Originally posted by chuck inglish1. You're thinking of Phantom Ganon, whose attack is different. 2. Is there nothing magic about someone shooting lightning out of his hand? Yes, there is, lol.
The game canon calls it magic therefore it's magic very slow magic at that. When did Ganon fight hypersonic speedsters?
The image speaks for itself.
You're using gameplay speed, never use gameplay speed. I'll remind you Dante doesn't move all that quickly in gameplay, either.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Hes not using gameplay speed though really, hes using the only speed we see this thing move. Also what he says is also probably true, it looks just like any magic Ganondorf applies, the fact it looks like some form of odd ball lightning seems to be a coincidence.
And to add insult to injury,It doesn't even move fast like lightning
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
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Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Gameplay speed?? If we use that than we can say sparda Dante is FTL since Dante can dodge the meteorites thrown at him when he was fighting mundus but seriously we can't use "gameplay speed" if it doesn't have a cutscene counterpart which shows the lightning going at faster speed
Originally posted by chuck inglish
And to add insult to injury,It doesn't even move fast like lightning
Just ignore it, people point this out but SP will simply think your trolling, just take into account the facts and make your decision that its useless as a feat.
Lightning, magic, w/e has to actually move at a speed to be a feat, and someone has to react to it at that speed. Not just claim "well it looks like it" and then use real lightning and its speed irl as if fiction cant change any rules or has never had lightning move slow before.
The only thing we cannot really assume is slower than typical is a bullet unaided by anything other than a regular fireing mechanism.
Gameplay speed?? If we use thatWe don't.
than we can say sparda Dante is FTL since Dante can dodge the meteorites
but seriously we can't use "gameplay speed"Agreed, we can't.
But what you're looking at is lightning, and we know how fast that moves. We also know Ganondorf and Link can strike it out of the air as it passes them.
Originally posted by Burning thoughtOh, God... That is what happens when you're legally required to let someone else use your characters for something.
Whats this? lolKL5yhZIacTE&feature=related
Nintendo had a deal with Phillips to design a CD port for the SNES which never happened, but were still contractually obligated to let Phillips use Link and Zelda in a game for thier own system, the CDI. It's got nothing to do with Nintendo and is beyond non-canon.
Edit:
Godamnit, I'm just going to point out the irony of claiming not to be trolling my thread and then posting a CD-i video.
Originally posted by chuck inglish😬
sparda Dante is FTL since Dante can dodge the meteorites thrown at him when he was fighting mundus
Not entering this debate, but are you actually under the impression that meteorites travel anywhere near lightspeed?
They penetrate the atmosphere at about 11 to 72 km (7 to 45 miles) per second.
Don't believe me?
http://abyss.uoregon.edu/~js/glossary/meteor.html
Here is my source.
The speed of light ranges from 27,250 to 4,163.8 times faster, depending on the meteorite.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Godamnit, I'm just going to point out the irony of claiming not to be trolling my thread and then posting a CD-i video.
I only asked where it was from, came across while looking up LoZ games, you have to admit its pretty funny. Watching a walkthrough of "faces of evil" and even my limited knowledge of LoZ makes me facepalm.
Originally posted by Burning thoughtIt is pretty facepalm-able yeah. Made me nearly choke on my water when I saw you'd posted it, though.
I only asked where it was from, came across while looking up LoZ games, you have to admit its pretty funny. Watching a walkthrough of "faces of evil" and even my limited knowledge of LoZ makes me facepalm.
Originally posted by Burning thought
I agree with above. Ganon doesnt have many feats tbh for physical power, only assumptions from various clashes with link, that are then automatically assumed for all forms of Ganon, there are many forms with different powers. I am sure if I knew the games timeline i could probably argue some ganons may have gained, learned or knew of powers they would not in other timelines.
You know, I notice that Kain doesn't have any feats for physical power, only assumptions from clashes with Raziel. Nor does he have any speed feats. There is also evidence for Kain having lost his powers as he changed form, and due to Blood Omen 2, so we can always go over that again.
The Ganon in this thread is composite, we're using all feats anyway, plus those of Demise. I would not recommend trying to learn the Zelda timeline, by the way, as it is entirely speculation and varies from person to person. There are a few confirmed connections, but that wouldn't really help you in a any case because of the composite nature.
Also Scenario I am not interested in who broke the castle, weve had the discussion and it goes nowhere so I think youll agree, this would be a waste of time.
It's a rather important feat, but okay if you don't want to discuss it.
I like how ignored the part where I said "assumed for all forms of Ganon" which is relevent, theres only one form I have n mind atm that was supposed to be impressive for Ganon and thats his mosnterous form knocking the MS a few meters. Kain however actually bests Raziel arm to arm, hand to hand and more. Also, again your ignorance on the source material comes up again, BO2 is another timeline that Kain in SR 2, the Kain who still retains everything he did without BO2 gains as memories. Theres also no proof Kain really lost anytihng canonically on a specific nature after BO2, just like in every Soul reaver game the characters have different moves or combos, its the same in a lot of games, theres no reason or canon you can cite that says he actually "lost" things speciifcally.
Originally posted by Burning thought
I like how ignored the part where I said "assumed for all forms of Ganon" which is relevent, theres only one form I have n mind atm that was supposed to be impressive for Ganon and thats his mosnterous form knocking the MS a few meters. Kain however actually bests Raziel arm to arm, hand to hand and more. Also, again your ignorance on the source material comes up again, BO2 is another timeline that Kain in SR 2, the Kain who still retains everything he did without BO2 gains as memories. Theres also no proof Kain really lost anytihng canonically on a specific nature after BO2, just like in every Soul reaver game the characters have different moves or combos, its the same in a lot of games, theres no reason or canon you can cite that says he actually "lost" things speciifcally.
