Originally posted by SundippedThe other side to that is what Jake's been saying throughout the thread, though: that other than Yat's showing against SBP, his feats as Ion are pretty inconsistent with what other people's (IE, Kyle's) showings with the Ion power have been. Yat should be able to best Thor/Hulk given what the Ion power is, and what Kyle was able to accomplish with it. However, the only feat he has that even begins to approach that threshold is his fight with Prime. What I was getting at when I first brought it up was this: given the totality of Yat's feats as Ion, should his showing against SBP even be considered as the norm for him (IE, something he could replicate in a forum setting against top tiers)?
Ok I might have went out on a limb saying Yat could do it while poisoned.Other than that, Thor and Hulk are not beating anyone who legitimately stalemated a certified trans level being in Prime. It's almost like pitting them against Thanos. Except with speed and a little more power.
Again, don't have much of an opinion on this particular fight; this is solely about Yat.
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
What? 😬No, it's nothing at all like putting them against Thanos, who would have given Prime a far better fight than Yat did. Let's put an end to that line of thought right away.
Thanos would beat the crap out of Yat.
So basically your saying Prime is not in Thanos' ballpark. How could Thanos have given a better fight? Might as well say he would've won the fight. Yat matched Prime punch for punch. Thanos is not beating the crap outta Ion or Prime.
Originally posted by Harbinger
The other side to that is what Jake's been saying throughout the thread, though: that other than Yat's showing against SBP, his feats as Ion are pretty inconsistent with what other people's (IE, Kyle's) showings with the Ion power have been. Yat should be able to best Thor/Hulk given what the Ion power is, and what Kyle was able to accomplish with it. However, the only feat he has that even begins to approach that threshold is his fight with Prime. What I was getting at when I first brought it up was this: given the totality of Yat's feats as Ion, should his showing against SBP even be considered as the norm for him (IE, something he could replicate in a forum setting against top tiers)?
This is something I can get behind.
Yat w/ Ion, like Mindset pointed out, doesn't even have the feats to match Kyle with just a power ring. On paper, Sodam Yat should easily be trans level. In actuality, it's generous that he be placed in that tier just because of his scuffle with Prime.
It's flat out ridiculous to use that fight as evidence that he'd easily beat Thor and Hulk, who each have feats just as impressive as an extended battle with Prime or more so. It's debatable he'd even win at all.
Originally posted by Harbinger
The other side to that is what Jake's been saying throughout the thread, though: that other than Yat's showing against SBP, his feats as Ion are pretty inconsistent with what other people's (IE, Kyle's) showings with the Ion power have been. Yat should be able to best Thor/Hulk given what the Ion power is, and what Kyle was able to accomplish with it. However, the only feat he has that even begins to approach that threshold is his fight with Prime. What I was getting at when I first brought it up was this: given the totality of Yat's feats as Ion, should his showing against SBP even be considered as the norm for him (IE, something he could replicate in a forum setting against top tiers)?Again, don't have much of an opinion on this particular fight; this is solely about Yat.
What low feats as Ion does he have?
Originally posted by Sundipped
So basically your saying Prime is not in Thanos' ballpark. How could Thanos have given a better fight? Might as well say he would've won the fight. Yat matched Prime punch for punch. Thanos is not beating the crap outta Ion or Prime.
I didn't say that nor did I even allude to that.
Given Thanos power set and his actual feats and fights, I have no doubt that he'd give Prime a tough fight. And you don't have to be a Thanos fanboy to realize that.
If I were to using your line of logic, I would state that you must think Yat could endure the ass kicking Thanos got from Odin.
Originally posted by SundippedI never said he had low feats, as he really doesn't. I'm suggesting that as Ion, his feats to date should be far more impressive than they are. Kyle as Ion tooled Alexander Nero, recreated the Guardians, beat Obilivion, etc. Again, Yat doesn't have feats that begin to touch that. If Yat did, this wouldn't be a thread; however, because he doesn't, we're basically stuck arguing whether feats should trump Yat's "role" or vice-versa.
What low feats as Ion does he have?
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I didn't say that nor did I even allude to that.Given Thanos power set and his actual feats and fights, I have no doubt that he'd give Prime a tough fight. And you don't have to be a Thanos fanboy to realize that.
