Darth Nihilus and Darth Traya - vs - DE Sidious and DE Luke

Originally posted by Pwned
Damn, it HAS been far to long since I have played that game XD I apologize for that severe stupidity on my part. Its inexcusable.

Anyways, I have a feeling that a Giga-Drain isn't just done on the spot. It seems like it draws to much power. I bet they have to raise their hand still. And drain isn't going to be their first move, will it? The fight with Nihilus, he didn't just drain on the spot. Kreia never showed a willingness to drain on the spot, I mean she took a weapon after Sion. She could have Giga-drained him.

You do realize that I am just saying that a speed blitz is a viable tactic, right? Im trying to avoid the "W0rmhol3s LUL!" thing. I mean, he could just fry them with lightning. No stopping that, considering how they never showed any form of resistance to it.

And Arhael: Thats because I can't find a copy of the book where he shows a way of stopping it. So I decided not to mention it because I can't actually grab a copy and back it up.

Kreia drained the Council after her speech was done. All she did was raise her hand and do it. And when she fought Sion she was still partially cut off from the Force. Its unclear how much she had recovered from Nihilus draining her.

Plus she had just stopped being, well, dead.

But I agree that speedblitz is viable.

The problem is, there is the question of "Was she using that speech to cover up a build up of power in order to kill them?"

I believe yes, there was. On the basis that it seems so powerful that it would require a large amount of power.

Again, I haven't played that game in over a year. I can't remember every little detail.

Theres no proof or anything in the game that indicates the drain requires a build up to be able to use. You can speculate if you want, as have others, but in the end its just speculation.

Thats my problem with it, honestly. Its the fact that we know next to nothing about the cutscene. She gives a speech, holds up her hand, half a second later they die.

Though honestly, if somebody is up in her face attacking her with a lightsaber, will she try and drain them? Or will she be dodging and fighting back with her lightsaber (s? maybe some triple saber shenanigans)

Originally posted by Pwned
Damn, it HAS been far to long since I have played that game XD I apologize for that severe stupidity on my part. Its inexcusable.

No, it's excusable. Just make sure to re-acquaint yourself with the mechanics, when you can.

Originally posted by Pwned

Anyways, I have a feeling that a Giga-Drain isn't just done on the spot. It seems like it draws to much power. I bet they have to raise their hand still. And drain isn't going to be their first move, will it? The fight with Nihilus, he didn't just drain on the spot. Kreia never showed a willingness to drain on the spot, I mean she took a weapon after Sion. She could have Giga-drained him.

Sion is Immortal.

The Giga-drain takes a second to strike and it will pretty much be their first move in a deliberate duel - especially when Nihilus wants a snack.

Originally posted by Pwned

You do realize that I am just saying that a speed blitz is a viable tactic, right?

It's not. There is a 20 Foot space between Palpy and his opponants - and we already covered why he'll die - see above posts.

Luke wouldn't fare much better - so no, speed blitz isn't viable.

Originally posted by Pwned

Im trying to avoid the "W0rmhol3s LUL!" thing. I mean, he could just fry them with lightning. No stopping that, considering how they never showed any form of resistance to it.

Yeah, wormholes were deemed uneffective by people other than me - and lightning won't do anything.

Full-powered Nihilus could likely tank lightning like it's a joke - and besides - he can just eat it up.

Originally posted by Pwned
Thats my problem with it, honestly. Its the fact that we know next to nothing about the cutscene. She gives a speech, holds up her hand, half a second later they die.

Though honestly, if somebody is up in her face attacking her with a lightsaber, will she try and drain them? Or will she be dodging and fighting back with her lightsaber (s? maybe some triple saber shenanigans)

If she wants to, she'll be draining them, before then.

Nihilus never showed ANY resistance to lightning, ever. Palpatine could shoot lightning, could use mega-TK, speed blitz, whatever.

From the few cutscenes where they are fighting, neither seem inclined to just "DRAIN! LUL!" they fight with sabers or the Force, while waiting for a better time to eat them.

Again, where does Kreia say she can do EXACTLY the same type of draining as Nihilus? I could have sworn he was a special case.

While yes, Nihilus is driven by nothign BUT hunger, he doesn't just do it.

Sion is immortal in a vague sense of the word, I will admit. But if the drain is so powerful, it would kill him.

Nihilus doesn't have a physical body. What would Lightning do to him?

Kreia explains about what Nihilus' drain does if you ask her about it: that it completely drains a target of the Force. Later if you check the corpses of teh Council it says that they've been completely drained of the Force.

