Thor vs Worldbreaker Hulk (Slugfest)

Originally posted by Stoic
Yes you can when an entire comic goes by and the Savage Hulk has not defeated his opponent. This means that Wendigo and Bi-Beast were certainly on the level, and have also always been classified as class 100 characters. This is not the same as Spiderman or someone that is even weaker than him. Should we assume that the Hulk was angrier when he fought Thor for an entire issue than he was when he fought Wendigo, or Bi-Beast for the same amount of time, and ended up stalemating each of them?

Not every Savage Hulk character was on the same level. This was built into the character when they said the angrier he gets the stronger he gets.

It means his level fluctuates.

Here is a great example of why you can't use it.

Hercules and Hulk have fought a couple of times and they have had some great battles.

Abomination has supposedly taken on massively angry Savage Hulks, and has even notted a few stalemates and wins right.

Hercules has one shotted Abomination before but by your logic Hercules and Abomination are both class 100s and both have taken it to Savage Hulk. Therefore they should be equal yet they clearly aren't.

I don't know how to make that point any clearer.

Originally posted by Newjak
The problem you are failing to grasp is you are assuming no matter which way you decide to take it.

Not every Savage Hulk character was on the same level. This was built into the character when they said the angrier he gets the stronger he gets.

It means his level fluctuates.

Here is a great example of why you can't use it.

Hercules and Hulk have fought a couple of times and they have had some great battles.

Abomination has supposedly taken on massively angry Savage Hulks, and has even notted a few stalemates and wins right.

Hercules has one shotted Abomination before but by your logic Hercules and Abomination are both class 100s and both have taken it to Savage Hulk. Therefore they should be equal yet they clearly aren't.

I don't know how to make that point any clearer.

The point I'm getting from this is the only win Thor have over Savage Hulk is a possible win over a weaker incarnation of Savage.

Is this true.

Wendigo and Bi-Beast didn't have the amp in the dark dimension. They were the same size as Hulk and lost their amp. Also Savage Hulk is variable, so Carv and others please stop mentioning him as if he was constant. It's impossible to accurate gauge someone's strength after fighting Savage Hulk without Hulk doing a natural feat in the same comic. Otherwise, we don't know if he was operating at 500 ton strength or 1 million ton strength.

The planet feat by WBH wasn't entirely due to kinetic energy of the impact but also due to the gamma energies that was released from their bodies after collision. In another scene prior to the feat the energy pouring from Hulk was doing destruction around him just by Hulk standing there. Thus after the collision in the planet feat this same energy was released but in a much larger magnitude and contributed to the kinetic energy of the collision to do the total damage.

Also kinetic energy = 1/2mv^2. That means that if you double the speed then you increase the KE by 4 times more. Both Hulk and She Rulk headed in opposite directions making Hulk's relative velocity to hers twice the amount as if she was standing still. This created 4 times the kinetic energy. So Hulk achieved less than 1/4 of the actual feat due to strength only (the feat was split up into both kinetic energy from strength and the energy pouring from him that was released upon collision).

Originally posted by carver9
The point I'm getting from this is the only win Thor have over Savage Hulk is a possible win over a weaker incarnation of Savage.

Is this true.

To answer your question. Possibly, but possibly Thor could have netted a win against the most powerful version of Hulk to ever walk the planet.

The point being you don't know.

Just like you don't know how much more powerful WBH is than Savage Hulk.

EDIT: I do want to add I'm not trying to say Thor has always gotten Savage Hulk's best or that you can not logically come to some realm of logical idea of the level Hulk would have to be playing on to do something, but the extremes carver and Stioc and other people go to is ridiculous. Especially for direct comparisons in this case.

WBH stills obliterates this THOR

Originally posted by leonidas
you didn't understand at all what i said. at all.

hulk's strength, flash's speed et al., all exist within a context where such things are logically consistent and are exemplified over and over again. hulk could smash a planet to rubble and it would be fine. why? because that is logically consistent with his powerset and has been demonstrated over and over. if suddenly someone said damn, the hulk is as fast as the flash! that would breach that internal consistency and would be relegated to hyperbole.

as naj pointed out, there was a great size increase so sure there was some amp that went along. however, to try and use the off-hand remark that they were 1000x more powerful than they previously were is silly in my mind. trying to use that number to do calculations with which to prove hulk's superior strength is also silly imo, and unnecessary.

And yet you remain within character to continue stating consistency in terms of the Hulk's strength level, and where he was at during the HOTM arc. If the Flash was written as exceeding his top speed by 1000x times, we would all have to accept this, but when a character that can amplify his strength happens to exceed his previous showing against characters 1000x their power level it conveniently becomes silly, and should not be regarded, even at the expense of ignoring what was written on panel. Trust me I understood what you were saying, I just happened to disagree, because of the medium of literature that we happen to be discussing. In other words anything in a comic considered as cannon actually happened despite the implications and how those implications may make another character look in comparison to them... Even if that character happens to be Thor. Also I wasn't speaking of the Flash alone, what of Pietro? What stops him from flying apart at those speeds? Comic Book fiction right?

You may disagree with it, but they were 1000x their base in that confrontation, and they were owned hard.

Originally posted by Newjak
The problem you are failing to grasp is you are assuming no matter which way you decide to take it.

Not every Savage Hulk character was on the same level. This was built into the character when they said the angrier he gets the stronger he gets.

It means his level fluctuates.

Here is a great example of why you can't use it.

