Proxima Midnight vs Wonder Woman

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Lol. I can accept Thanks sending someone to lead an Earth invasion by a Black Panther level character, and that person failing.

Oh wait, he totally did.

Give Cage a weapon that's fatal to most creatures, and can move likethe spear.....and he can.

Taking SSpectrum down is no mean feat.....for a meta tier. For a herald? Its bread and butter. Especially if you have a one shot kill weapon. Like PM's spear.

Or a lasso that, once wrapped around you, compels you to obey that person's every whim.

So.....the lasso and bracelets are insta win items that work in every case? That's the narrative.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
So.....the lasso and bracelets are insta win items that work in every case? That's the narrative.

In a forum fight, why wouldn't she use them?

I am sure you have proof, in canon, of the lasso being broken/resisting WW's commands? And that these instances are something that PM can replicate?

On top of this, is there proof of the bracelets failing to block something? And again, would PM be able to replicate this?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
In a forum fight, why wouldn't she use them?

I am sure you have proof, in canon, of the lasso being broken/resisting WW's commands? And that these instances are something that PM can replicate?

On top of this, is there proof of the bracelets failing to block something? And again, would PM be able to replicate this?

I think the question is, are there examples of her failing to block/utilize her bracelets. If she's ever been hit, shot, or otherwise peirced, she either didn't use her bracelets or they failed. Same with the lasso. Does every battle end with her making her opponents succumb to her will? If not, then the lasso and bracelets are not insta win items and should not be portrayed as such.

But then, how can you not then chalk it up to PIS? Same reason why Flash gets hit, or Superman doesn't use his speed, or Hulk doesn't thunderclap with dimension destroying claps every comic fight?

Guess my point that I'm trying to make is, is WW faster than PM? PM's fight in Wakanda suggests so.

Is WW faster than PM's SPEAR? She's tagged Spectrum with it, but that's the only high showing of its speed. Would you then say Spectrum is slow? Or the spear is that fast?

If it IS that fast, is it faster than Darkseid's Omega Beam? Because I view that as an insta kill light speed attack as well, and she blocks it just fine.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But then, how can you not then chalk it up to PIS? Same reason why Flash gets hit, or Superman doesn't use his speed, or Hulk doesn't thunderclap with dimension destroying claps every comic fight?

Guess my point that I'm trying to make is, is WW faster than PM? PM's fight in Wakanda suggests so.

Is WW faster than PM's SPEAR? She's tagged Spectrum with it, but that's the only high showing of its speed. Would you then say Spectrum is slow? Or the spear is that fast?

If it IS that fast, is it faster than Darkseid's Omega Beam? Because I view that as an insta kill light speed attack as well, and she blocks it just fine.

Well, first of all, we only have this one PM showing. Our knowledge of her is limited, whereas Wonderwoman has been going strong since the Jurassic period. Now, the spear attack is being underplayed. Catching Monica is a BIG deal. Throwing it to that effect is a BIG deal. I personally think that the fact the spears could damage a light based being is a big deal. I would not have thought it, so to say that WW will DEFINITELY be able to complete thwart the attack is a big of an assumption. She might. I've never viewed the Omega beans as moving anywhere near light speed. It was once depicted in a cartoon as beams that simply track around corners to the target at a slow pace for light beams. Also, while there is no evidence PM fought at high speeds, the fact that she could see Monica in light form and throw her spears well enought to tag her suggests she can at least perceive super speed. I don't think speed would be a factor in the fight in terms of giving WW some huge advantage.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Well, first of all, we only have this one PM showing. Our knowledge of her is limited, whereas Wonderwoman has been going strong since the Jurassic period. Now, the spear attack is being underplayed. Catching Monica is a BIG deal. Throwing it to that effect is a BIG deal. I personally think that the fact the spears could damage a light based being is a big deal. I would not have thought it, so to say that WW will DEFINITELY be able to complete thwart the attack is a big of an assumption. She might. I've never viewed the Omega beans as moving anywhere near light speed. It was once depicted in a cartoon as beams that simply track around corners to the target at a slow pace for light beams. Also, while there is no evidence PM fought at high speeds, the fact that she could see Monica in light form and throw her spears well enought to tag her suggests she can at least perceive super speed. I don't think speed would be a factor in the fight in terms of giving WW some huge advantage.

So...in other words, this could be a lowballing of Spectrum. Especially considering, when she threw it at Shuri, a random Wakandan soldier was able to register it was a threat to the queen, shout and scream, and throw his entire body in front of it.

Cartoons aren't canon, not sure why you brought it up to support your viewpoint.

WW at this point

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So...in other words, this could be a lowballing of Spectrum. Especially considering, when she threw it at Shuri, a random Wakandan soldier was able to register it was a threat to the queen, shout and scream, and throw his entire body in front of it.

Cartoons aren't canon, not sure why you brought it up to support your viewpoint.