If I were to using your line of logic, I would state that you must think Yat could endure the ass kicking Thanos got from Odin.
Yes he can. His durability passed the test to a certain extent vs Prime.
They're both on the same level. They would perform as expected of a trans challenging a skyfather.
Originally posted by Sundipped
Yes he can. His durability passed the test to a certain extent vs Prime.
They're both on the same level. They would perform as expected of a trans challenging a skyfather.
...
Um, no, nothing Yat did or took suggests him wading through Odin's blasts or attacks, the same of which one shot KO'd Silver Surfer.
And no, Yat isn't on the same level as Thanos at all.
Originally posted by Harbinger
I never said he had low feats, as he really doesn't. I'm suggesting that as Ion, his feats to date should be far more impressive than they are. Kyle as Ion tooled Alexander Nero, recreated the Guardians, beat Obilivion, etc. Again, Yat doesn't have feats that begin to touch that. If Yat did, this wouldn't be a thread; however, because he doesn't, we're basically stuck arguing whether feats should trump Yat's "role" or vice-versa.
The only feat you need is the Prime fight. As long as he has no subpar feats, or even at the same time no showcase feats, his credibility still won't diminish.
Originally posted by Sundipped
The only feat you need is the Prime fight. As long as he has no subpar feats, or even at the same time no showcase feats, his credibility still won't diminish.
And we ignore the feats of Thor and Hulk in the process?
Because that is literally the only way Yat wins this in a shitstomp.
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
...Um, no, nothing Yat did or took suggests him wading through Odin's blasts or attacks, the same of which one shot KO'd Silver Surfer.
And no, Yat isn't on the same level as Thanos at all.
Don't see how you view Yat any lesser than Prime, the latter of whom you'd say would give Thanos a good fight. I know you know stalemate means basically the same as equal right?
Originally posted by Sundipped
Don't see how you view Yat any lesser than Prime, the latter of whom you'd say would give Thanos a good fight. I know you know stalemate means basically the same as equal right?
Because Prime has better feats than his glorified ass kicking of Sodam Yat?
Prime was toying with Yat virtually the entire time. Every time Yat felt as if he had the advantage, Prime would just deliver another crushing blow or attack. It was an uphill fight for Yat the whole time. There was no way he was going to walk out of that fight the winner.
Originally posted by Sundipped
There ya go. That's why I'm saying he wins.
Feats considered, they still won't take a majority.
So long as you know that the only way Yat wins anything resembling a decisive victory against the two of them is via ignoring the vast history of Thor and Hulk, that's fine by me.
Feats considered, they actually do.
I think part of the problem here is you're looking at tiers instead of characters and power sets and how they interact with one another.
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Because Prime has better feats than his glorified ass kicking of Sodam Yat?Prime was toying with Yat virtually the entire time. Every time Yat felt as if he had the advantage, Prime would just deliver another crushing blow or attack. It was an uphill fight for Yat the whole time. There was no way he was going to walk out of that fight the winner.
LOL at you saying he toyed with him.
It was uphill because he got poisoned early. Even after that he drew blood & made Prime scream in pain till he finally ran out of gas. Prime would've emerged the victor but no denying Yats performance ater poisoning is a direct indicator they're on the same page.
Originally posted by Sundipped
LOL at you saying he toyed with him.
It was uphill because he got poisoned early. Even after that he drew blood & made Prime scream in pain till he finally ran out of gas. Prime would've emerged the victor but no denying Yats performance ater poisoning is a direct indicator they're on the same page.
Yeah, Conner hurt Prime. Superman has hurt Prime. Kid Flash hurt Prime. Martian Manhunter hurt Prime.
Hurting Prime isn't the issue; putting him down is. Do you not think that Thor or Hulk could hurt Prime or something?
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
So long as you know that the only way Yat wins anything resembling a decisive victory against the two of them is via ignoring the vast history of Thor and Hulk, that's fine by me.Feats considered, they actually do.
I think part of the problem here is you're looking at tiers instead of characters and power sets and how they interact with one another.
No I didn't mean to say that's why earlier.
I was talking about Yats feat.
Their history also has them defeated meagerly as well. Yat has no meager feats. That's why you have too apply some logic as well and not get so hung up on feats.
You think they'll take the majority but that's your opinion. Mines differs. Agree to disagree.