Hercules and Hulk have fought a couple of times and they have had some great battles.

Abomination has supposedly taken on massively angry Savage Hulks, and has even notted a few stalemates and wins right.

Hercules has one shotted Abomination before but by your logic Hercules and Abomination are both class 100s and both have taken it to Savage Hulk. Therefore they should be equal yet they clearly aren't.

I don't know how to make that point any clearer.

Nah because we know that the Savage Hulk at base was rated at 75 tons, and would break the 100 ton mark within 5 minutes, which would also increase further over time. This same Savage Hulk has fought it out with Thor without holding back for the same amount of time that he has had it out with Wendigo. This is if you want to get into specifics behind his strength base, and it's initial increases.

Originally posted by Newjak
lmao carver. Only you would read that sentence and jump to that conclusion automatically to try and turn this into some stupid win for you.

To answer your question. Possibly, but possibly Thor could have netted a win against the most powerful version of Hulk to ever walk the planet.

The point being you don't know.

Just like you don't know how much more powerful WBH is than Savage Hulk.

EDIT: I do want to add I'm not trying to say Thor has always gotten Savage Hulk's best or that you can not logically come to some realm of logical idea of the level Hulk would have to be playing on to do something, but the extremes carver and Stioc and other people go to is ridiculous. Especially for direct comparisons in this case.

Make a thread and prove your case. Any sane man would know that WWH and WBH is above Savage. You are talking crazy. Base WWH and WBH...start above Savage Hulk. They can increase their stats just like Savage can but at a faster rate.

You trying to downplay WBH and WWH is making you look foolish (not trying to insult but DA**). WWH would destroy any version of Savage, WBH would one shot any version of Savage Hulk. Make a thread and prove your case.

Pak clearly said WWH was the most powerful version of Hulks. Pak made it CLEAR that WBH was above both.

Show some scans proving Savage is above World Breaker.

Originally posted by carver9
Make a thread and prove your case. Any sane man would know that WWH and WBH is above Savage. You are talking crazy. Base WWH and WBH...start above Savage Hulk. They can increase their stats just like Savage can but at a faster rate.

You trying to downplay WBH and WWH is making you look foolish (not trying to insult but DA**). WWH would destroy any version of Savage, WBH would one shot any version of Savage Hulk. Make a thread and prove your case.

Pak clearly said WWH was the most powerful version of Hulks. Pak made it CLEAR that WBH was above both.

Show some scans proving Savage is above World Breaker.

You're making yourself look foolish with posts like that.

Originally posted by -Pr-
You're making yourself look foolish with posts like that.

😂 😂 😂 I'm literally crying laughing.

Pr, my post is on point...lol. Newjack is a cool guy, enjoy debating with and against him but at this point, he is talking crazy, just like you was talking crazy earlier when we was debating the Superman and Wonder Woman topic.

Originally posted by carver9
😂 😂 😂 I'm literally crying laughing.

Pr, my post is on point...lol. Newjack is a cool guy, enjoy debating with and against him but at this point, he is talking crazy, just like you was talking crazy earlier when we was debating the Superman and Wonder Woman topic.

It might be on point, but it's a bad point.

I was right, though. And so is Newjak, by the looks of things.

Originally posted by -Pr-
It might be on point, but it's a bad point.

I was right, though. And so is Newjak, by the looks of things.

Wow. So you think Savage Hulk is as strong as World Breaker Hulk and World War Hulk?

Originally posted by carver9
Wow. So you think Savage Hulk is as strong as World Breaker Hulk and World War Hulk?

I didn't say that. Neither did he.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I didn't say that. Neither did he.

Pr, I don't know what to say to you. That's exactly what he is saying. You are trying to take my victory from me. Let me get finish man handling Newjack- you are interrupting my work.

Originally posted by carver9
Pr, I don't know what to say to you. That's exactly what he is saying. You are trying to take my victory from me. Let me get finish man handling Newjack- you are interrupting my work.

That isn't what he said, unless I missed one of his posts.

Originally posted by Newjak
lmao carver. Only you would read that sentence and jump to that conclusion automatically to try and turn this into some stupid win for you.

To answer your question. Possibly, but possibly Thor could have netted a win against the most powerful version of Hulk to ever walk the planet.

Here is his post...this was in reference to Savage Hulk merking Thor during combat.

Originally posted by carver9
Here is his post...this was in reference to Savage Hulk merking Thor during combat.

Tell me: How does that mean what you're saying it means?

WW Hulk/WB Hulk start out above Savage Hulk, and can amplify their strength at will. This is something that the Savage Hulk could never do, and he was still able to hang tough with Thor. So no Thor would never ever be able to hang tough with a Hulk capable of amping at will, which on panel allowed him to go from not being able to stop Sakaar from exploding due to sheer strength, to being able to in a matter of moments.

Anyone like Newjak that says that the Savage Hulk may have been the equal of WW Hulk, clearly may have missed many of his appearances, and know very little of his history. For one the Savage Hulk was ripped by Rulk on a consistent basis, while WW Hulk ripped Rulk, who at that time was the same that popped the Watcher's bubble, beat the sh1t out of Thor, and various other outrageous humiliations.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Tell me: How does that mean what you're saying it means?

That's exactly what he is saying. I have been debating this with him for a week...he truly thinks Savage Hulk is near WBH in strength.

Originally posted by carver9
That's exactly what he is saying. I have been debating this with him for a week...he truly thinks Savage Hulk is near WBH in strength.

if he amped, why couldn't he be?