A choice between Captain America or Professor X

Originally posted by curryman
I'm just busting your balls, Cap's got some good stuff on his record 😄

However, he's not being sent there as a motivational speaker. He's being sent as a diplomat to best represent Earth. There's a couple of advantages that I feel Xavier has over him;

- Superior experience (Shi'ar/Skrull)
- He's more intelligent
- He started a dream of coexistence while Cap was still on ice.

Ah. uhuh

Cap has led the Avengers in situations where he's dealt with about just as many alien species as the X-Men have. Plus his reputation on Earth (and beyond) is pretty top tier. The fact that he's a man who has waged war, in my opinion, actually helps him out as an advocate for peace; he knows what war does to people and views it as a last possible resort. A soldier who's battled pretty much his entire life to save innocents would have a strong value on peace and justice.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Ah. uhuh

Cap has led the Avengers in situations where he's dealt with about just as many alien species as the X-Men have. Plus his reputation on Earth (and beyond) is pretty top tier. The fact that he's a man who has waged war, in my opinion, actually helps him out as an advocate for peace; he knows what war does to people and views it as a last possible resort. A soldier who's battled pretty much his entire life to save innocents would have a strong value on peace and justice.

He's a murderer.

He's battled for peace and justice while killing other soldiers. So much for the peace right?

Originally posted by curryman
He's a murderer.

He's battled for peace and justice while killing other soldiers. So much for the peace right?

Because he's had to.

Cap is optimistic, but also grounded in the harsh reality of how the world (and universe) works. Being a soldier and having fought to prevent the loss of life for innocents doesn't make him any less qualified to preach for and advocate peace and justice.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Because he's had to.

Cap is optimistic, but also grounded in the harsh reality of how the world (and universe) works. Being a soldier and having fought to prevent the loss of life for innocents doesn't make him any less qualified to preach for and advocate peace and justice.

Why did he have to?

No one forced him to go into war.

And the America he worshiped when he became Captain America? lmfao.

Originally posted by TheHulk
And no Black Lighting can go to hell 😂

Your so racist I bet you would wanna be cap.(if he was green and full of gamma sauce)...actually I'd want to be that cap.

Originally posted by curryman
Why did he have to?

No one forced him to go into war.

And the America he worshiped when he became Captain America? lmfao.

He's killed to save the lives of innocents. He takes no pleasure in it.

Of course not. But he saw what was going on across the world, namely people being butchered, and felt that he had to do something.

Cap doesn't believe and has never believed America nor its political leaders are anything close to perfect. It's a fundamental aspect of his character. Cap will always speak up and out against his government when it does some shady shit.

Cap's racist and a hypocrite. Mainly against mutants.

For example. THe entire AVX fiasco was pretty much caused by Captain America's decision to take Hope, and his insistence that despite them having no experience with the Phoenix, they could do better than the people who understand it as much as it can be understood, and Scott's daughter(Rachel) who was the avatar for the Phoenix for years. And they only did it because the world was supposedly threatened, but all the times mutants have had problems, Avengers haven't even lifted a finger.

He even goes so far as to bring pretty much the entire Avengers roster with him in a Hellicarrier, because he's not there to talk, he's there to take her.

When Iron Man fractures the Phoenix and it jumps into the Phoenix 5 and they start doing nothing but making the world a better place, Cap brings down the hammer and decides they're menaces. Doesn't even throw a, "You screwed up" Iron Man's way, despite the whole thing being his fault. So they attack them, and when the Phoenix 5 fight back, they're the bad guys. He's even blaming them for all the bad stuff, despite knowing none of them were true Phoenix hosts and couldn't control themselves eventually.

A few issues in, Mr. Fantastic calls Cap and Iron Man out on the whole issue, saying they felt threatened because the mutants with the Phoenix were making the world a place where it didn't need the Avengers.

There's also the fact that he's ready to throw the book at pretty much every mutant ever whose not on the Avenger's payroll, but Wanda causes the deaths of millions because of "No More Mutants", and it was just an accident.