Not sure I've really ever differentiated between his forms much. They all tend to have the same power source, and they're all the same guy. I've never used other feats when a specific form is named, such as Quanchi's threads, for example. The way the Zelda timeline works just makes it easier to give him his powers when a specific form isn't named. Why don't you just specify a form in the future?
As for Blood Omen 2, that isn't how it works. Are you sure I'm the ignorant one? Let's go over some of the source material:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nl0X_-qejD8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlGJ8yymkRM#t=6m
For one thing, time in Legacy of Kain progresses in cycles and is for the most part pre-destined. It's why we have things like the Wheel of Fate, or Raziel always killing Kain and always becoming the reaver. Alternate timelines aren't supported so much as history is altered. Kain killing William didn't create an alternate timeline, it just changed history. Raziel refusing to kill Kain. Again, no "alternate" timeline is created, history just shifts to accommodate the change and the old one is left behind. This is no different; Raziel not being absorbed allowed Blood Omen 2 to happen, and it changed history. Kain gaining memories just proved it actually happened, if retroactively. Here:
http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37412
11. Why after the change in the BO1 timeline does Kain remember his normal past, when in SR2 Raziel says that he can see new memories forming behind Kain's eyes and old ones dying?When we say here that the old memories are dying it is not that they are being erased from Kain's memory but instead being shuffled aside by the newer memories that reflect the altered course of history. Therefore he is not forgetting them he instead is holding in his mind two sets of parallel histories, one which is 'dead' and the other which is new and altered. This happens in BO1 but it is not directly mentioned by Kain.
"Altered course of history," "new and altered," this indicates that Kain's past was altered, and his original memories are from a parallel history that "died." Blood Omen 2 was essentially an in-canon retcon from Kain's perspective, since his original past is replaced.
Originally posted by The Scenario
Not sure I've really ever differentiated between his forms much. They all tend to have the same power source, and they're all the same guy. I've never used other feats when a specific form is named, such as Quanchi's threads, for example. The way the Zelda timeline works just makes it easier to give him his powers when a specific form isn't named. Why don't you just specify a form in the future?As for Blood Omen 2, that isn't how it works. Are you sure I'm the ignorant one? Let's go over some of the source material:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nl0X_-qejD8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlGJ8yymkRM#t=6mFor one thing, time in Legacy of Kain progresses in cycles and is for the most part pre-destined. It's why we have things like the Wheel of Fate, or Raziel always killing Kain and always becoming the reaver. Alternate timelines aren't supported so much as history is altered. Kain killing William didn't create an alternate timeline, it just changed history. Raziel refusing to kill Kain. Again, no "alternate" timeline is created, history just shifts to accommodate the change and the old one is left behind. This is no different; Raziel not being absorbed allowed Blood Omen 2 to happen, and it changed history. Kain gaining memories just proved it actually happened, if retroactively. Here:
http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37412"Altered course of history," "new and altered," this indicates that Kain's past was altered, and his original memories are from a parallel history that "died." Blood Omen 2 was essentially an in-canon retcon from Kain's perspective, since his original past is replaced.
But their not the same, their completly different in size, strengths and some of them have different abilities. Assuming that every size, shape or w/e of Ganon can all teleport, levitate etc is faulty. I wouldnt argue that Kains bat form, mist form or his werewolf forms can all use all of Kains magics, powers and wield the reaver.
You cant change history in Lok so look up your sources, preferably the developer diaries where they specifcally tell you that not only you cant change history but they also specifcally say Kain loses no memories or thoughts from a previous timeline.
Your source there even states it;
This goes back to our belief in the constant view that you cannot change history 'because you didn't' as shown in 12 Monkeys
Everything there happened as it was always going to happen.
Also your source proves me right so why are you posting it? nothing dies as they said, and Kains got two histories in his mind. That means he never lost what he did or what he knew from previous histories, the only reason Kain in BO2 seems to lose so much is because he can hardly remember what was happening, he had forgotten much from his past life. Kain knows both the histories with him in BO2 and BO1 without BO2. Theres nothing there that says he really specifcally lost any magic or abilities anyway.
BO2 is vague in what Kain lost anyway. We know the facts that he lost his armies, his forces and his title and the champion, he also lost the soul reaver and was left unarmed.
Ken or w/e also mentions it did happen in BO1 anyway, so Kains state in BO2 is irrelevent to what abilities he has, as is Defiance Kain who has both histories in his mind.
Also I like how you have my source for this, but you are still ignorant on not only the above but the following;
8. How can the wraith blade be sucked into the blood Reaver with Raziel's soul, wouldn't that mean that there
are two souls in there?The purified wraith blade that Raziel possesses is not drained into the Soul Reaver along with Raziel. In order for Kain to become purified by the wraith blade that contains the purity, the wraith blade must be dispersed or released from its imprisonment into Kain. Thus in that one single moment Raziel is simultaneously trapping himself within the Reaver but as well finally freeing himself from thousands of years of torment.
Apprently you still belive that Kain is absorbing Raziel, when its clear why I rolled my eyes at you saying such since Kain absorbs the imbued wraith blade for his healing?