Savage Opress VS Galen Marek

Originally posted by Nephthys

That you regard facts and logic as ridiculous is quite telling. Why do you hate the truth POWER? Why do you hate America?

First: Your accusing me of ignoring facts and logic when you won't even admit Opress is Clearly Much Stronger than Ventress??

Second: Lol Your not even American!

Originally posted by Nephthys
Of course it had to be that he's faster. Theres absolutely no other explanation. It couldn't possibly be that he was just in a superior position at the time as a result of her missed swing and took advantage of it. Nope, has to be speed. This is completely apparant on the screen, I can't believe I didn't see it before.

You're must be desperate.

So what are you trying to say? That he got lucky! Twice as well! And once against Obi-Wan!

Yeah sure. And I'm sure Dooku just got lucky twice against Obi-Wan too.

Neph if he gained the supreior position while in combat with her then he's just the superior combatant.

There was no luck involved there. Your seeing what you want to see!

I can understand you arguing luck in the the way Obi-Wan beat Maul in TPM.

But there was no luck shown in the Savage fights. He beat down his opponents fair and square through superior strength and power.

Like I've already wrote in the post above, while your not agreeing that Savage is Much Stronger than Ventress and Obi-Wan, and that he defeated/overpowered them both fair and square,(or heck even that Maul overpowered Qui-Gon LOL) then I don't see how we can carry on with a Savage vs Marek with such a basic disagreement at hand of Savage's abilities.

Why not? Disagreeing with your opponent is essential to a debate. I think you're just seeing a chance to gracefully bow out. And you know what? I'm gonna let ya. This time. :maximumcondescention:

Also Ventress isn't in this fight so who cares anyway? This whole sub-argument is silly.

Not gonna join the argument but imho, Opress disarmed Obi-Wan, when he was distracted by Maul approaching right behind. The scene clearly shows Kenobi turning his head sideway. So I don't agree that Opress is better combatant or stronger Force user, than Obi-Wan in normal circumstances.
Also, taking into account feats, when he Force choked both Ventress and Dooku, pushed far back Kenobi and Anakin and gave Force wave knocking everyone sideways doesn't prove that he is more powerful, than others. At that point he was extremely enraged, which gave him that power. Ventress had similar feat, when she Force choked both Anakin and Obi-WAn, yet, it doesn't prove that she is more powerful, than either of them.
The only real advantage of Opress over others is his imbued physical strength and combat skills learned on Datomir.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Why not? Disagreeing with your opponent is essential to a debate. I think you're just seeing a chance to gracefully bow out. And you know what? I'm gonna let ya. This time. :maximumcondescention:

Also Ventress isn't in this fight so who cares anyway? This whole sub-argument is silly.

Oh because how can I argue Savage has a chance against Marek, when you (and other people) don't even give him enough credit to put him above Ventress/CW Obi-Wan?

Where can I take the argument from there??

It's funny as well because apart from in his sparring match with Count Dooku, Savage has never actually been defeated in Saber combat.

Which is quite shocking considering the opponents he's taken on, and sometimes fought 2 at a time.

Originally posted by Arhael
Not gonna join the argument but imho, Opress disarmed Obi-Wan, when he was distracted by Maul approaching right behind. The scene clearly shows Kenobi turning his head sideway. So I don't agree that Opress is better combatant or stronger Force user, than Obi-Wan in normal circumstances.

Thing is Kenobi watching out for Maul can't be used as too big an an excuse for Kenobi, when in the past Savage has fought both Anakin and Kenobi together.

He was clearly completely staggered by Savage's strength, and may have lasted longer if not for watching out for Maul, but I doubt he would have done significantly better.

Originally posted by Arhael
Also, taking into account feats, when he Force choked both Ventress and Dooku, pushed far back Kenobi and Anakin and gave Force wave knocking everyone sideways doesn't prove that he is more powerful, than others. At that point he was extremely enraged, which gave him that power. Ventress had similar feat, when she Force choked both Anakin and Obi-WAn, yet, it doesn't prove that she is more powerful, than either of them.
The only real advantage of Opress over others is his imbued physical strength and combat skills learned on Datomir.

