Thor vs Orion

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris
I don't base it on one showing, but it does really seem like Thor has been steadily being depowered lately. His durability has gone WAY downhill. And even at his most powerful (it almost seems like 616 is being influenced by the early Ultimate Universe, in trying to go for some added realism), I'd have a hard time thinking that he could match Orion in durability and strength.

I agree. I have seen Thor at much more potent levels though and in those I'd put him over Orion. My vote is simply on what current Thor's level appears to be.

Originally posted by Odekahn
I agree. I have seen Thor at much more potent levels though and in those I'd put him over Orion. My vote is simply on what current Thor's level appears to be.

Pretty much.

Thor is a beast and even though he have losses, he also have wins and wins against very powerful opponents.

Originally posted by Odekahn I agree. I have seen Thor at much more potent levels though and in those I'd put him over Orion. My vote is simply on what current Thor's level appears to be.

you should note orions high end feats as well.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
you should note orions high end feats as well.

I'm not trying to take anything away from Orion. He's a great character and extremely powerful. I just believe that Thor outclasses him by a smidge.

But not current Thor... Orion destroys current Thor.

EDIT: Outclasses may be a bad term. Maybe "has the edge"?

Originally posted by Odekahn
I'm not trying to take anything away from Orion. He's a great character and extremely powerful. I just believe that Thor outclasses him by a smidge.

But not current Thor... Orion destroys current Thor.

EDIT: Outclasses may be a bad term. Maybe "has the edge"?

What are current Orion's feats?

Originally posted by Silent Master
What are current Orion's feats?

Current Orion? I'm not sure to be honest, but he can't be any worse off than Thor is right now.

Originally posted by Odekahn
I'm not trying to take anything away from Orion. He's a great character and extremely powerful. I just believe that Thor outclasses him by a smidge.

But not current Thor... Orion destroys current Thor.

EDIT: Outclasses may be a bad term. Maybe "has the edge"?

Selective memory is an amazing thing.

Thor has had incredible showings in the last 10 years, I can make you a list.

The recent retardation with Tutinax (Might as well be a retcon) and Bendis worfing him briefly against Taurus are the two only recently negative things that stick out in my memory that would be considered poor. True, it's not the mid 90's or early 70's where he was on a mantel power wise but looking at his overall record, it's legitimately stupid to take your stance.

My knee jerk reaction is to point out Orion's lower end showings (And yes, he has some despite the fewer appearances) but it wouldn't do anyone justice.

Whats wrong with current Thor? He is just fighting powerful opponents.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Selective memory is an amazing thing.

Thor has had incredible showings in the last 10 years, I can make you a list.

The recent retardation with Tutinax (Might as well be a retcon) and Bendis worfing him briefly against Taurus are the two only recently negative things that stick out in my memory that would be considered poor. True, it's not the mid 90's or early 70's where he was on a mantel power wise but looking at his overall record, it's legitimately stupid to take your stance.

My knee jerk reaction is to point out Orion's lower end showings (And yes, he has some despite the fewer appearances) but it wouldn't do anyone justice.

Last 10 years isn't exactly current imo. I'm just going on what I've been seeing and reading recently. I agreed that Normally I would give it to Thor.

And if you're going to try to debate and recruit someone to your line of thinking, being condescending and insulting isn't the way to do it.

Orion fought similar people that Thor is currently fighting and got worked. He got two paneled by Shaggyman and got one shotted by Doomsday. Both have similar fts and both are similarly as strong as the other, I just give Thor the overall edge.

Thor hasn't shown any great feats without his hammer. Take Orion

Originally posted by Odekahn
Last 10 years isn't exactly current imo. I'm just going on what I've been seeing and reading recently. I agreed that Normally I would give it to Thor.

And if you're going to try to debate and recruit someone to your line of thinking, being condescending and insulting isn't the way to do it.

If the last 10 years doesn't count as current, what does?

Originally posted by Odekahn
Last 10 years isn't exactly current imo. I'm just going on what I've been seeing and reading recently. I agreed that Normally I would give it to Thor.

And if you're going to try to debate and recruit someone to your line of thinking, being condescending and insulting isn't the way to do it.

Alright bro, let's limit to only the last 5 years. Out of curiousity, have you been reading the main Thor stories? Like Fear Itself, his own main title and so on? If not (Which I'd wager is the case), I'd suggest giving them a read, the notion that Thor's been depowered and can't match Orion will disappear.

In the main Thor arcs, his worst showings in the last 5 years as far as I recall is being knocked down in the beginning of Siege and being exhausted after fighting Nul/Angrir.

Awww, did I hurt your feelings? Wanna hug it out bro?

But seriously, I did come off as more harsh than I intended to. MToo much school/work and not enough play makes Rage cranky.

Originally posted by lilshogun
Thor hasn't shown any great feats without his hammer. Take Orion

Ignorance is no excuse when we have respect threads.

Originally posted by abhilegend
The dog of war wins.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Honestly, I don't think Thor's been depowered. Some portrayals have him struggle with Tutinex and get dismissed by Taurus...and then looking at Chaos War, Fear Itself, and how he's been handled under Fraction (and even Bendis to a degree), it's really hard to argue how he's been nerfed.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
And there's the fact that Thor can still summon storms without Mjolnir, as being the God of Thunder is his birthright. And before anyone goes "when was the last time he did that without Mjolnir?", post-Thor Disassembled - the arc in which that point was clearly driven home - Thor hasn't been disarmed for terribly long enough to warrant him doing so. I suppose Avengers Prime would be one example as, iirc, he didn't have Mjolnir for a while while he was adventuring with Tony and Steve. Either way, Thor Disassembled wasn't the only time Thor's used his power without Mjolnir nor was it the only time it's been explicitly stated that Mjolnir was a tool and the power is within Thor's blood.

And there's the fact that Thor's fighting to the death here, too. Unless the OP wants this to be strictly melee, that is.

The thing is, Orion can use the Astro Force without his harness too. Through bracelets on his wrists. And he has more of a history of doing so.

But the main thing, is even if energy projection is equal, Thor normally uses his hammer for defense. He'd have no way of defending against Orion's energy attacks, while Orion can create force fields.

Not that I think it will come down to energy attacks anyways, I see it being mostly a melee fight, fight to the death or no.. That's just how they roll.

Originally posted by Odekahn I'm not trying to take anything away from Orion. He's a great character and extremely powerful. I just believe that Thor outclasses him by a smidge. But not current Thor... Orion destroys current Thor. EDIT: Outclasses may be a bad term. Maybe "has the edge"?

i guess we will agree to disagree. do you have the scans of thor losing? what issue?

Why do people suddenly think current Thor is weak ? It's preposterous.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Why do people suddenly think current Thor is weak ? It's preposterous.

Because he has loses against Tutinax and Taurus. Two powerful beings that would probably beat Orion as well.

Originally posted by carver9
Because he has loses against Tutinax and Taurus. Two powerful beings that would probably beat Orion as well.