Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet vs Dawn of Time Anti-Monitor...

Originally posted by Galan007

^^I'm curious because it doesn't appear in any
Avengers/Ultraforce tie-in I have in the folder.

PS. I hate this subject already and I'm no longer here.

I hate Nemesis now too. I hate the Ultraverse. 😛

Originally posted by Mr Master
The other scan is not a tie-in but a post issue. It doesn't
concentrate on Nemesis just a cut-scene showing us what that
Wave had done. I forgot exactly which one since I cropped that a
while back, but it's surely one of the first 6 follow ups that continues
the Ultraforce stories in its new continuity.

Like I said: it isn't in the folder I have designated for Avengers/Ultraforce.

Originally posted by Mr Master
The Nine Worlds aren't separate dimensions that I know of,
that may be something new.

pretty sure that isn't new.....the term dimension is used to describe the portals between the worlds/realms/dimensions.

From what I know, there are 4 Worlds on one land mass including Asgard,
the other 4 Worlds of Asgradian Cosmology are in pocket-dimensions,
but Leo, these pockets are very small,
if I'm not mistaken Hel is located in the bowels of a planetary sized
sphere.

but hel itself is very large and contains millions of souls. it's also one of the splinter realms and as a hell lord she has direct access to mephisto and dormmy and the other hel lords and splinter realm rulers.

I have Surtur stating his realm burns for 1000's of miles.
I think, almost sure the other 4 dimensions are planetary sized or less.

pretty sure that isn't the case, but maybe rage or odg has some off-hand support for the sizes of the these dimensions. i'd have to go back and look. i do know hel is very large though....

These natural Nexuses permit access only between these dimensions,
meaning you can't use them to venture to Alternate universes.[quote]

okay...?

[quote]I know what was stated, but then we also know what was accomplished.
It doesn't seem to even had burned the entire less than Galactic-
sized Pocket-dimension which is "Asgard-Space."

Imo, the hyperbole doesn't match the fire's on panel fury.

but the intent was made crystal clear via narration time and again. it's right there, said over and over. not sure how you can simply deny/ignore what was stated so many times.....

Pocket-dimensions diverge just like entire Universes.
As I understand it, every time a universe diverges from 616,
all the pockets that surround/associate with 616 (pantheons/demons)
diverge as well to surround/associate with the diverged copy.

So ie. the reason we have a Dormy 9777, or 691 is because that
Dormy deals solely with those said realities from outside it within his Pocket.

and....here is the problem. but i think you're closer to what i'm saying than you were in the past. if these other realms are completely separate in regards to our space/time/order/chaos/death/oblivion WHY would they be copied when our universe is? they have no reason to be copied. all we share is some random interaction between denizens. surely dormmy 616 could as easily interact with universe 9997 as with 616. no inherent reason that he couldn't. if there is no inherent reason for these dimesnions to be copied, they SHOULDN'T copy.

but they do. which implies there must BE a reason. the dark dimension 616, negative zone 616, crimson cosmos 616 et al., get copied because they are part of a larger unit/body/collective tied in various ways to our universe. when our universe diverges, it takes everything else with it. call this larger unit whatever you want i guess, but to me it makes a lot more sense to state that it is this 616 COLLECTIVE that comprises 616 ETERNITY, than to be forced to relegate eternity to some minor part of the nine worlds. that notion is supported on panel as well, when we literally SEE eternity portrayed as a multiverse. with that in mind, we also don't have to come to the unfortunate conclusion that thanos w/IG would get worked by odin in asgard. :/

Originally posted by leonidas
pretty sure that isn't the case, but maybe rage or odg has some off-hand support for the sizes of the these dimensions. i'd have to go back and look. i do know hel is very large though....

Originally posted by leonidas

pretty sure that isn't new.....the term dimension is used to
describe the portals between the worlds/realms/dimensions.

Originally posted by leonidas

hel itself is very large and contains millions of souls. it's also
one of the splinter realms and as a hell lord she has direct access
to mephisto and dormmy and the other hel lords and splinter realm rulers.
pretty sure that isn't the case, but maybe rage or odg has some
off-hand support for the sizes of the these dimensions. i'd have to
go back and look. i do know hel is very large though....

Originally posted by leonidas

the intent was made crystal clear via narration time and again. it's right there,
said over and over. not sure how you can simply deny/ignore what was stated so
many times.....

