Also Thor is not hitting superman if he doesn't want to. Tagging Gladiator, Hyperion, Sentry and surfer wouldn't cut it here. Those are the best speed feats of Thor. Superman's best feats are straight up catching Barry Allen, Wally, Bart, Thawne in a race and blitzing lightspeed speedsters. You don't have to be a scientist to know that superman's average speed feats leave thor's best speed feats in dust nevermind his best feats.
Considering Thor's abilities and Loki's as well, Superman won't indefinitely be untouchable in this match. Thor doesn't have to get a lucky punch or swing in in order to hit Superman. You would have to ignore everything either Asgardian have done and simultaneously use Superman's best showings ever to get to that conclusion.
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Considering Thor's abilities and Loki's as well, Superman won't indefinitely be untouchable in this match. Thor doesn't have to get a lucky punch or swing in in order to hit Superman. You would have to ignore everything either Asgardian have done and simultaneously use Superman's best showings ever to get to that conclusion.
Originally posted by CosmicComet
If Thor can tag a top speed Superman, it would require that his limbs are moving at well over lightspeed+. Which would imply he could move his legs nearly as fast, since arms and legs move in proportion to each other speed wise.In the time it takes you to punch, you can also take a step forward.
Hence, super speed reflexes do not exist without super speed in the first place. Otherwise its like saying your muscles can move thousands upon thousands of times faster than your own...muscles.
How do you explain Thor throwing his hammer over lightspeed then?
Originally posted by abhilegend
Not really.
Yes, you would.
Superman, even if wants to be "untouchable", won't be in this fight. Especially not with Loki in this fight. The guy is able to mentally assault people from across dimensions and can weave illusions that fool Odin. You would have to, as you said earlier, use CBR Superman to even begin to come to the conclusion that Superman wouldn't be touched at all in this fight.
Originally posted by Mindset
How do you explain magnets?
Playing with magnets is one of the first bits of science most children discover. That's because magnets are easy to use, safe, and fun. They're also quite surprising. Remember when you first discovered that two magnets could snap together and stick like glue? Remember the force when you held two magnets close and felt them either attract (pull toward one another) or repel (push away)? One of the most amazing things about magnets is the way they can attract other magnets (or other magnetic materials) "at a distance," invisibly, through what we call a magnetic field.To ancient people, magnetism must have seemed like magic. Thousands of years down the line, we understand what happens inside magnetic materials, how their atomic structure causes their magnetic properties, and how electricity and magnetism are really just two sides of the same coin: electromagnetism. Once scientists would have said magnetism was the strange, invisible force of attraction between certain materials; today, we're more likely to define it as a force created by electric currents (themselves caused by moving electrons).
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Yes, you would.Superman, even if wants to be "untouchable", won't be in this fight. Especially not with Loki in this fight. The guy is able to mentally assault people from across dimensions and can weave illusions that fool Odin. You would have to, as you said earlier, use CBR Superman to even begin to come to the conclusion that Superman wouldn't be touched at all in this fight.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
How do you explain Thor throwing his hammer over lightspeed then?
Magic.
I remember a very old showing posted of Odin telling Thor of the hammers properties, such as the fact that the hammer can spin faster than light, and Thor is unsure about it at first, and then he starts spinning it and it revolves super fast.
On a similar note, I do remember a Surfer feat of him tossing a massive spaceship, after disabling its coordinate/guiding system, just shortly after the Fear Itself stuff, and the spaceship moved well past the speed of light. I remember arguing that this is a physical speed feat for Surfer as well due to his arms needing to move fast if the object he's throwing moves fast (same way your finger tips move at the same speed as the baseball you just threw). But I don't think that got too much traction, was just argued as 'meh, vague strength' or some such.
Originally posted by abhilegend
I never said that jake. All I said that if superman used his best speed neither Thor nor Loki would be able to touch him. Not that he would do that here.
Him using his best speed and becoming "untouchable" makes as much sense as me arguing Loki makes himself and Thor both invisible and intangible using magic that makes him hidden from the likes of Odin and Mephisto in their respective realms as they attack the other team without fear of reprisal.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I can't fathom how that's a defeated pose. I really can't. Especially when he's the one still releasing energy.He would have defeated him easily though, had he been weaker. There's not much there to indicate holding back. He was trying to find a worthy contender against someone more powerful than he, and him holding back would be fruitless. Not saying he went all out, but him not trying to beat Surfer, and therefore it's not indicative of power level sounds stupid. Especially when you look at what Surfer tried in the battle... IE almost nothing.
Because you're implying a level of power behind it. We know for a fact that Loki isn't >>> Hulk + Surfer, so why is it even relevant in a power battle?
It doesn't help either.
"Arg, you got me. I quit"
- LokiEither way, Surfer is way stronger now, so Loki's odds are terrible.
You piqued my curiosity. How do you know only Surfer was releasing energy?
Yea, we aren't getting anywhere here.
Yes, I am implying a level of power behind it and I have no idea why Loki proving to be superior to Hulk/Surfer somehow diminishes my point. I have absolutely no problem with Loki shitting on those two.
And of course it's relevant. What the hell is wrong with you? Loki isn't going to be testing Surfer here, he isn't going to try and fight him like f*cking Thor. He's going to fight Surfer like he does at his most formidable, like a sorcerer/magician, and his magic proving to be far superior to that Surfer is relevant. Loki didn't shape-shift, amp his strength or summon weapons, all which significantly augment his physical capabilities alone; to the point he can practically match and has even allowed him to get the advantage over Thor, much less Surfer.
Maybe if he decides to lock arms and fight like Thor would, then yea, he should lose more often then not. Otherwise Surfer takes maybe 4-6/10 against Loki.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
And if Loki and Thor used their abilities to the fullest, Superman wouldn't be able to touch them.
That's only relevant if they get a bit of time to prep themselves just before the 'gun' that signals the start of the match goes off. The time it takes for them to think of doing their best, is much slower than what Superman needs to think about doing anything at his best.
Superman can operate as if a mere fraction of a nanosecond feels like entire minutes to him. This means a second is going to feel like decades or even centuries to him when he's in this top speed mode.
Originally posted by abhilegend
WTF are you talking about? It was just speed which was emphasized when he was blitzing him.Sure Thor said that his attack was missed as if spidey knew the attack coming but that's not the part of the blitz. When he started blitzing masterson commented that he's pouring on speed and not that he was anticipating his attacks. The whole notion of blitzing through spider-sense is absurd, Irene Adler can know about attacks before they happen. Doesn't mean she can blitz someone.
Speed isn't something you have to master. Batman has done that too, to Flash himself. Doesn't mean much.
Spidey and wolverine both have blitzed hulk. You mean that blurry leap? He's shown that since 60's. That only happened once in JIM 112. Hulk isn't faster than spidey or logan. That's just not true.
Not if we compare their speed.
Lol@blurry LEAP.
Originally posted by CosmicComet
That's only relevant if they get a bit of time to prep themselves just before the 'gun' that signals the start of the match goes off. The time it takes for them to think of doing their best, is much slower than what Superman needs to think about doing anything at his best.Superman can operate as if a mere fraction of a nanosecond feels like entire minutes to him. This means a second is going to feel like decades or even centuries to him when he's in this top speed mode.
Even if Superman moves that fast from the get go, he won't be able to knock out either guy in time before Loki goes "lol" and makes them invisible/intangible and removes all sound from the battlefield, effectively making Supeman's senses null and void. At that point, one of Superman's greatest assets in the form of his super senses is pretty much shot to hell.
Given respective feats, personalities, and the like, Loki is more likely to become "untouchable" than Superman is.