Ah you forget his Pre-Rage feat of TK shoving the ship off the cliff. That's TK beyond anything we've ever seen from Obi-Wan.

Also I would suggest Savage(with Ventress) performed much better against Count Dooku than ROTS Kenobi did (with ROTS Anakin at his side).

People talk of Dooku humiliating Savage with FL, but he never actually permanently put him down in the fight like he did to Kenobi with incredible ease.

And I know Neph hates me wanking over this but he did Floor Dooku in close combat in that fight.

Kenobi never came close to doing any such thing against Dooku in Sabers.

So I do believe Savage is not only much stronger than Kenobi/Ventress but also has much more powerful Raw TK Power. Yes he's not as skillfull as either, but it does seem his Raw Strength and Power more than compensates for that, making him the overall superior.

Also you talk about Savage being enraged, like Ventress was, but let's compare the feats.

Ventress in a Rage choked Obi-Wan and Anakin who were caught off guard (waiting for her surrender) . Savage in a Rage choked both Ventress and Count Dooku (also caught off guard).

Savage's feat is greater because Dooku is far far better with the Force than the other 3. Whilst Ventress seems at least on Par with the Force to Obi-Wan (and Anakin on an average day).

Ventress never was able to repeat a Force attack after the choke whilst Anakin/Obi-Wan beat her again.

On the other hand Savage(after his force choke) managed to hit his duo again with a Force Wave. And then hit the Anakin/Obi-Wan duo with a Force wave. And later still grounded Anakin/Obi-Wan, 3 Destroyer droids, several battle droids and other dorids all simultaneously with yet another Enraged Force Wave!

So Savage's rage was clearly more powerful than Ventress's and lasted longer.

Add that to Dave Filoni stating Savage is all Rage and Power kind of like the Hulk.

Mmm... Last I checked Wookieepedia, it had no detailed description of Savage's powers and abilities, but I shall give a thought.

Savage Opress is 34 years old, and constantly acts on impulses. Though, his anger can be both a weakness and an inspiration to destroy his enemy. Now, Savage can be a little dumb sometimes. For instance: While he and Asajj tried to kill Dooku, he kept raising his arms and getting attacked by lightning. He also kept leaving his legs open to Obi-Wan, and his face could've been stomped in by Maul's prosthetic legs. He also exploded a box of carbonite above himself using his light saber... Tsk, tsk, tsk. However, he has backed Anakin and Obi-Wan off at the same time, has thrown Asajj around in a cargo hold like she was a ragdoll, managed to survive and pulse away a droid ambush and killed Jedi Master Adi Gallia using one of his horns. However, his leg was his weakness when Obi-Wan sliced his arm off. His legs can easily be dug into like an axe hammering into wood, step by step. He can become weak pretty easily. Obi-Wan would've killed him if Maul weren't there to save his baby bro... Funny that they're both 34.

Now, Galen Marek is an exceptional saber combatant and is full of all that Force power. It appears his only weaknesses are Juno, slow movement or thinking. He's the type of guy who just doesn't give up until he wins, no matter what cost. He has mastery of the Force like hardly any others, and knows many techniques, such as Battle Meditation. However, I noticed he may not do well in too close range attacks. Of course, he always wins in a saber lock. Now, he has defeated Kota, Kazdan Paratus, Shaak Ti, Maris Brood, Darth Vader, Palpatine and could defeat Obi-Wan, Luke, Darth Maul, Kento Marek, Darth Desolous, Darth Phobos, and the Stalker version of himself. But Savage is someone with Vader's strength, Kota's speed, Luke's clumsiness from episode 5, some of Maul's inheritance, and ultimately, a cybernetic arm. Galen's advantages are the same easiness Dooku had when exposing Savage's undefended areas, Shaak Ti's long range attacks, Asajj's martial might and skill, Maul's speed, skill against staff combatants, actually the ability to become invisible, and Obi-Wan's ability to constantly kick Savage's legs. And in the end, Galen would probably finish him off with Telekinetic assaults.