Originally posted by carver9Srsly? He's done so throughout his entire character history.
I don't see Doomsday standing in one spot tanking punches and attacks from high class 100's and Heralds.
The rest of the points in your post were valid. They don't change my personal views in the slightest--esp. when you consider the durability feats Supes and Darkseid had at the time, but yeah...
Originally posted by BrockalizerNo. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. 😉
Wasn't that later retconned?
Originally posted by Galan007
Srsly? He's done so throughout his entire character history.The rest of the points in your post were valid. They don't change my personal views in the slightest--esp. when you consider the durability feats Supes and Darkseid had at the time, but yeah...
No. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. 😉
My post wasn't abiut durability though.
Originally posted by Brockalizer
So? Most of those were energy attacks and have nothing to do with physical damage. As far as effortlessly breaking Superman's arm, again so what? WB Hulk effortlessly breaks planets. If you go by on panel feats the amped punches Superman used in Hunter/Prey are nothing compared to WB Hulk's punches. The only edge I see Doomsday having is speed, which is minimized in this environment.
Yes they do, as several of them would have had kinetic effects too.
Originally posted by carver9
.Let's reverse this.
I don't see Doomsday walking forward almost cracking a planet in half. I don't see Doomsday and Superman punching each other, melting beings that walk around in neutron stars with just the shockwaves of their punches. I don't see Doomsday standing in one spot tanking punches and attacks from high class 100's and Heralds. I don't see Doomsday punching Superman in the face destroying a planet and nearby moon with just the shockwave of their hits. I sure as hell can't see Doomsday running through beings that Dormammu and Umar AND Classic Strange had issues with by using just one hand and one foot.
omg... fail, much?
Originally posted by carver9
.Let's reverse this.
I don't see Doomsday walking forward almost cracking a planet in half. I don't see Doomsday and Superman punching each other, melting beings that walk around in neutron stars with just the shockwaves of their punches. I don't see Doomsday standing in one spot tanking punches and attacks from high class 100's and Heralds. I don't see Doomsday punching Superman in the face destroying a planet and nearby moon with just the shockwave of their hits. I sure as hell can't see Doomsday running through beings that Dormammu and Umar AND Classic Strange had issues with by using just one hand and one foot.
WBH's feats are impressive. Nobody's arguing against that. But damaging a planet by walking is hardly a comparable measure of strength.
For example, I've never seen Zeus destroy a planet by walking, but I'm confident he'd beat the shit out of WBH. I've never seen Galactus destroy a planet by walking on it, but I'm also sure he'd ragestomp WBH in a HtH fight.
In the end, I feel Doomsday has a better chance for the reasons I/Galan have mentioned.
Originally posted by Galan007I do since Darkseid has submitted to Superman on panel while Orion has ripped through his body before on panel. Hulk smash.
I don't see Hulk, 'World Breaker' or not, nearly killing [early-90's] Darkseid with 3-4 strikes--nor do I see Hulk casually snapping an amped Superman's arm like a twig.Imho, DD's striking power and durability are superior to Hulk's. Don't get me wrong, I'm not opposed to Hulk winning--I just think DD's got better chances. /shrug
Originally posted by Cogito
WBH's feats are impressive. Nobody's arguing against that. But damaging a planet by walking is hardly a comparable measure of strength.For example, I've never seen Zeus destroy a planet by walking, but I'm confident he'd beat the shit out of WBH. I've never seen Galactus destroy a planet by walking on it, but I'm also sure he'd ragestomp WBH in a HtH fight.
In the end, I feel Doomsday has a better chance for the reasons I/Galan have mentioned.
Zeus would probably have to amp in order to take a footstep and do the damage Hulk did. I agree that Zeus would physically beat Hulk but again, he would have to amp. WWH had enough strength to cause Zeus pain, WBH, Zeus would be in some serious pain from a fist fight with WBH.
Galactus replicating Hulks footstel would have to amp his physical stats...I don't get what's so hard to grasp this. Let's not pretend like Galactus walk around already at WBH strength levels. Not saying that he would have to amp much but both would need to amp.