Cap's not as golden as people seem to think.

Neither is Xavier, but at least Charles has admitted to his faults.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
He's killed to save the lives of innocents. He takes no pleasure in it.

Of course not. But he saw what was going on across the world, namely people being butchered, and felt that he had to do something.

Cap doesn't believe and has never believed America nor its political leaders are anything close to perfect. It's a fundamental aspect of his character. Cap will always speak up and out against his government when it does some shady shit.

Shady shit?

What was World War II?

The good guys vs the bad guys? 😆

Originally posted by KingD19
Cap's racist and a hypocrite. Mainly against mutants.

For example. THe entire AVX fiasco was pretty much caused by Captain America's decision to take Hope, and his insistence that despite them having no experience with the Phoenix, they could do better than the people who understand it as much as it can be understood, and Scott's daughter(Rachel) who was the avatar for the Phoenix for years. And they only did it because the world was supposedly threatened, but all the times mutants have had problems, Avengers haven't even lifted a finger.

He even goes so far as to bring pretty much the entire Avengers roster with him in a Hellicarrier, because he's not there to talk, he's there to take her.

When Iron Man fractures the Phoenix and it jumps into the Phoenix 5 and they start doing nothing but making the world a better place, Cap brings down the hammer and decides they're menaces. Doesn't even throw a, "You screwed up" Iron Man's way, despite the whole thing being his fault. So they attack them, and when the Phoenix 5 fight back, they're the bad guys.

A few issues in, Mr. Fantastic calls Cap and Iron Man out on the whole issue, saying they felt threatened because the mutants with the Phoenix were making the world a place where it didn't need the Avengers.

There's also the fact that he's ready to throw the book at pretty much every mutant ever whose not on the Avenger's payroll, but Wanda causes the deaths of millions because of "No More Mutants", and it was just an accident.

Cap's not as golden as people seem to think.

Neither is Xavier, but at least Charles has admitted to his faults.

AvX? I hope that's not the entire basis of your argument, because AvX trashed the characters of several characters depending on whether or not the issue in question was a "Pro-X-Men" one or a "Pro-Avengers" one. I could go into great detail why and how AvX was a mess, but that will derail the issue at hand.

And Cap's supported Wanda and Pietro for years now. He took in two former mutant terrorists and personally vouched for them when society was all up in arms for it.

And while Captain America isn't perfect, he definitely has admitted to his own faults as well.

Cap didn't give a flying f that Genosha got annihilated.

Originally posted by curryman
Shady shit?

What was World War II?

The good guys vs the bad guys? 😆

Cap had plenty of disagreements against his superior officers and the top brass/politicians during WWII. Him fighting to help not just America but the rest of the world against the Axis Powers doesn't change that.

You seem to have this opinion that Cap is just a "yes man" for the US gov, when he's anything but that.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Cap had plenty of disagreements against his superior officers and the top brass/politicians during WWII. Him fighting to help not just America but the rest of the world against the Axis Powers doesn't change that.

You seem to have this opinion that Cap is just a "yes man" for the US gov, when he's anything but that.

Doesn't matter what his personal disagreements were, he went there as a symbol to strengthen the war-effort. Also, let's not forget the freaking program that helped create Captain America and the experiments that followed. Cap's relative obedience is part of the reason why they decided to keep trucking with the weapon x project!

And then there's just the unbelievably lack-luster effort on his behalf to actually do anything to help mutants. Hell all of the Avengers are guilty of this one.

Originally posted by curryman
Doesn't matter what his personal disagreements were, he went there as a symbol to strengthen the war-effort. Also, let's not forget the freaking program that helped create Captain America and the experiments that followed. Cap's relative obedience is part of the reason why they decided to keep trucking with the weapon x project!

And then there's just the unbelievably lack-luster effort on his behalf to actually do anything to help mutants. Hell all of the Avengers are guilty of this one.

