aka precognition/Force Sense). However, when he battles the Green Goblin, also blessed with superhuman abilities, that advantage is gone and it boils down to a fight between equals.

You have concocted a primary argument that demonstrates Voldemort easily being able to hit Yoda with a spell that would disarm the Jedi’s lightsaber and leave him beleaguered to the extent that he cannot resist anymore and is finally killed. You are basing this phenomenon off the circumstances in which Palpatine disarmed Yoda’s lightsaber in the Senate Hall as a universal applicable for Voldemort across the thread. Yet, as I have been telling you since my first rebuttal, that line of thought is irrational.

Voldemort doesn’t have any of Yoda’s Force-given benefits. You have tried to tout Voldemort’s amazing reflexes and sharpshooting aptitude. Your chief example for the first has been the Dark Wizard’s removal of Harry Potter’s.

Here is the video again for everyone:

You call that impressive?

Repetition #12:

How fast are his reactions? Harry is turning, clearly not aiming for a defenseless Bellatrix, with his wand arm lifting up. Of course Voldemort knows Harry is going to try to hit him with a spell. Not only was Voldemort prepared, but frankly, in my opinion, that wasn't an example of a quick reaction. Harry was startled that Voldemort was behind him, and he didn't even respond rapidly. Regular people have the reflexes to replicate that motion.
And lol, for as “easy” as it already was for Voldemort, the dude still had to snarl and vehemently move his hand down to disarm the wand…

You continue boast about Voldemort’s disarming skill even though this scene was enormously unfair for Potter. Harry just lost Sirius; his mind was in a mental morass (watch his face). He wanted to avenge Black by hurting Bellatrix when suddenly Voldemort apparated behind him. Everybody knew the moment Potter turned around, the Dark Wizard would leave him defenseless. Technically, this wasn’t even a duel- Harry isn’t in any better of a position than Sirius was when Bellatrix cheapshot him. Voldemort could have easily materialized and launched an Avada Kadavra at point-blank range.

Honestly, I hope everyone understands why I keep repeatedly insisting that this example isn’t impressive .

As for Voldemort’s sharpshooting aptitude, your examples include the Dark Wizard hitting Harry with Crucio or ‘killing’ him with Avada Kadavra in the Dark Forest.

Here is the video of Harry vs. Voldemort at the Little Hangleton graveyard:

You call that impressive too?

I don’t even think I have to explain how utterly unremarkable Voldemort’s supposed sharpshooting aptitude against Potter is in this scene when he fires the Cruciatus Curse at Potter.

And as for the second example, well, Potter was standing still and wanted the Deathstick to hit him with Avada Kadavra. So, unless you are saying that Voldemort is extraordinary because he can hit still targets, there was nothing impressive about this moment either.

Part of the reason why Voldemort comes off that powerful against Dumbledore largely has to do with the fact that the Headmaster doesn’t move around. Voldemort and Dumbledore engage in a textbook wizard duel where both opponents stand a distance apart and overwhelm each other with spells. Voldemort isn’t prepared for an enemy that can rush at him, in all dimensions, at breakneck speed. In fact, whenever you watch Voldemort face off against Harry, Potter manages to hold off the most powerful Dark Wizard of all time because he keeps moving. You can argue that Potter had the advantage of the environment in Deathly Hallows Part II, but:

Repetition #13:

Potter ran between stone pillars that had large openings for Voldemort to blast fireballs at Harry. The time that it took Voldemort to fire spells in rapid succession was too slow to hit an opponent that didn’t bother standing still.

You completely ignored the fact that the “stone pillars…had large openings for Voldemort to blast fireballs” and claimed Harry avoided the spells because of the ‘environment.’

The actual reason is that against an opponent who doesn’t hold his/her ground and fight, like what normally occurs in wizard duels, Voldemort is unable (or has major difficulty) to land a spell on his foe. This is something I’ve mentioned from the beginning of this debate.