Originally posted by leonidas

and....here is the problem. but i think you're closer to what i'm saying than you
were in the past. if these other realms are completely separate in regards to our
space/time/order/chaos/death/oblivion WHY would they be copied when our
universe is? they have no reason to be copied. all we share is some random
interaction between denizens. surely dormmy 616 could as easily interact with
universe 9997 as with 616. no inherent reason that he couldn't. if there is no
inherent reason for these dimesnions to be copied, they SHOULDN'T copy.
but they do. which implies there must BE a reason. the dark dimension 616,
negative zone 616, crimson cosmos 616 et al., get copied because they are part of
a larger unit/body/collective tied in various ways to our universe. when our
universe diverges, it takes everything else with it. call this larger unit whatever you
want i guess, but to me it makes a lot more sense to state that it is this 616
COLLECTIVE that comprises 616 ETERNITY, than to be forced to relegate eternity
to some minor part of the nine worlds. that notion is supported on panel as well,
when we literally SEE eternity portrayed as a multiverse. with that in mind, we also
don't have to come to the unfortunate conclusion that thanos w/IG would get worked by odin in asgard.

Imo, the easiest way to look at it, is 616 universe in a bubble, in
the bubble there are other tiny universes (Pockets) around/outside
616 but within the bubble.
There, we have a Universe (616) and it's affiliated Pockets (Asgard/Dormy 616 etc)
sharing one bubble although the Pockets are outside 616 while all
are in the bubble.

Then there's another bubble, in it, 691 universe and the exact same
Pockets outside/surrounding 691, yet all within the bubble, but now
its future versions of 616 and the Pockets sharing the bubble with
616, so therefore these would be Alternates bubbles.

So now, we can find a relation between Parent Realities and their
associated Pockets, without needing to place the Pocket literally
withIN said Realities, which would be illogical and impossible
anyway since no Two dimensions can share the same space.

😂 I think I just spun myself dizzy, but I feel it makes sense. Thoughts good friend.

And I appreciate the cool discussion. 🙂

.

Originally posted by Mr Master
I meant the 3 on Asgard's land mass.

Well, America is about 3.5 thousand miles across and about 3.8 mill sq/mi,
and there's roughly 320 millions souls in here.
It's not inconceivable the writer meant that when he made Surtur say it, imo.

I didn't deny/ignore it leo, I told you it was hyperbole imo based on showings.
The Fires are burning withIN a Pocket-dimension, and evidently not
the entire Pocket either, cause Odin and Freyja went into Asgard-
Space just to relax while Thor's trial went on.
It can't destroy an entire pocket smaller than the milky way.

but....that doesn't make sense. before he even had twilight surtur, on his own, was capable of wiping out a galaxy (i believe odin description of the event, but even if you feel it was just a core, a core can be up to 10 000 LIGHT YEARS across!) so here he is with his grand plan and power and.......it burns a few 1000 MILES? 😬 not sure how you can willingly accept that, despite whatever artistic impressions you were given. couple that with the clear intent of the story, and, well, i'm baffled.

Cool post. But yea friend this is where comics can't be perfect.
I agree its a convoluted pretzel but it is what it is.

Imo, the easiest way to look at it, is 616 universe in a bubble, in
the bubble there are other tiny universes (Pockets) around/outside
616 but within the bubble.
There, we have a Universe (616) and it's affiliated Pockets (Asgard/Dormy 616 etc)
sharing one bubble although the Pockets are outside 616 while all
are in the bubble.

Then there's another bubble, in it, 691 universe and the exact same
Pockets outside/surrounding 691, yet all within the bubble, but now
its future versions of 616 and the Pockets sharing the bubble with
616, so therefore these would be Alternates bubbles.

So now, we can find a relation between Parent Realities and their
associated Pockets, without needing to place the Pocket literally
withIN said Realities, which would be illogical and impossible
anyway since no Two dimensions can share the same space.

😂 I think I just spun myself dizzy, but I feel it makes sense. Thoughts good friend.

And I appreciate the cool discussion. 🙂 [/B]

i wish i knew where you got this bubble idea, or why you are so against occam's razor here--especially when there is concrete on panel evidence to support the idea that eternity CAN and has been seen to be a mutliverse. it's really not convoluted at all. you have this notion of eternity as a shark, and all these dimensions orbit it like remora, but....in that case the remora GAIN something from the shark, the shark has a purpose to them. here, your outer realms gain nothing from hanging around the 616/midgard and so have no inherent reason to be copied. you view eternity as just a single reality, but reality is layered, multi-dimensional. the support for that notion is self-evident in the comic world. i still cannot for the life of me understand why you view eternity as such a limited entity. and now he's apparently just a small piece of the norse cosmology. it's...odd. oh well. i know you'll die on that hill so i'll leave ya to it. i'm sure this circle will come around again in time.....

