Chaos King vs Lucifer Morningstar

I really have to explain how overrated he is? Come on.

Originally posted by CortSether
Lucifer fanboys are the worst.

Originally posted by CortSether
I really have to explain how overrated he is? Come on.

as a matter of fact....go ahead. 👆

How is Lucifer overrated?

Is it overrated to say that he tanked a creation blast? Because that's an undisputed fact.

It is overrated to say that he casually warped a multiverse into creation? He did it.

Is it overrated to say that he beat everyone in his series -- from the plot-device Basanos to forcing God's hand to the Titans who were nearly God to Michael (albeit when both of them were weakened) to the plethora of opponents he beat while depowered?

Nothing anyone has said on Lucifer's behalf has been 2nd hand accounts or narration. All of it happened on panel.

Yet none of that says he can beat the dumb chaos king character.

so tell me how how he's overrated again, and tell me how YOU measure the 2 against each other. what unambiguous feat do you attribute to ck that makes you think he wins this?

Originally posted by CortSether
Yet none of that says he can beat the dumb chaos king character.

wow Oblivion is a beast if CK is just a small aspect of him...wtf...that one is new to me

Originally posted by operator616
Apart from Lucifer mentioning that his creation was a multiverse, in Lucifer #21, it says that Michael releases energies that had been seen only once before:

http://i.imgur.com/irJz4IF.jpg?1

That's a reference to Yahweh's creation, which is confirmed to be a multiverse (Lucifer #37) composed of alternate universes:

http://i.imgur.com/qYnOJ1z.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/H7UopQl.jpg

In Lucifer #39, we see an alternate version of Cal (which confirms it further):

http://i.imgur.com/95E4goS.jpg

Also, who do you think created Yahweh's creation in the first place? It was Lucifer and Michael.....so that's a confirmed multiverse right there.

Nah, there is more direct and highly valid piece of evidence for his feat being multiversal; his, Luifer's, own word; that the new Creation he forged from the Dunamis Demiurgos is indeed a multiverse.

Originally posted by ODG
If this really is everything there is to support Lucifer's feat as multiversal (and you've always struck me as being both detailed and exhaustive), then it's nearly as flimsy as the case being made for Chaos King, if not moreso.

As Epicurus said: Lucifer outright stated his creation is a multiverse in Lucifer: Nirvana.

That's why you'll notice that i started my post (this part you even quoted) "apart from Lucifer mentioning that his creation was a multiverse".

Here's the scan:

http://i.imgur.com/6NA2eJb.jpg?1

"What ive created is not a realm. It is a totality. A multiverse."

But since it's been also stated several times on panel and in the Vertigo Encyclopedia, that Lucifer created a "universe", it has become debatable whether he created a multiverse or a mere universe (there's evidence for both, basically). My response was meant to post further proof (apart from the statement in Lucifer: Nirvana which everybody is aware of) which supports the notion of Lucifer's creation being a multiverse.

Yeah, I'm with ODG here. Unless some scans are left out (As it's been a long time since I've read Lucifer), I'm not sure how one can say he has a stronger case. I mean, the word Multiverse was outright used in Chaos War a few times and it was even said ALL the Universes were in danger or something of that sort. This seems to come down to personal preference more then anything from what I can gather. The fact that Hercules while extremely weakened who Chaos King was easily as powerful as, restored the entire Trans-Universe/Multiverse or whatever makes Mikaboshi that more impressive to me.

Assuming the two were relatively equal in scale? Who would you say can better sustain damage? IIRC, Michael and Lucifer had certain physical limitations in comparison to the Chaos King. At this scale, bodily harm doesn't mean much but it's the only advantage I can think of to tip the balance one way. Of course, Lucifer is more intelligent and cunning but I'm not sure that will change the outcome by any noticeable degree. Can the Chaos King still grow in power? I mean, he was still capable of consuming more shit and become stronger. Another factor to consider.

Just my 2 cents.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
The fact that Hercules while extremely weakened who Chaos King was easily as powerful as, restored the entire Trans-Universe/Multiverse or whatever makes Mikaboshi that more impressive to me.

And as beastly as SuperGod Hercules was in that story arc, CK was more powerful still!

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Yeah, I'm with ODG here. Unless some scans are left out (As it's been a long time since I've read Lucifer), I'm not sure how one can say he has a stronger case. I mean, the word Multiverse was outright used in Chaos War a few times and it was even said ALL the Universes were in danger or something of that sort. This seems to come down to personal preference more then anything from what I can gather. The fact that Hercules while extremely weakened who Chaos King was easily as powerful as, restored the entire Trans-Universe/Multiverse or whatever makes Mikaboshi that more impressive to me.

Assuming the two were relatively equal in scale? Who would you say can better sustain damage? IIRC, Michael and Lucifer had certain physical limitations in comparison to the Chaos King. At this scale, bodily harm doesn't mean much but it's the only advantage I can think of to tip the balance one way. Of course, Lucifer is more intelligent and cunning but I'm not sure that will change the outcome by any noticeable degree. Can the Chaos King still grow in power? I mean, he was still capable of consuming more shit and become stronger. Another factor to consider.

Just my 2 cents.

Pray, do tell what physical limitations are those? Lucifer outright intimidated Dream without even trying, and at his weakest and most vulnerable even Death(the mightiest of all the Endless) was unwilling to admit that she was capable of taking him against his will. I'd put Death easily above CK. Defeating the Chaos King is a simple matter of bfring him in a void-like place where nothingness is predominant, and last I checked Lucifer has access to(and is also capable of easily manipulating) Yahweh's Gate, which is a direct passageway to oblivion.

Originally posted by Epicurus
Defeating the Chaos King is a simple matter of bfring him in a void-like place where nothingness is predominant, and last I checked Lucifer has access to(and is also capable of easily manipulating) Yahweh's Gate, which is a direct passageway to oblivion.

Originally posted by Cogito
In a neutral battleground, this should be no problem. It's only in DC apparently that you need God's permission basically to exit creation and enter the Void.

^ Cog was just mocking zop's line of logic, me thinks.

Oh ok. When did zop make this comment though?

Originally posted by Epicurus
Lucifer banishing that Chaldaean priestess in exchange for her offering her super-monster baby to him directly contradicts this claim of yours. Lucifer also putting the very same super-monster baby in the Void as a sentry against the invading Host of angels led by Amenadiel also contradicts your statement. Basically speaking, banishing CK into the Void is something which is hardly beyond Lucifer's capabilities. I'd wager even wingless Lucifer could do it, though that much is debatable.

Originally posted by Epicurus
Oh ok. When did zop make this comment though?

But yeah, I brought up the BFR thing on the 3rd page. 👆