Hulk vs Cap´s Shield

Originally posted by Stoic
Actually that's when you know that you have been bitten, look behind you. Yup no ass. My posts electrified you so badly that you have even decided to make this into your classic insult thread. ha-ha promise me one thing. Never change. Lulz.

Fact is you havent given a half decent argument to anything ive said period all you have done is TRY to use bad context to get your failed point across.

Fact is we have seen power lvl has effected Caps shield, which is on panel proof and all you have is hopefull speculation at best.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Yap yap.

Fact is you havent given a half decent argument to anything ive said period all you have done is TRY to use bad context to get your failed point across.

Fact is we have seen power lvl has effected Caps shield, which is on panel proof and all you have is hopefull speculation at best.

Huh? [Clarification needed].

Originally posted by Stoic
Huh? [Clarification needed].

But it is IMO more then WBH could dish out and this is how I come to this reasoning.

Now we have a enraged King Thor swinging bloodlusted at Captain American whiling amping he blows with the Odinpower. It is fair to say Thor wasn't holding back at this point.

As strong as WBH is/was I don't see him having the output of a raged skyfather.

Look at the huge gap in power from when Zeus pounding on hulk, Zeus taking it easy on Hulk had enough strength to destoy hulk healing factor.

So I can seen WBH being closed to a pissed of skyfather amping his blows with mjolnir on top of it

People are forgetting that Hulk allowed Sentry to hit him as well at the beginning of the fight

Originally posted by carver9
People are forgetting that Hulk allowed Sentry to hit him as well at the beginning of the fight

They're not; it just really doesn't matter.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
I give it a shot. I see your point in saying we don't know how much power king Thor used to dent the shield that is a very vaild point.

But it is IMO more then WBH could dish out and this is how I come to this reasoning.

Now we have a enraged King Thor swinging bloodlusted at Captain American whiling amping he blows with the Odinpower. It is fair to say Thor wasn't holding back at this point.

As strong as WBH is/was I don't see him having the output of a raged skyfather.

Look at the huge gap in power from when Zeus pounding on hulk, Zeus taking it easy on Hulk had enough strength to destoy hulk healing factor.

So I can seen WBH being closed to a pissed of skyfather amping his blows with mjolnir on top of it

Lolololhahahahahaha, Zeus didn't fight WBH...he fought a holding back Hulk.

Originally posted by -Pr-
They're not; it just really doesn't matter.

Why?

Originally posted by carver9
Why?

Because Sentry's ability to hurt Hulk isn't what's being debated here.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
I give it a shot. I see your point in saying we don't know how much power king Thor used to dent the shield that is a very vaild point.

But it is IMO more then WBH could dish out and this is how I come to this reasoning.

Now we have a enraged King Thor swinging bloodlusted at Captain American whiling amping he blows with the Odinpower. It is fair to say Thor wasn't holding back at this point.

As strong as WBH is/was I don't see him having the output of a raged skyfather.

Look at the huge gap in power from when Zeus pounding on hulk, Zeus taking it easy on Hulk had enough strength to destoy hulk healing factor.

So I can seen WBH being closed to a pissed of skyfather amping his blows with mjolnir on top of it

Okay you know what I get when I read what you just wrote? This is not an insult, or a means of taking a cheap shot, but I have to dismantle your post in order to get a clear picture here.

1. You are correct in your view. We had no idea how much power Thor hit the shield with, but we do know that he hit it with enough force to cause the shield to rumple. This is the amount of collateral damage that was caused.

2. You're opinion could easily be wrong, after all WB Hulk hit and from my perspective survived a collision that took out an unknown amount of real estate. Even though he caused half of the damage, we have yet to know if it was more damage than a planet and a moon. This as we know was from an impact that was not directed at the planet/s or moon/s. Thor's hit should have vaporized Ironman who happened to be on the battle filed if he hit him with the amount of force that was being generated by Betty and the Hulk in the Dark Dimension. Tell me if I exaggerated in any way here. Ironman would have never survived an impact that turned Fin Fang Foom to dust, and those were just shock waves.

3. I want you to be open minded here, and attempt to move away from the title of Sky Father, and also come to the reality, that I have not placed the Hulk on Odin's level, but that Odin can generate far above the amount of power that it would take to destroy the shield. Again, a title should never be cause to say who can do what. Feats are what we should focus on, and the I can easily say that WB Hulk was outputting more force than Thor was when he rumpled America's Shield. This is if we go solely on the power stunts themselves, and the after effects that they left in their wake.