Finally, you have promoted a ‘fire control’ contention that I refuted in my previous rebuttal. However, you still claimed the following:

In the Deathly Hallows Part 2 we see the fire creatures let loose and set upon killing their opponents. This is on screen proof. The wizard didn't have to know the location the magic goes after it's target or anyone even if he/she can't control it. You can pretend Voldemort needs to know his opponents location with absolutely no proof and another desperate attempt to fool the posters here.

This is accurate to how it's been depicted in the films and we've seen Voldemort also quickly disperse this powerful magic with his reflexes.

Fiendfyre initially appears as a "roaring, billowing noise" and gives its victims only a moment's warning. Its flames are of abnormal size and take the shape of fire-breathing monsters and beasts, such as serpents, chimaeras, dragons, and raptors, continuously mutating. It appears to have enough consciousness to actually follow its intended victims. The fire will pursue nearby lifeforms as if it were alive itself, sentient, even the one who conjured it if they lack control. The fire will also pursue anything it can burn for more fuel and seems to incinerate anything through mere contact.

Inexperienced casters will be able to conjure it, but will have virtually no control over the flames once they are unleashed, which would make the flames a potential deadly backfire, though an experienced Dark Wizard (like Lord Voldemort) would be able to control it and manipulate it to great effect.

Your first paragraph discusses an uncontrolled Fiendfyre, in which all of that you speak of in your third paragraph occurs when you have an inexperienced caster.

However,

Repetition #14:

The film never shows what would transpire in a controlled Fiendfyre when Voldemort conjures up his fiery serpent without knowing the position of his opponent. There isn’t any proof to suggest that this snake can even sense on its own accord and move without Voldemort commanding its movements.

Secondly, the film doesn’t show whether Voldemort can maintain Fiendfyre and unleash another enchantment simultaneously, especially considering he has to sustain concentration in order to control this wild spell from being uncontained.

Thirdly, with the flames masking Voldemort’s visibility in the direction he released Fiendfyre, the Dark Wizard may not have any idea where the exceedingly swift Grand Master has jumped to. Fiendfyre would be a waste for Voldemort to maintain (especially if he cannot utilize other spells while the spell is still active and/or the serpent can only move with Voldemort’s command, both of which are unknowns that the films never explain).

All we know about controlled Fiendfyre is that Voldemort manipulate it, shape it into an aflame serpent, and set it, on his order, onto someone whose location he knows.

I have no intention of “fooling the posters here.” They are smarter for any such tricks and would understand that you are confusing uncontrolled and controlled Fiendfyre for your own purposes.

If Voldemort could “manipulate it to great effect”, why didn’t he unleash “chimaeras, dragons, and raptors” from the get-go? Why didn’t Fiendfyre instantly burst into a massive conflagration the second it was cast? The answer: those are characteristics of something that is uncontrolled.

You never see any modicum of the flame’s sentience like in Deathly Hallows II because Voldemort was in complete control. Just like he completely controlled the flame from not spreading across the Ministry atrium. Just like he completely controlled the fire to shape into a single giant serpent, and not spew out “monsters and beasts.” Just like he completely controlled the serpent to attack Dumbledore’s fixed position.

Once you realize the very obvious differences between a controlled and uncontrolled Fiendfyre, you will know why my prior rebuttal made complete sense, and why this statement:

All we know about controlled Fiendfyre is that Voldemort can manipulate it, shape it into an aflame serpent, and set it, on his order, onto someone whose location he knows

is valid.

Finally, you have argued that Voldemort can immediately form his flame serpent for attack.

Fiendfyre Activation

Voldemort casts the spell at 0:58. The serpent doesn’t move towards Dumbledore till 1:09/1:10. That’s 12 seconds for Yoda to move and attack Voldemort from wherever he wants. The same Yoda that can jump/run large distances in few seconds and immediately close the 200 foot/60 meter gap for a lightsaber or telekinetic strike.

