Originally posted by h1a8
I did counter you since you failed to answer the question.
We don't treat these fights as how they would go down in a comicbook.
This is a forum fight and not a comic one.
We use full capacity here.
We don't use the level of CBR but characters do fight at the best of their ability. There is no writer here to ignore a character's abilities or powers for the sake of the plot.
I'll put it really simply for you. You don't get to decide Wonder Woman was depowered in fights. That's not how things work. If you think it's PIS, call it that but making such decisions is ridiculous. And using it as evidence of her abilities in a human body is even more ridiculous.
You still haven't provided a single piece of evidence that proves Wonder Woman is a class A fighter. Besides claiming being the greatest warrior in your land is enough. Then again you think Hercules is a class C fighter despite being the greatest warrior in Olympus so that's clearly not a sign of ridiculous bias. 😬
Batman has outfought a full powered WW on a couple occasions. One where she was actually bad too.
And she usually has to resort to some form of super strength to overcome him.
She is not in Batman's class of fighter or anywhere near it. Can you imagine Batman with WW's strength? He would not get outfought by a human Batman to say the least.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusShe is class A because of how she fights (her technique and smoothness of application). Fighting ability is subjective and not quantifiable; those with experience are the better judges of it.
I'll put it really simply for you. You don't get to decide Wonder Woman was depowered in fights. That's not how things work. If you think it's PIS, call it that but making such decisions is ridiculous. And using it as evidence of her abilities in a human body is even more ridiculous.You still haven't provided a single piece of evidence that proves Wonder Woman is a class A fighter. Besides claiming being the greatest warrior in your land is enough. Then again you think Hercules is a class C fighter despite being the greatest warrior in Olympus so that's clearly not a sign of ridiculous bias. 😬
So either WW threw a 1 million ton punch or more and a human blocked it
or she threw a human strength level punch and a human blocked it. There is no in-between.
If you say the former then it is silly since no human can exert millions of tons of force (not even in comics).
If you say the latter then it is also silly (but more acceptable) since writer's have written character's power levels down many times.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Holding back =/= actually switching off one's powers.
If you're holding back to entirely human level, what's the difference? She shows none of her reaction speed, physical speed, muscle, etc. when sparing, and her foes fight her with techniques that only work on human-level foes and they can work.
Sure, she can reactivate in an instant, but they're still not in the fight in any sense.
Originally posted by Branlow Swift
And she usually has to resort to some form of super strength to overcome him.She is not in Batman's class of fighter or anywhere near it. Can you imagine Batman with WW's strength?
Except when they actually spar, when they're near dead equal...
In Hikateria and League of One, when she does want him down and uses powers, she stomps him. Multiple times in the former.
Originally posted by Q99
If you're holding back to entirely human level, what's the difference? She shows none of her reaction speed, physical speed, muscle, etc. when sparing, and her foes fight her with techniques that only work on human-level foes and they can work.Sure, she can reactivate in an instant, but they're still not in the fight in any sense.
[quote="Branlow Swift"]
And she usually has to resort to some form of super strength to overcome him.She is not in Batman's class of fighter or anywhere near it. Can you imagine Batman with WW's strength?
Except when they actually spar, when they're near dead equal...
In Hikateria and League of One, when she does want him down and uses powers, she stomps him. Multiple times in the former. [/QUOTE]
So you're saying she can consciously shut off her entire powerset?
Originally posted by Q99
Effectively, yes. In the opinions of Black Canary and Batman, yes. Enough so that they feel they can win or lose to her fairly.
Prove it.
Black Canary made it explicitly clear if Wonder Woman cut loose with a portion of her power, she could stomp her. That indicates that Diana was holding back, which is logical. That however in no way indicates that Diana can effectively shut off her powers. What a ridiculous leap in logic.
What Batman scene are you referring to?
Originally posted by h1a8
She is class A because of how she fights (her technique and smoothness of application). Fighting ability is subjective and not quantifiable; those with experience are the better judges of it.So either WW threw a 1 million ton punch or more and a human blocked it
or she threw a human strength level punch and a human blocked it. There is no in-between.If you say the former then it is silly since no human can exert millions of tons of force (not even in comics).
If you say the latter then it is also silly (but more acceptable) since writer's have written character's power levels down many times.
You aren't even providing evidence at this point. She's a class A fighter because of the way she moves? Just silly.
Martial artists are constantly able to hang with superhumans because of their skill. There's a reason why Karate Kid can do what he does or why Captain America or Batman do what they do. And it's the reason why I find the idea of her being a class A fighter just straight up laughable.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Wonder Woman did fight FTL in WW 219. That whole fight happened in 1 minute 53 seconds.
No it wasn't. Max Lord started recording the fight when they made it to the sun...midway during the time they were at the sun. He start recording when Superman arm reached back to punch WW back to Earth.
Originally posted by Zack Fair
What are people trying to get across? That WW isn't that skilled because she can shut off her durability?
No, we are saying that evidence that she is highly skilled based on sparing with individuals she is millions of times stronger than, millions of times faster than and millions of times more durable than are completely and utterly invalid. And no, there is no evidence she can shut off her durability.
Originally posted by Zack Fair
That was supposed to be a can't, my bad.So what was the the point of the writer having WW spar the likes of Black Canary?
Completely invalid is too much IMHO.
That's a GREAT question. There's no other way to say it, it's stupidity. This is not like She Hulk learning combat techniques from Captain America. She is physically strong and fast because of her muscles, but she doesn't have upper level super speed and "god" attributes like Diana supposedly has. It would completely pointless if it was even possible for her to spar with a human.
Originally posted by carver9
No it wasn't. Max Lord started recording the fight when they made it to the sun...midway during the time they were at the sun. He start recording when Superman arm reached back to punch WW back to Earth.
Where did the recording start carter? Its actually 1 minute and 26 seconds from earth to sun and back.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
You aren't even providing evidence at this point. She's a class A fighter because of the way she moves? Just silly.Martial artists are constantly able to hang with superhumans because of their skill. There's a reason why Karate Kid can do what he does or why Captain America or Batman do what they do. And it's the reason why I find the idea of her being a class A fighter just straight up laughable.
See the problem here is that you don't understand that it is evidence. The way she moves, her technique, smoothness, decision making, etc. These are are subjective things that an experienced fighter can pick up on.
Being able to hang with a superhuman (while being human) isn't the only way to gauge whether a character is class A. She's superhuman so that can't apply to her.