Originally posted by zopzop
Leo, I think the 85 version of the Official Marvel Handbook had a diagram of the 9 realms from the Asgardian point of view and their relative sizes.

yeah, i've seen that a bunch of times. problem there is the earth dimension/midgard, appears to be roughly the same size as asgard. 😬 while it may show relative locations, it clearly doesn't establish relative sizes.

Originally posted by leonidas
but....that doesn't make sense. before he even had twilight
surtur, on his own, was capable of wiping out a galaxy (i believe
odin description of the event, but even if you feel it was just a core,
a core can be up to 10 000 LIGHT YEARS across!) so here he is with
his grand plan and power and.......it burns a few 1000 MILES?
not sure how you can willingly accept that, despite whatever artistic
impressions you were given. couple that with the clear intent of the
story, and, well, i'm baffled.

Originally posted by leonidas
i wish i knew where you got this bubble idea, or why you are so
against occam's razor here--especially when there is concrete on
panel evidence to support the idea that eternity CAN and has been
seen to be a mutliverse. it's really not convoluted at all. you have
this notion of eternity as a shark, and all these dimensions orbit it
like remora, but....in that case the remora GAIN something from
the shark, the shark has a purpose to them. here, your outer
realms gain nothing from hanging around the 616/midgard and so
have no inherent reason to be copied. you view eternity as just a
single reality, but reality is layered, multi-dimensional. the support
for that notion is self-evident in the comic world. i still cannot for
the life of me understand why you view eternity as such a limited
entity. and now he's apparently just a small piece of the norse
cosmology. it's...odd. oh well. i know you'll die on that hill so i'll
leave ya to it. i'm sure this circle will come around again in time.....

I never limited Eternity btw friend. To me, 616 Eternity/Infinity
contain the power of the Multiversal Space-Time Continuum of
Alternate Universes. Only that they also personally represent solely
616. Although their Consciousness/Essence spans said Multiverse.

Imo, so don't bite my head off. lol Have a great weekend! stoned

no head biting, just some head scratching. lol

Still purple guy wins

AM up one.

Down two AM 😛

Wat? 😱

Hehe

Originally posted by Golgo13
AM up one.

Originally posted by guy222
Hehe

You jokester, you! 😖hifty:

Originally posted by Golgo13
You jokester, you! 😖hifty:

Originally posted by Sundipped
^
Let me ask you a couple of questions:
Where do you think the alternates came from?
All from Earth 93060 which is a single earth within the Ultraverse?

Originally posted by Sundipped
I made it clear earlier that the Ultraverse is commonly referred to as a universe. Get over it. The view was subjective but still in accordance with the definitions. That is if you want to apply it to the Ultraverse. Personally, despite the references to the term "universe", I don't see why the same rules given in the bio, wouldn't coinside with the what the Ultraverse represents. You can make a case and say Ultaverse=/=Prime Marvel Multiverse but meh. They both contain alternate versions of characters so they must be somewhat similar in terms of structure. I'm under the impression that every time the word "reality" was mentioned it meant an alternate universe like in the case where the time gem travelled to (alternate earth: location Los Angeles) that had an alternate Warstrike present. For all we know, the word "multiverse" may have never been mentioned at all ever during the Malibu/Ultraforce runs before Marvel bought em out. It's also possible that it wasn't thouroughly differentiated throughout it's history but at the same time could still be synonomous to being vaguely described as a collection of more than one primary earth/universe.

And why do you keep adding a s on multiverse. A multiverse is the collection of alternate earths, divergent realities, etc. I'm only discussing what I'm alluding to as one multiverse.

Originally posted by Sundipped
At the end of the day, you can think whatever you want and frankly this isn't something that needs to be dragged out. It was just a concept thrown out there for those who want to dwell on it if desired. It's becoming circular jibba - jabba.

^
Are you trying to insinuate that Nemesis had just created them? Furthermore you're basing this off of the word "MAYBE" as if that's definitive evidence to their origin. If you take time out to read that whole scan, you can clearly see that the narration during that scene was used ONLYto emphasize the heroes courage when sacrificing themselves. None of those "MAYBES" is for certain.

Originally posted by ODG
Well if you aren't arguing that Nemesis warped multiverses, then there's no point in arguing. Nemesis' power warped the Ultraverse repeatedly. A single universe. Something that nobody's ever denied.

My whole notion from the begenning was that the Ultraverse is composed of alternate realities/universes which is ONE multiverse. Well here is what the Ultraverse is composed of as told by Ironclad and this is what Nemesis affected. He even gave an analogy to boot.

Originally posted by ODG
Amen.

👆