Defense of Marriage Act 'Struck Down 5-4' By Supreme Court

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
No, you've got that backward.

Robtard made up what he felt was an absurdly offensive view about black people as a parallel to Cyner's views on homosexuality. Cyner then said in effect "yes, this is what I believe".

Based on Cyner's response, he clearly does not think like that of all black people (which is what I am talking about in that post I quoted).

Originally posted by Oliver North
Rob made the mistake of saying "culture" and not "people", the latter being closer to what Cyner said anyways. He didn't say he didn't like gay culture, he said he didn't like gay people.

I think he's just trolling. There is no way he can dislike all gay people...

I mean, there are some gay people who are more conservatardish than than most Oklahoman's. 🙂

Originally posted by Oliver North
I am aware that people see the world through subjective lenses, yes

Or that some people confuse a small group of the scientific community and paint them as representative of the majority...

All straight men in America will now be required, by law, to enter homosexual marriages. Have fun, you guys!

the proper term is Oklahomen, you racist.

Originally posted by Oliver North
ok, cool, I should clarify here then, because while I do think you are factually incorrect and lack even a pop-science level understanding of the concepts you brought up, my position is not actually that you are misguided.

I think you are a bad person. I think what you believe is evil and deliberately harmful to people who you callously admit to disliking because they are different. I think you bring up nonsense to defend this position because of your own fear of being anally penetrated, or possibly your fear of the fact you want to be anally penetrated. EDIT: In this way you aren't misguided, because your beliefs don't come from simply being mistaken, but are a deliberate way of justifying hate.

I have no choice but to believe your friend has pitiable levels of self-loathing if he would put up with what you must think of him and say in conversation, or, I would have no choice if I thought this friend actually existed.

When did I say I disliked the people? I dislike homosexuality, just as I dislike selfishness or some other personality trait. I view it as a bad thing that should not be promoted, however that doesn't in any way mean I dislike the people who are engaged in it. Especially since it doesn't affect me.

I think it's amusing that you're trying to find some fear or secret desire, that because I don't see the world the way you do that it's due to fear.

You demonize me and imagine me to be some horrible person, I'm just another person with a different opinion than you.

My friend is not self loathing at all, and I would never insult him. Like I said, it's an understanding that works, it works because despite disagreements or opinions we respect each other as humans.

Until you can understand that, I suppose you'll always think of someone like me as a horrible person filled with hate who obviously fears or secretly desires whatever it is I disagree with. Maybe step out of your echo chamber for a while and get to know the people you demonize, it'll do you some good.

Originally posted by dadudemon
I think he's just trolling. There is no way he can dislike all gay people...

I mean, there are some gay people who are more conservatardish than than most Oklahoman's. 🙂

I'm literally just quoting him, and have no interest to try and white knight a bigot

Originally posted by dadudemon
Or that some people confuse a small group of the scientific community and paint them as representative of the majority...

sure... to be fair, I haven't actually attacked Cyner on a scientific ground. I think that conversation is too nuanced for his level of understanding of the issue. I've simply pointed out that I feel what he says is morally reprehensible, and if he feels that way about me, I'd wear it as a ****ing badge.

Originally posted by Cyner
When did I say I disliked the people? I dislike homosexuality, just as I dislike selfishness or some other personality trait. I view it as a bad thing that should not be promoted, however that doesn't in any way mean I dislike the people who are engaged in it. Especially since it doesn't affect me.

I don't hate black people, just the quality of dark skin. I don't hate women, just the quality of having a vagina.

ya man, you erudite you... boy do I feel like I misjudged your intellect on this one

Originally posted by Cyner
Until you can understand that, I suppose you'll always think of someone like me as a horrible person filled with hate

phew, got my point across that time 🙂

Originally posted by Cyner
When did I say I disliked the people? I dislike homosexuality, just as I dislike selfishness or some other personality trait. I view it as a bad thing that should not be promoted, however that doesn't in any way mean I dislike the people who are engaged in it.

You don't mind if your friend are assholes? Really?

Originally posted by Cyner
despite disagreements or opinions we respect each other as humans.

Except that you don't.

Originally posted by Oliver North
I don't hate black people, just the quality of dark skin. I don't hate women, just the quality of having a vagina.

You seriously have a problem here. Disliking parts of a culture is not disliking a people. Have you ever felt that you disliked parts of your own culture? I sure have. Do I hate all hispanics? By your logic I certainly do.

Originally posted by Cyner
When did I say I disliked the people? I dislike homosexuality,

When you said:

"Even if I don't like them." -Cyner

Originally posted by Cyner
You seriously have a problem here. Disliking parts of a culture is not disliking a people. Have you ever felt that you disliked parts of your own culture? I sure have. Do I hate all hispanics? By your logic I certainly do.

you've said nothing about gay culture

you talked about homosexuality as a personality trait, ie, the quality of being a homosexual, and you have several times said homosexuals directly.