Yeah, he inspired his fellow soldiers. Doesn't detract from the immense amount of good he accomplished at all. Cap volunteering (this is the key word) for Operation: Rebirth also doesn't make him a guilty party for less than altruistic people to decide to conduct their own super soldier programs with decidedly more torturous experimentation. To that end, you may as well blame Xavier for ushering in the X-Men because it lead to more and more mutants exposing themselves, some with far less noble intentions.

Cap's trust and faith in Pietro and Wanda was a huge step in the right direction for mutants. He took the children of the most infamous terrorist on the planet and showed that they were heroes, regardless of their genetics. And hell, if you're going to blame Cap and the Avengers for not doing much for mutants, you may as well blame the X-Men for not doing shit for humanity in general for all the times the Earth's been invaded or the universe has been peril. Let's face it, the X-Men are primarily motivated by mutant issues and how they mesh with humans (which is an admirable goal). The Avengers save lives, regardless of them being human, mutant, androids, gods, etc.

Damn guy, you can't be serious.

Some real ignorance going on in these posts 😛

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Yeah, he inspired his fellow soldiers. Doesn't detract from the immense amount of good he accomplished at all.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Cap volunteering (this is the key word) for Operation: Rebirth also doesn't make him a guilty party for less than altruistic people to decide to conduct their own super soldier programs with decidedly more torturous experimentation.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
To that end, you may as well blame Xavier for ushering in the X-Men because it lead to more and more mutants exposing themselves, some with far less noble intentions.

Xavier being on the forefront in trying to actually help a group that's being systematically exterminated is not the same. And when you look at the difference here Xavier is raising people to use their powers responsibly. Cap completely failed at directing the American military/Rebirth/Weapon X in a proper direction. In fact he helped by becoming the ideal for their project.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Cap's trust and faith in Pietro and Wanda was a huge step in the right direction for mutants. He took the children of the most infamous terrorist on the planet and showed that they were heroes, regardless of their genetics.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
And hell, if you're going to blame Cap and the Avengers for not doing much for mutants, you may as well blame the X-Men for not doing shit for humanity in general for all the times the Earth's been invaded or the universe has been peril. Let's face it, the X-Men are primarily motivated by mutant issues and how they mesh with humans (which is an admirable goal). The Avengers save lives, regardless of them being human, mutant, androids, gods, etc.

This is a lie.

It's a lie and you know it 🙂

The X-Men have countless incidents of helping humans and the second biggest conflict that most of the X-Men deal with is constantly helping people who want to murder them! Do you know absolutely nothing about the X-Men?

Huh? The X-Men have regularly stood in front of humanity and protected it, whether it was from mutants or otherwise.

Originally posted by curryman
Damn guy, you can't be serious.

Some real ignorance going on in these posts 😛

There's nothing ignorant about them. 😬

Originally posted by curryman
Yeah he inspired his fellow soliders. Inspired them to do what? Kill.

He inspired people to do the right thing and help save and protect those who couldn't fend for themselves. Did his presence increase morale and as such effect combat efficiency? Sure. But Captain America was never and has never been about "kill enemy soldiers". If Cap could end skirmishes without taking a single life, he did.

Originally posted by curryman
He volunteered but he was practically brainwashed into thinking that they were actually doing some good. Instead of going after people who profited off the war he went down there to kill soldiers. And you need to check your logic here because him volunteering makes him more of a party to their shady business then someone who was forced 😐

He went there to stop the Axis Powers, not the simplistic notion of just killing enemy troops. He was there primarily to thwart the Red Skull, a guy who's evil and influence went far and beyond that of Adolf Hitler. And he was shutting down the guys who were making and profiteering off the weapons as well. Cap did a helluva lot more than just fight on the front lines and score up a body count. That can't even be contested or argued against. And yes, him volunteering to be a super solider doesn't make him a guilty party for other people not connected with Operation Rebirth to twist the intent from Erskine's work into dark deeds. In fact, Cap's made it a point - numerous times - to fight against those who would do such a thing.