I never say it was cannon or treated it as it was. Comic panels don't move, they are still pictures. We have to deduce the movement because we can't see it. I think it is relevant how DC depicted the movement of the Omega beams in the cartoon. They tracked the target, but not any thing near light speed.

A lowballing of Spectrum? I didn't see it as such. I saw it as the spears accelerating to the speed of the target. That's the only way they could have caught up to Monica, unless for some inexplicable reason, Moncia decided to slow down and let the spears hit her.

Hahaha, using cartoons to determine the speed?

crylaugh

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I never say it was cannon or treated it as it was. Comic panels don't move, they are still pictures. We have to deduce the movement because we can't see it. I think it is relevant how DC depicted the movement of the Omega beams in the cartoon. They tracked the target, but not any thing near light speed.

A lowballing of Spectrum? I didn't see it as such. I saw it as the spears accelerating to the speed of the target. That's the only way they could have caught up to Monica, unless for some inexplicable reason, Moncia decided to slow down and let the spears hit her.

So that would mean over short distances, a regular human (well, a well trained elite Wakandan soldier, but still human) is able to outreact the spear by a fair margin?

If they were slow-moving, do you think Flash would be so panicked? Flash, who has never been tagged before and is cocksure of his speed?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So that would mean over short distances, a regular human (well, a well trained elite Wakandan soldier, but still human) is able to outreact the spear by a fair margin?

If they were slow-moving, do you think Flash would be so panicked? Flash, who has never been tagged before and is cocksure of his speed?

I think the Flash would have to move to buy time against them the same way Batman would. Like PM's spears, I think they gain on the target. And please note, I did not say they were "slow moving."

Let me ask you this. Did the Omega Beams or the spears appear to strike either target instantaneously? They certainly are not moving at light speed from the onset.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I think the Flash would have to move to buy time against them the same way Batman would. Like PM's spears, I think they gain on the target. And please note, I did not say they were "slow moving."

Let me ask you this. Did the Omega Beams or the spears appear to strike either target instantaneously? They certainly are not moving at light speed from the onset.

True, you said 'slow-moving for light beams'. Not sure what that would mean - light's pretty fast, after all. Even 10% of the speed of light is stupidly fast.

And your point is valid - neither Omega Beams nor spears are insta hit weapons. Time and time again, if they weren't shot at you in the back (like Spectrum with the spears, or Superman with the Omega Beams) you can block and/or dodge them. That is to say, if you can see them, you can react to them (see Wakandan soldier, Flash etc).

Which brings me back to my point, that WW can block and/or deflect PM's main (only?) weapon. A caveat, now that you have brought it up - if PM throws it when WW's back is turned in a sneak attack, and she cannot see it, then yes, it can harm her.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
True, you said 'slow-moving for light beams'. Not sure what that would mean - light's pretty fast, after all. Even 10% of the speed of light is stupidly fast.

And your point is valid - neither Omega Beams nor spears are insta hit weapons. Time and time again, if they weren't shot at you in the back (like Spectrum with the spears, or Superman with the Omega Beams) you can block and/or dodge them. That is to say, if you can see them, you can react to them (see Wakandan soldier, Flash etc).

Which brings me back to my point, that WW can block and/or deflect PM's main (only?) weapon. A caveat, now that you have brought it up - if PM throws it when WW's back is turned in a sneak attack, and she cannot see it, then yes, it can harm her.

I also argued that potentially, they could "occupy" her and make her vulnerable to other attacks, also Cap throwing his shield and following up with a blitz as the opponent is distracted blocking the shield, but at a much higher magnitude.

She truly does not seem that fast (PM, that is). After the first hits on Cage, HE was blitzing HER (or at least, punching her without any defence from her). Plus, again, Wakandan soldiers outreacted her, and Shuri speared her with a normal spear.

I've just never seen PM fight at a speed which could be described as a blitz.

Whereas WW is more than capable of dealing with attacks coming from different directions:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3237760-ww-13-13.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3237761-ww-13-19.jpg

Darkseid's beams up close:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3241173-jl6-3.jpg

And Pandora's bullets, which are capable of hurting even Phantom Stranger:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3241332-justice+league+%282011-%29+022-012.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3241333-justice+league+%282011-%29+022-013.jpg

Originally posted by abhilegend
Hahaha, using cartoons to determine the speed?

crylaugh

Don't Troll On Me

shutup

You're bringing it on yourself. Why bring cartoons up at all?

Originally posted by abhilegend
You're bringing it on yourself. Why bring cartoons up at all?

Nah, you are being a jerk wad all by yourself.

I explained why I brought it up to the person I was talking to. Run along.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Nah, you are being a jerk wad all by yourself.

I explained why I brought it up to the person I was talking to. Run along.

Bump.

And here I was, the only one saying Proxima had a chance because her spear was so dangerous.

🙂

But yea, current Wonder Woman gets taken outback and finger-banged. Pre-Flashpoint Diana might win but it would be a brutal fight imo because if she gets hit with that spear, it's over I think.

I was just about to bump this.