Do you see what I am saying about illogical arguments from you? I have always respectfully acknowledged Voldemort as having tremendous firepower; and I am positive he has more dastardly spells than just Fiendfyre at his disposal. Yet, when you realize who his opponent happens to be, you soon come to the conclusion that firepower isn’t going to cut it. On the other hand, you have continued to underrate Yoda as a sluggish weakling that will stand in one spot and allow Voldemort to blast him apart.

Yoda vs. Voldemort is fundamentally an unequal battle. Voldemort doesn’t have the physiological capacity to keep up with Yoda. The Dark Wizard is a seasoned duelist who might have above average senses and reflexes, but his ultimately do not compare with that of the Grand Master’s. Voldemort doesn’t have any of the precognition or Force Sense that Sidious possessed and utilized to stalemate Yoda. Voldemort has no defense against Yoda's telekinesis, and the Grand Master has the safety net of tutaminis always with him.

Ultimately, a green lightsaber will be thrust into the Dark Wizard's heart, and the avatar of light will prevail.

Final Repetition:

When Yoda perceives how potent the Dark Side is within Voldemort, he isn’t going to wait for “Voldemort to keep him busy with his offensive powers.” He’s going to dodge the one or two spells the Dark Wizard will fire at him thanks to his advanced precognition and reflexes/senses, rush forward with his herculean speed, and immediately use telekinesis to either knock out the Elder Wand or the wizard himself- it’s the most effective technique and one that Yoda, an experienced combatant, would exploit.

The only way for Voldemort to survive would be if he apparates in time. Of course, when he materializes, Yoda would have Force Sense-d his arrival and evaded the incoming attack thanks to his precognition. And then the same scenario will repeat. You yourself admitted that spam-Apparition is out of character for Voldemort- thus, it’s only a matter of time (if not within the first 30-45 seconds of the fight) before the Elder Wand is disarmed and a lightsaber is rammed through Voldemort’s chest.

Honestly, Quanchi, you haven’t proven much at all in this entire debate. Everyone was cognizant of Voldemort’s firepower and magical repertoire beforehand, and that’s the only argument that you’ve established that I haven’t bothered to contest. The burden lay on me to prove how what Yoda demonstrated on-screen would be able to overcome this flamboyant destructive power. I have constructed an argument that has shown that. Most of your rebuttals have been negative arguments as to how Yoda is a weakling that will simply be crushed by Voldemort’s magic. You haven’t demonstrated anything rational that has Voldemort countering Yoda’s precognition, Force Sense, superhuman speed, and reflexes or bolstering his own skills.

Y'know, when Quanchi first started posting about this Battlezone Challenge in the SW Versus Forum, I didn't think any Star Wars movie character stood a chance. The Expanded Universe had more than enough proof of Star Wars characters such as Luke, Sidious, and Yoda being able to demolish Voldemort, but this thread wouldn't include EU evidence.

Yet, when I actually took a look at all the evidence displayed in the movies, there was more than enough information shown for the "little, green friend" to be victorious. And that is why I accepted the challenge.

With all that said:

I ask that all of you who will be deciding this debate put aside any biases you might be bringing to the table and rather comment on the merits of both sides, and who actually proved their case better in the end.

I thank all of you in advance for judging, and hope that everyone has enjoyed this Battlezone. Quanchi and I have put a significant amount of time in this thread, and we both hope that this debate has injected more life into this forum and drawn the interest of other posters.

I want to thank Quanchi for setting up this Battlezone and being an affable opponent who proved to be an excellent challenge. Perhaps one day we will spar again to put another show for all of you!

- Vos

Just was able to log in today. I'll respond either later today or tomorrow when I have time with my final summation.

All right!

Summation

1.Ranged Combat

This is Voldemort's greatest strength over Yoda. This is undeniable however you spin it. Voldemort can effectively unleash his attacks from any distance against Yoda whereas Yoda only possesses two forms of ranged combat. Telekinesis which Voldemort also possesses and the Yoda's option of tossing his light saber. I will get into telekinesis in depth later on in my final summation.