Originally posted by curryman
How is this the same? Captain America willingly joined and carried out work for perhaps the most malicious secret organization in Marvel-America. He did this out of some foolish notion that going to war is a good things, cause he had to "beat the bad guys".

He went to war to stop the Axis Powers, who in the Marvel Universe, were far worse and much more heinous than the real world. He fought bad guys, but more importantly, saved lives by storming concentration camps, disarming doomsday weapons, shutting down weapons plants, and foiling regular criminals in the mean time. Again, simplifying what Cap did doesn't make it true.

Originally posted by curryman
Xavier being on the forefront in trying to actually help a group that's being systematically exterminated is not the same. And when you look at the difference here Xavier is raising people to use their powers responsibly. Cap completely failed at directing the American military/Rebirth/Weapon X in a proper direction. In fact he helped by becoming the ideal for their project.

What? So Cap being arguably the single greatest hero on the planet and inspiring virtually every hero since somehow makes him a poster boy, and as such, to blame for people who want to corrupt what he's done? This doesn't even make any sense.

Originally posted by curryman
This is a good thing. Should be an obvious one considering that our heroes should be beyond base racism 😄

And yeah, it's convenient that people like to argue "Cap's done nothing for mutants!" when he's personally vouched for and supported two former criminals - the children of the most infamous terrorist on the planet - into becoming members of the premier superhero team on the planet. The X-Men have always taken a center stage when it comes to mutant/human affairs and have such, often demanded the responsibility of paving the way. Cap's respected that and has gone on record to argue for mutant rights and that they deserve the same respect as any other human. What, do you want Cap to single handily solve the mutant/human issue?

Originally posted by curryman
This is a lie.

It's a lie and you know it 🙂

The X-Men have countless incidents of helping humans and the second biggest conflict that most of the X-Men deal with is constantly helping people who want to murder them! Do you know absolutely nothing about the X-Men?

How is it a lie? The X-Men's primary goal has always been advancement toward human/mutant equality and peace. If the issue/threat at hand doesn't directly involve mutants in some way, it's not a priority for them. That's not a lie, it's fact. Yes, they do save humans and at times the world as a whole (often from other mutants or threats somehow related to them), but the X-Men's primary function has never been to save the world and beyond from all manner of superhuman/extraterrestial threat. To that end, blaming the Avengers/Cap or claiming every time they weren't in a story equates to them "not caring" is as stupid as doing the same to the X-Men for every story or threat where they weren't present. The Avengers has mutants on the roster and have even defended them to the press multiple times. How many humans are X-Men?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Huh? The X-Men have regularly stood in front of humanity and protected it, whether it was from mutants or otherwise.

Of course they have and I didn't say they haven't.

But their primary goal has always been peace and co-existance between humans and mutants, not a task force specifically designed to save the world. Obviously, if they can, they'll do it, but their mission parameter isn't the same as the Avengers.

The argument that the Avengers or Captain America don't care about the X-Men because they're not involved with or shown in their arcs makes as much sense as the X-Men not giving a shit when something goes down in the world and the Avengers are off taking care of it.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
How is it a lie? The X-Men's primary goal has always been advancement toward human/mutant equality and peace. If the issue/threat at hand doesn't directly involve mutants in some way, it's not a priority for them. That's not a lie, it's fact. Yes, they do save humans and at times the world as a whole (often from other mutants or threats somehow related to them), but the X-Men's primary function has never been to save the world and beyond from all manner of superhuman/extraterrestial threat. To that end, blaming the Avengers/Cap or claiming every time they weren't in a story equates to them "not caring" is as stupid as doing the same to the X-Men for every story or threat where they weren't present.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
The Avengers has mutants on the roster and have even defended them to the press multiple times. How many humans are X-Men?

We're not going to see eye-to-eye on this one anytime soon.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
And yeah, it's convenient that people like to argue "Cap's done nothing for mutants!" when he's personally vouched for and supported two former criminals - the children of the most infamous terrorist on the planet - into becoming members of the premier superhero team on the planet.