Nihilus never showed ANY resistance to lightning, ever. Palpatine could shoot lightning, could use mega-TK, speed blitz, whatever.

Full-powered Nihilus could likely tank lightning like it's a joke

Nihilus doesn't have a physical body. What would Lightning do to him?

Originally posted by Pwned
Nihilus never showed ANY resistance to lightning, ever. Palpatine could shoot lightning, could use mega-TK, speed blitz, whatever.

From the few cutscenes where they are fighting, neither seem inclined to just "DRAIN! LUL!" they fight with sabers or the Force, while waiting for a better time to eat them.

Again, where does Kreia say she can do EXACTLY the same type of draining as Nihilus? I could have sworn he was a special case.

While yes, Nihilus is driven by nothign BUT hunger, he doesn't just do it.

Sion is immortal in a vague sense of the word, I will admit. But if the drain is so powerful, it would kill him.

I'll get all the proof for this, tomorrow.

I have business to attend to. Night. 🙂

Originally posted by Arhael
At last you gave truly good point.
As I said earlier Force lightning is electricity, which is effect caused by the Force, yet, it is electricity (energy), not the Force itself. Nihilus can absorb the Force but there is no evidence of him absorbing energy.
And TK is accelerated air particles sent in one or other direction. Force push cannot be absorbed in any way, it only can be blocked only by counter TK.

FL did not work on the Vong; it arced around them instead of going into them. Obviously there is a Force-component that could be absorbed/redirected.

TK is usually described as being "gripped" or "shoved" rather than "blown." Even if Vastor was a huge bamf, for him to blow Mace Windu is anatomically impossible.

Spoiler:
i'm talking about blow jobs

Force lightning worked on the Vong when Jaina Solo used it.

Originally posted by Zampanó
Neither of these is necessarily correct.

FL did not work on the Vong; it arced around them instead of going into them. Obviously there is a Force-component that could be absorbed/redirected.

Hmm. I honestly can't remember a single example in books of regular Force lightning arcing around Vong. Jacen used stunning lightning on Vong just before Vergere sacrifice and it worked. But he used stunning variation because of his morals, rather than ineffectiveness of normal one. At least in novels there is no example with normal FL, yet, lightning in general did work on them.
But Lightning actually did arc around void created by isalamari in Thrawn Trilogy. Authors seem to contradict each other or nature of the void can differentiate.

The only characters I know that are capable to truly absorb energy and turn it into power are Keiran Halkion, his descendant Corran Horn, Lomi Plo and Satel Shan.

Yoda, for example, couldn't drain lightning into himself. He contained energy in his arms and let it dissipate. That's why during straggle between him and Sidious the energy was intensifying in the middle instead of going through Yoda.

[quote]TK is usually described as being "gripped" or "shoved" rather than "blown." Even if Vastor was a huge bamf, for him to blow Mace Windu is anatomically impossible.

I agree that I am not necessarily correct as Force is all around us and FL and TK are part of it.
However, equally, it is not necessarily correct to assume that Force drain grants ability to absorb Force attacks.

To back my opinion up Krayt studied Nihilus holocron and as result was capable of draining the Force, which he demonstrated on Abeloth and Luke. However, it didn't grant him ability to absorb Force attacks and his first death happened to be caused by lightning.

Originally posted by crisis_ryitua
Force lightning worked on the Vong when Jaina Solo used it.

Originally posted by Zampanó
o.0
source?

I actually now recall it myself. She did kill a Vong with Force lightning.

So now the novels contradict each other?

Originally posted by Major Valerian
So now the novels contradict each other?

"Ysalamiri did not actually negate the Force; since all existence was infused with Force energy[2] this would not be possible. Rather, they projected a bubble inside which users were unable to exert any influence over the Force." - I know same unreliable wookieepedia but it makes sense, why their bubble protects from Force lightning, while Vong's - doesn't. 🙂

remember the dark jedi that killed the vong with the force too....

Originally posted by truejedi
remember the dark jedi that killed the vong with the force too....

Didn't Nihilus survive the destruction of Malachor V's surface via Mass Shadow Generators?

Also, this "hurdur we don't know how much time Giga Drain takes to use" shit needs to go away.

I assume everyone here has seen the comic where Nihilus destroys Visas's world? According to it, it was with a word. You can argue against that, but you'd only look stupid in doing so.

Traya is probably the weakest character here IMHO. She's certainly far less powerful than Nihilus. Since he sort of dominated her the one time they fought.