I don't hate a person; I simply hate their behaviours, their thoughts, their desires, the things they identify with, their life choices, the relationships they build, and the world they wish to live in.

But I don't hate the person, how could you possibly suggest that?

Originally posted by Oliver North
you've said nothing about gay culture

you talked about homosexuality as a personality trait, ie, the quality of being a homosexual, and you have several times said homosexuals directly.

Well at least robtard is correct about what I've typed, but what I should have said there was "Even if I don't like what they do"

Sexual preference does not make a person, and if you think I'd hate someone for something like that then you're absolutely wrong. I do not however like some of the things that arise from some parts of what has become homosexual culture.

no, you are totally correct, how could I possibly confuse your dislike for a person's behaviours and cognitions for your dislike of that person?

you still love their soul, the person they are that doesn't have a hormone imbalance or trauma that caused them to be homosexual, you know, the real them that is different from the person they are.

Originally posted by Cyner
Well at least robtard is correct about what I've typed, but what I should have said there was "Even if I don't like what they do"

Sexual preference does not make a person, and if you think I'd hate someone for something like that then you're absolutely wrong. I do not however like some of the things that arise from some parts of what has become homosexual culture.

Is it the buttsex?

Which parts/what exactly is it that you do not like about 'homosexual culture'?

ini, would you say that (based on your best understanding) homosexuality is something like how certain people prefer chocolate ice cream over vanilla ice cream, or is it something deeper than that?

Originally posted by Oliver North
no, you are totally correct, how could I possibly confuse your dislike for a person's behaviours and cognitions for your dislike of that person?

you still love their soul, the person they are that doesn't have a hormone imbalance or trauma that caused them to be homosexual, you know, the real them that is different from the person they are.

Originally posted by Cyner
Sexual preference does not make a person, and if you think I'd hate someone for something like that then you're absolutely wrong. I do not however like some of the things that arise from some parts of what has become homosexual culture.

I think you are now mischaracterizing Cyner's position, on purpose. My sexuality does not define me. There are many many many more things about me that define me than just my sexuality. That should be the same for most people.

If you have a friend that you like everything about them, I say you found your soul-mate. If there are things you don't like about your friends, I'd say you're normal.

Originally posted by dadudemon
I think you are now mischaracterizing Cyner's position, on purpose. My sexuality does not define me. There are many many many more things about me that define me than just my sexuality. That should be the same for most people.

If you have a friend that you like everything about them, I say you found your soul-mate. If there are things you don't like about your friends, I'd say you're normal.

The colorful dress of the more campy ones? The annoying poems of Frank O'Hara?

Originally posted by Omega Vision
ini, would you say that (based on your best understanding) homosexuality is something like how certain people prefer chocolate ice cream over vanilla ice cream, or is it something deeper than that?

the biological mechanism is probably different, like, the gustatory nucleus in the brainstem probably doesn't play a huge role in sexual preference, but at a less reductive level, ya, that's almost exactly how I would describe it.

something like being transgender might be more complex based on stuff that I have read (the "body-map" matching a different gender than the body [transgenderism =/= homosexuality, obviously]), but strictly in terms of sexual preference it would be the same as any preference.

So like, my preference for abstract over realist art is not the same as my preference for root beer over cola at the most reductive levels and may originate for a variety of different reasons, but I don't think there is any major difference between those "types" of preferences in general, and I would say the same about homosexuality. It will have causes and mechanisms that makes it different, but at the most relevant social level, it is just a preference for one thing over another.

Originally posted by dadudemon
I think you are now mischaracterizing Cyner's position, on purpose. My sexuality does not define me. There are many many many more things about me that define me than just my sexuality. That should be the same for most people.

If you have a friend that you like everything about them, I say you found your soul-mate. If there are things you don't like about your friends, I'd say you're normal.

go back through the thread and quote another post where Cyner has said anything remotely close to that...

it seems like he is backpedaling because he was called out on bigotry. That, or he mischaracterized himself in the first place.

also, if Cyner is only ok with homosexuals for whom that isn't a major part of their self-identity, I'd say that is almost identical to being a homophobe. It'd be like saying "I don't hate the black people who I don't have to look at".

Originally posted by Oliver North
the biological mechanism is probably different, like, the gustatory nucleus in the brainstem probably doesn't play a huge role in sexual preference, but at a less reductive level, ya, that's almost exactly how I would describe it.

something like being transgender might be more complex based on stuff that I have read (the "body-map" matching a different gender than the body [transgenderism =/= homosexuality, obviously]), but strictly in terms of sexual preference it would be the same as any preference.

So like, my preference for abstract over realist art is not the same as my preference for root beer over cola at the most reductive levels and may originate for a variety of different reasons, but I don't think there is any major difference between those "types" of preferences in general, and I would say the same about homosexuality. It will have causes and mechanisms that makes it different, but at the most relevant social level, it is just a preference for one thing over another.