4. I will not say that WB Hulk would defeat Zeus, but I will say that the Hulk that Zeus destroyed was not on the level that he was during the HOTM affair. Throwing titles away, and focusing on the characters, I would say that WB Hulk would have certainly given Zeus a better fight than the Hulk that got trounced.. Again I must clarify, that in no way am i saying that the Hulk would beat Zeus just so we are clear on that.

5. Again I believe that you are hanging on to titles, and those titles have made your mind up for you, without the evidence to back it up. Hey, I can ask you if you believe that a Honda Civic could dust a Porche 911, and you would likely say no. But if I said that the Honda was modified, and had a lighter chassis what would you say then?

Originally posted by carver9
Lolololhahahahahaha, Zeus didn't fight WBH...he fought a holding back Hulk.

Originally posted by Stoic
Okay you know what I get when I read what you just wrote? This is not an insult, or a means of taking a cheap shot, but I have to dismantle your post in order to get a clear picture here.

1. You are correct in your view. We had no idea how much power Thor hit the shield with, but we do know that he hit it with enough force to cause the shield to rumple. This is the amount of collateral damage that was caused.

2. You're opinion could easily be wrong, after all WB Hulk hit and from my perspective survived a collision that took out an unknown amount of real estate. Even though he caused half of the damage, we have yet to know if it was more damage than a planet and a moon. This as we know was from an impact that was not directed at the planet/s or moon/s. Thor's hit should have vaporized Ironman who happened to be on the battle filed if he hit him with the amount of force that was being generated by Betty and the Hulk in the Dark Dimension. Tell me if I exaggerated in any way here. Ironman would have never survived an impact that turned Fin Fang Foom to dust, and those were just shock waves.

3. I want you to be open minded here, and attempt to move away from the title of Sky Father, and also come to the reality, that I have not placed the Hulk on Odin's level, but that Odin can generate far above the amount of power that it would take to destroy the shield. Again, a title should never be cause to say who can do what. Feats are what we should focus on, and the I can easily say that WB Hulk was outputting more force than Thor was when he rumpled America's Shield. This is if we go solely on the power stunts themselves, and the after effects that they left in their wake.

4. I will not say that WB Hulk would defeat Zeus, but I will say that the Hulk that Zeus destroyed was not on the level that he was during the HOTM affair. Throwing titles away, and focusing on the characters, I would say that WB Hulk would have certainly given Zeus a better fight than the Hulk that got trounced.. Again I must clarify, that in no way am i saying that the Hulk would beat Zeus just so we are clear on that.

5. Again I believe that you are hanging on to titles, and those titles have made your mind up for you, without the evidence to back it up. Hey, I can ask you if you believe that a Honda Civic could dust a Porche 911, and you would likely say no. But if I said that the Honda was modified, and had a lighter chassis what would you say then?

In regards to 1 and 2 and the collaterial damage I don't think we could compare the two. The shield itseld absorbs the energy that is impacted on it . So if WBH hit the shield all the force he did in example 2 it would be directed at the sheild and you would see no collaterial damaged.

As for Ironman being on the battle field it would be fair to say Thor didn't hit him as hard as he would hit cap's sheild based on the fact Thor knows or at least thought he know Capt sheild coudl take the beating.

3. We have seen weakened King Thor also knock the head of the destoyer with Mjolnir. Something i doubt WBH could do.

4. Understood but... wouldn it not be fair to say Zeus was hardly trying and if Zeus was pissed and amped himself more i think we would have the same outcome even if it was WBH.

5. Good example, however it is not the titles that hold me to my stance but the on panel feats the skyfathers have done not using all their power. lets take your 911 and your civic example. stock civic runs 14.9 in the 1/4 mile then you mod it and it runs 13.0 flat. However the 911 runs 12.0 at half throttle and starting in 2nd gear.

