Originally posted by dmills
In terms of durability, Rider has pretty much run the gauntlet. Surviving planet busting power, solar system destroying power (yes Nihilist 😛) Black holes, neutron stars, suns, class 100+ punches, psionic attacks, techno organic viruses. I don't know what else you could possibly be looking for there. And that's not even going into the on the fly healing and energy recouping abilities. Rich can take whatever Glads can dish out, heal or even get more powerful as the fight goes on. I have the scans to support my position.As far as damage output is concerned, we're talking about a guy that rips holes in space/time with gravimetric energy. More to the point though, he's blasted Diamondhead's hand clean off effortlessly, blasted a hole clean through a Technarch, blew its hand off, casually KO'd Drax with a pinkie blast, obliterated the Psionic essence of Ego etc. Not to mention that he's already busted up Glads with an energy pulse before. Suffice it to say I think he can make Glads feel it. A lot.
From what I've seen of Glads he makes a big entrance, looks amazing and unstoppable, pushes his weight around like a bully, but then wilts under the pressure when his opponent starts to push back. He's the Mike Tyson of the middle-high herald tier.
You have hit the nail on the hit with the Mike Tyson comparison, and I think this gets to the heart of where we differ on Nova -- to push the boxing metaphor, what we have seen of him thus far in terms of trading punches (not bullrushing, resisting energy attacks, etc.) has not been enough to convince me that he has what to takes to last the six rounds that makes Tyson's defeat inevitable. Part of this has to do with the fact that Nova is almost never put up against a high-end brick that can match his speed, but it also has to do with the fact that, when it comes to punching, he has never delivered a blow (mind you, this is without bullrush, etc) that seemed like it wasn't something Colossus could replicate. By contrast, Gladiator is not portrayed as evenly as Nova is, but his top strength feats are vastly superior: smashing a planet, breaking hyperion's spine, etc. Likewise, Nova's best durability feats are almost all against energy/gravity forces, which he can manipulate; I need to see more before I am convinced that he can last long enough to win out against the Majestor. A final point should be added, though, which I don't think has been brought up: Nova is much smarter than Gladiator, and in a comic I can easily imagine a situation where he was physically overpowered, but ended up defeating Gladiator through cunning, either by helmet trick or by shaking his confidence some how.
Originally posted by Simbon
You have hit the nail on the hit with the Mike Tyson comparison, and I think this gets to the heart of where we differ on Nova -- to push the boxing metaphor, what we have seen of him thus far in terms of trading punches (not bullrushing, resisting energy attacks, etc.) has not been enough to convince me that he has what to takes to last the six rounds that makes Tyson's defeat inevitable. Part of this has to do with the fact that Nova is almost never put up against a high-end brick that can match his speed, but it also has to do with the fact that, when it comes to punching, he has never delivered a blow (mind you, this is without bullrush, etc) that seemed like it wasn't something Colossus could replicate. By contrast, Gladiator is not portrayed as evenly as Nova is, but his top strength feats are vastly superior: smashing a planet, breaking hyperion's spine, etc. Likewise, Nova's best durability feats are almost all against energy/gravity forces, which he can manipulate; I need to see more before I am convinced that he can last long enough to win out against the Majestor. A final point should be added, though, which I don't think has been brought up: Nova is much smarter than Gladiator, and in a comic I can easily imagine a situation where he was physically overpowered, but ended up defeating Gladiator through cunning, either by helmet trick or by shaking his confidence some how.
who said he has to act like a brick to fight a high end brick? that's not what he does. he's all about versatility and on the fly tactical assessment. the Worldmind reminds him constantly to safeguard the Xandarian legacy. he would never just stay put and trade blows. that's the nature of his powerset. Gladiator would eat a barrage of gravimetric attacks before all is said and done.
p.s. i can tell u a brick he can lose to... hint, his name rhymes with duperdan... 😄
lose to Gladiator? nah....
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
who said he has to act like a brick to fight a high end brick? that's not what he does. he's all about versatility and on the fly tactical assessment. the Worldmind reminds him constantly to safeguard the Xandarian legacy. he would never just stay put and trade blows. that's the nature of his powerset. Gladiator would eat a barrage of gravimetric attacks before all is said and done.p.s. i can tell u a brick he can lose to... hint, his name rhymes with duperdan... 😄
lose to Gladiator? nah....
The reason he would have to fight more like a brick in this instance is because of Gladiator's speed, which will make it virtually impossible for him to maintain distance while wearing Gladiator down with grav attacks. He will be forced to trade blows, and this is his biggest weakness in the feats department.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Rich loses to Thor and Surfer..😉
Gladiator ain't no Thor or Surfer...
😮💨
Based on his showings against Binary, Masterson, Rachel, Vulcan, his latest fight against Black Bolt, the Nova Corp members, a Phoenix (twice), classic Rich, the entire XMen that consisted of Rachel, a Phoenix, Poloris, etc, etc... He should be able to bust up Surfer and Thor face a couple of times. Hell, didn't Rich punch Thor so hard that it dazed him? Rich attacks did squat to Gladiator until he used his own heat vision against him.
Then if you look at Gladiator last fight during War of Kings where he dropped every being that came his way with one punch which included a Skrulls that was amped by every Earth hero on the planet, War Bird, and other members as well.
Surfer and Thor isn't above him at all and looking at fts, he could possibly pull a majority without weakness exploiting.
Originally posted by SimbonNova Prime isn't exactly a slouch in combat superspeed or tactical maneuvering/traveling speed. The latter, he's probably one of the more proficient characters if you measure it by consistency. And I disagree that he's significantly disadvantaged in H2H. He's already held his own in straight-up, toe-to-toe H2H combat.
The reason he would have to fight more like a brick in this instance is because of Gladiator's speed, which will make it virtually impossible for him to maintain distance while wearing Gladiator down with grav attacks. He will be forced to trade blows, and this is his biggest weakness in the feats department.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
who said he has to act like a brick to fight a high end brick? that's not what he does. he's all about versatility and on the fly tactical assessment. the Worldmind reminds him constantly to safeguard the Xandarian legacy. he would never just stay put and trade blows. that's the nature of his powerset. Gladiator would eat a barrage of gravimetric attacks before all is said and done.p.s. i can tell u a brick he can lose to... hint, his name rhymes with duperdan... 😄
lose to Gladiator? nah....
Why would he win against Gladiator but lose to Superman? Is it because they fight different? What's the reason?
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Nova Prime isn't exactly a slouch in combat superspeed or tactical maneuvering/traveling speed. The latter, he's probably one of the more proficient characters if you measure it by consistency. And I disagree that he's significantly disadvantaged in H2H. He's already held his own in straight-up, toe-to-toe H2H combat.
I never besmirched Nova's speed (if you look at me previous posts, you'll see that I only say that Gladiator has superior durability and strength feats; I didn't emphasize speed because I think they are comparable), I'm simply saying that in order to use a strategy better suited to his abilities, he would need a solid speed advantage over Gladiator, and he does not have that. Likewise, while he's shown himself to be a powerful h2h combatant, his best feats here are significantly below gladiator's; throwing Colossus-level punches is not the same as smashing planets.