If Yoda decides to toss his light saber he runs the huge risk of being weaponless despite his energy dispersing powers which failed against Palpatine on the senate pod. Voldemort can definitely react with time to spare should Yoda choose this method of attack on him. We've seen someone comparable to Voldemort in terms of skill along with having the added advantage of wielding the Elder wand. Despite wielding the most powerful wand in existence Voldemort fought him to a stalemate and arguable got the better of him in their short duel at the end of Order of the Phoenix. We saw how quickly Voldemort reacted to Dumbledore repelling the fire magic in his direction and dissipating it.

Throughout this fight we also see him hold onto his wand while being trapped in a water bubble against his will and later breaking free from it. Voldemort immediately launches an attack showing how quick he can counter despite being without oxygen before Dumbledore can get the jump on him.

Fiendfyre --I see Vos is still making claims he can't back up. It's up to him to prove Voldemort needs to control the fire snake not just assume he needs all his concentration to do so when it's never been alluded to in the film. We also see Dumbledore control this fire spell easily while severely weakened so it's asinine and without merit to believe Voldemort needs all his concentration to maintain control of the fire snake. Like I said earlier even when losing control like the inexperienced Slytherin child the fire magic still seeks to destroy until stopped and Voldemort can easily dissipate it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKxk9-z-dwY&feature=related

Energy attacks --Voldemort can either fire pure energy from his wand or the death curse in energy form from his wand. This will require all of Yoda's concentration with or without his light saber. When he went up against a powerful energy wielder in Palpatine he was temporarily ko'd when struck, he was disarmed the second time while attempting to block it with his saber, and was hit by some force when he tried to redirect it against Palpatine.

This doesn't bode well since Voldemort will be flicking energy effortlessly the entire fight in his direction not just a few times like Palpatine. Yoda was unsuccessful both times when Palpatine did use this method of attack. To put it frankly Voldemort will be attacking him relentlessly with attacks that pack a whallop on pure force alone and a killing curse that oneshots the enemy.

Other Methods of Range Attack --Crucio, Dark Matter, Cutting Wand attacks, and Fire attacks.

I've already gone into these earlier in my arguments just wanted to lay this out there in his arsenal again at the close of my debate. These are all methods of attacks which will be wielding at Yoda in succession should he dodge or deflect an attack or so due to his own abilities. Two of these options only have to be pointed in Yoda's direction to work as well.

2.Apparation

This ability puts as much distance Voldemort wants to put between himself and Yoda. We hear he can even do so wandless in Deathly Hallows part 1 after his wand cracks apart in the sky. This ability will always keep Yoda on his toes to use all his senses just to survive very much in the same fashion against Palpatine when he avoided the senate pods.

Voldemort is a veteran and someone who adapts accordingly in battle to his opponent. I reference the Dumbledore battle in which he used differing attack after attack and thwarted Dumbledore's attacks just the same. Voldemort would capitalize on Yoda's lack of ranged attacks and pour it on from the onset to the close.

3.Flight

Voldemort also has the ability to use flight in battle like he did against Harry Potter in Deathly Hallows part 1. Voldemort can pour on energy attacks while taking flight so this is another ability he can use to create more distance between himself and Yoda should he feel the need to do so.