Originally posted by Stoic
WW Hulk beat Bob, and the Hulk stated on panel that he was holding back the entire time in NYC. If while holding back he could beat the Sentry, then what would he do against the Sentry if he was going all out. You understand?

yea but i take that character statements with a grain of salt after witnessing the outcome. they were both depowered imo and banner got lucky imo

Originally posted by DarkOdin
In regards to 1 and 2 and the collaterial damage I don't think we could compare the two. The shield itseld absorbs the energy that is impacted on it . So if WBH hit the shield all the force he did in example 2 it would be directed at the sheild and you would see no collaterial damaged.

As for Ironman being on the battle field it would be fair to say Thor didn't hit him as hard as he would hit cap's sheild based on the fact Thor knows or at least thought he know Capt sheild coudl take the beating.

3. We have seen weakened King Thor also knock the head of the destoyer with Mjolnir. Something i doubt WBH could do.

4. Understood but... wouldn it not be fair to say Zeus was hardly trying and if Zeus was pissed and amped himself more i think we would have the same outcome even if it was WBH.

5. Good example, however it is not the titles that hold me to my stance but the on panel feats the skyfathers have done not using all their power. lets take your 911 and your civic example. stock civic runs 14.9 in the 1/4 mile then you mod it and it runs 13.0 flat. However the 911 runs 12.0 at half throttle and starting in 2nd gear.

1. This is true, because it is Vibranium, and now mixed with Uru. So it would take the impact.

2. Let's take what Thor did to the Hulk, and remember that the Hulk that he beat was the same one that was unable to put Bi-Beast down on his own, and was given severe trouble by Wonder Man. Bi-Beast was turned to dust, and he wasn't even directly hit.

3. Again we have no idea how much power WB Hulk was at, and nowhere did it ever state that he was at the cap of his strength amplifications. We do know however that he was seen later after the collision toting more power than he had when the impact occurred in the Dark Dimension. Thor at the time when he rumpled the shield was also not using the Odin Force at the same level that Odin could use it, as he was inept at its usage.

4. The outcome would have been the same yes, but, it would have took longer, and the damage would have been far greater. The Hulk however admits to holding back, because of the casualty rate, and the idea behind Banner is that he is not a murderous cretin. Zeus on the other hand does not see mortals in the same light. He would have won, but like i said, it would have taken more to win.

5. Gotcha.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
yea but i take that character statements with a grain of salt after witnessing the outcome. they were both depowered imo and banner got lucky imo

Retcons happen all of the time, and the damage caused in the Dark Dimension pretty much does away with the idea that he wasn't holding back. In comparison, I'd say that he held back significantly. Sentry did nothing to make me believe that he was ever close to the level that WB Hulk was. Remember I said Sentry, not Void.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
yea but i take that character statements with a grain of salt after witnessing the outcome. they were both depowered imo and banner got lucky imo

Sentry was depowered, not Hulk.

2 questions:

1. Who HAS damaged the shield in the past?

2. And, HOW did they do it?

Originally posted by carver9
Sentry was depowered, not Hulk.

did u read WWH? they both reverted back to human form....depowered

Originally posted by Stoic
Retcons happen all of the time, and the damage caused in the Dark Dimension pretty much does away with the idea that he wasn't holding back. In comparison, I'd say that he held back significantly. Sentry did nothing to make me believe that he was ever close to the level that WB Hulk was. Remember I said Sentry, not Void.

So you belive that based off a completely different situation that was based off a wish that hulk was holding back? The dark dimension feat has no revelance in your argument

Originally posted by Horrificus
2 questions:

1. Who HAS damaged the shield in the past?

2. And, HOW did they do it?

IIRC:

Molecule Man via matter manipulation, Thanos via Infinity Gauntlet's matter/reality warping, King Thor via denting the shield with Mjolnir + the Odin Force, King Thor via burning through it with the Odin Force, the Serpent via shattering it with his bare hands likely through the "Serpent Force" or whatever energies he was tapping into.

^ Doom /w/ Beyonder's power as well.

The only instance that makes me think WBH could damage the shield in some way/shape/form is the fact that KT dented it with a strike from Mjolnir. IIRC, it wasn't stated/depicted that anything aside from sheer brute force went into the strike (ie. it didn't seem like he empowered Mjolnir with the OF.)

Well, as far as I can see it, Galan and Jake hit the nail on the head.

It comes down to :

1. Did King Thor use the Odin Force with his own power, when he damaged the shield?

...if the Odin Force DID have a part to play in damaging the shield...

2. Is ANY incarnation of the Hulk as powerful as King Thor + Odin Force?