Doomsday isn't surviving against this Hulk imo.
Originally posted by carver9
Zeus would probably have to amp in order to take a footstep and do the damage Hulk did. I agree that Zeus would physically beat Hulk but again, he would have to amp. WWH had enough strength to cause Zeus pain, WBH, Zeus would be in some serious pain from a fist fight with WBH.Galactus replicating Hulks footstel would have to amp his physical stats...I don't get what's so hard to grasp this. Let's not pretend like Galactus walk around already at WBH strength levels. Not saying that he would have to amp much but both would need to amp.
First, I don't believe Galactus would have to amp himself to reach Hulk's strength. I think that's crazy talk.
But really, there have been stronger characters in Marvel than Hulk and they don't destroy planets by walking, so I maintain that it's a poor measure of strength.
Originally posted by Cogito
First, I don't believe Galactus would have to amp himself to reach Hulk's strength. I think that's crazy talk.But really, there have been stronger characters in Marvel than Hulk and they don't destroy planets by walking, so I maintain that it's a poor measure of strength.
People who body would go limp from a punch from Hulk has survived slaps, punches and thunderclaps from Galactus.
😕
Originally posted by Cogito
First, I don't believe Galactus would have to amp himself to reach Hulk's strength. I think that's crazy talk.But really, there have been stronger characters in Marvel than Hulk and they don't destroy planets by walking, so I maintain that it's a poor measure of strength.
The thing here is that HP Doomsday is no Galactus or Zeus, and as HP Doomsday evolved so too would the Hulk evolve, as we all know that he would also essentially continue to change as the battle raged, the problem here is can DD evolve beyond Hulk's evolutions? I think not. What was seen on panel during the HOTM arc was not even the maximum that the Hulk could grow in power, and in fact we never saw his maximum strength cap on panel to date. Based on evidence, and on panel feats, the Hulk was stronger than HP Doomsday, but I'm game to see how his strength feats somehow trumped those of the untrumpable.
Using Darkseid and his ass ripping to somehow place Hulk in the losers box is an epic error, because Darkseid is simply not as strong physically as people try to make him out to be. On panel, he stated that Superman, and Orion were his physical peers, and I simply can not see Orion being able to slug it out with a guy that can go from being able to heft 1,000,000 tons to exceeding the amount exponentially by a minimum factor of 16. Creating enough force to scatter more than a planet, and later growing to an enormous stature shows that he could have easily passed that power level by with ease.
What power punches did HP DD output to make you even believe that he wouldn't be treated like a light weight?
Originally posted by Cogito
In the 50 year history of the Hulk, his rage fueled by a fight has never made him stronger than his Worldbreaker levels. Why are we assuming that, against Doomsday, he would just keep going up? Fights have never done that to him. It's always been another source that's ramped up his rage.
It has always been his gentle nature that kept him from destroying the world or going completely off of the deep end. However as the character was developed over the past 5 years, we saw an explanation of how he was able to transcend his previous feats, which took place on Sakaar, with him being taught to hone his rage, and use in more efficiently and on a greater level.
The idea of the Hulk after being half of the force that scattered more than just a planet from just a punch (one punch in mid air) to him being seen in a far more powerful and larger stature, showed us on panel that even when he collided with Betty to destroy more than a planet, that he was capable of housing more power than even that. The idea that on Sakaar he was able to go from base strength to having enough strength to overpower an explosion that would have eminently have destroyed Sakaar is another example. to the idea that a footfall that he held back on, nearly sank the eastern seaboard should be more than enough evidence to show the HP DD was never on the World Breakers level. You know what that pretty much says about the Hulk even during WW Hulk? That a tap from him could have destroyed a US State. Just think about it, it was just a footfall, that he was trying desperately to contain so that he would not take innocent lives.
On panel it even hints at the idea that just because he does not pop the Earth with a foot fall, that it did not mean that he could not. HP D did nothing on panel to suggest that he could hang with the World Breaker for an extended period of time.