4.Telekinesis

Ok, you've seen the back and forth from both myself and Vos on this matter but I ask you to take a step back a moment and to logically think about this for a second. All skilled wizards seem to possess tk as do all skilled jedi and sith. Here in this video we see Snape use it I believe 45 seconds in to shut Voldemort's annoying toady out of the room right before he later decides to make the unbreakable vow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_2iNyKKXD4

I've shown multiple wizards such as Voldemort, Dumbledore, Snape, and Umbridge. Does it honestly make any sense that if a few wizards band together and use tk they can easily disarm Voldemort ? Does it ? It doesn't make any sense just like it doesn't make any sense with regards to the star wars characters either. Just like with Voldemort or Yoda you need to catch them off guard to do so. Voldemort shows he can disarm harry Potter in Order of the Phoenix but this doesn't mean he can do so at will every time he runs into Harry Potter. It's simply illogical to assume all one needs to do is try this method of attack and poor there goes Voldemort's wand right out of his hand. The reason I say it is unlikely is due to the fact all skilled wizards possess this ability yet no one has successfully done so on screen against Voldemort showing logically this isn't an easy feat nor one in which Yoda accomplished against skilled opponents in his own movie making it even more unlikely.

In the end you have to ask yourself and look at it from a logical perspective with the tk feats from both sets of films. To me logically it's about catching your opponent off guard otherwise the light saber battles or the duels are meaningless just disarm them with the unbeatable tk.

5.Precog

This is another greatly debated point in this battlezone. Precog has always been vague in the movies and never clearly defined. It's also flat out failed before. The two instances I directly speak of are once again Palpatine's slow hand raising blast of Yoda while he looked completely stunned and was caught off guard. Now if his precog is all that why didn't he raise his hands up to redirect the energy in time when even I saw the attack coming from a mile away. The second instance I speak of is Dooku's tk attack on his friends. Yoda should have anticipated the attack or used his own tk to overpower it since that's how vos mistakenly believes tk works. Yoda stood there and then reacted which took many seconds along with his entire concentration to accomplish. This second instance is in the heat of battle while both combatants are saber locked so he has no excuse to wait and react until the damage is done. This precog while still formidable is exaggerated to insane levels here.

6.Clone Trooper feats

I wanted to address this one last time again because vos keeps exaggerating the feats. I put up a video earlier of a young padawan successfully taking out multiple clone troopers in combat. This padawan seems in his early teens at the most. He was still able to take out multiple troopers by himself and he doesn't even come close to approaching Yoda or any other elite jedi like Obi for instance in terms of experience, skill, and overall power. To act as if Obi and Yoda as a team taking out a small number of clones which is exactly why they chose this time as an opportunity because of little resistance as some kind of impressive feat is a slap in the face. The clones like the giants, centaurs, or spiders in the Harry Potter verse can't compete with skilled wizards just like the clones can't do so only when they have the element of surprise or massively outnumber them. The wizards just like the sith/jedi stand atop their own verse in terms of formidability.

7.Conclusion: It's easy to see the strengths and weaknesses of both characters here even if you have a very limited knowledge of these two coming into this debate. Voldemort's strengths are his ranged combat, his versatility, and raw power he brings to the table while Yoda brings elusiveness, maneuverability, his precog, and being a very high level skilled swordsman in the form of a lightsaber. It's quite clear Yoda wants to close the distance to kill Voldemort or disarm him if possible whereas Voldemort wants to kill him at a safe distance and disarm him as well. Voldemort has the abilities though unlike Yoda to make sure this thing never gets too close for comfort so to speak. He can apparate at will even minus his wand if need be. Unlike Yoda's main adversary Palpatine Voldemort has two attacks that mean instant death if they come into contact with Yoda; Fiendfyre and Avada Kedavra. Yoda didn't seem in control at all during his battle with Palpatine with the fate of the galaxy on the line against someone who can't teleport like Voldemort at will. Yoda will be dodging attacks in the same vein while never being in control and just fighting to survive like he did in his failed attempt at Palpatine's life. My arguments are supported by the movies and how the characters think and fight along with my points actually occurring on film unlike Vos' main points. In the end Yoda never gets close to Voldemort and is killed in a variety of ways. Most likely it will be the killing curse which does Yoda in but just like against Palpatine once distance is established this dramatically cuts off Yoda's strengths and makes him defensive while trying to close the distance and fighting to stay alive. Magic is Might.

I'd like to thank Vos for accepting this challenge and for being a good sport about this.

😛